Nokia Lumia 920 unveiled

BeVonk! said:
My understanding is that Windows 8 phone/tablet apps will not be compatible with Windows 8 PC software. Two different types of Windows 8. If so, it will not offer a developer anything more enticing than Android.
Click to expand...
For tablet developers Android already offers very little that's enticing. I'd say Win8 is going to be a better bet than Android on tablets going forward just because MS has so much invested in making it succeed.
http://www.theverge.com/2012/9/5/3294425/googles-schmidt-late-to-tablets-1-3-million-activations
 
cerebus said:
For tablet developers Android already offers very little that's enticing. I'd say Win8 is going to be a better bet than Android on tablets going forward just because MS has so much invested in making it succeed.
http://www.theverge.com/2012/9/5/3294425/googles-schmidt-late-to-tablets-1-3-million-activations
Click to expand...

Well, I can say the same for Google investing heavily to make Android on tablets work. Nexus 7. Google is now serious about tablets and the Nexus 7 is the first real shot from their side ... and it is a runaway success thus far. Then Amazon is also investing in the Android tablet business and Amazon is going to become a bigger and bigger player in this industry. Google + Amazon = powerful investors in the Android tablet sphere. I therefore don't see Windows 8 just grabbing tablet market share away from Android and iOS. There is a huge emphasis on tablets from all sides now.
 
BeVonk! said:
Well, I can say the same for Google investing heavily to make Android on tablets work. Nexus 7. Google is now serious about tablets and the Nexus 7 is the first real shot from their side ... and it is a runaway success thus far. Then Amazon is also investing in the Android tablet business and Amazon is going to become a bigger and bigger player in this industry. Google + Amazon = powerful investors in the Android tablet sphere. I therefore don't see Windows 8 just grabbing tablet market share away from Android and iOS. There is a huge emphasis on tablets from all sides now.
Click to expand...

Nexus 7 was definitely what Google needed to do. The Kindle on the other hand... that's just a massive headache for them. It's not even recognizably Android. But even Nexus, great as it indisputably is, isn't built for app developers - it's designed as a direct portal to Google's ecosystem just like the Kindle Fire is. The distinct lack of success of any tablet other than Google's own, or Amazon's odd hybrid, means that manufacturers aren't putting their best hardware into Android tablets (look at Note 10.1's miserable showing). Win8 has a huge showing already of diversity of designs.

Anyway it waits to be seen, I'm very curious.
 
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My understanding at this stage is that MS is going to "lock down" Windows 8 on tablets/phones ... ie it will not be as open as Android. That will always be a major factor keeping me on the Android side. I want/need/demand freedom on my devices to sideload whatever I want where and when I want (into a file system Icontrol). Any ecosystem that will prevent me from doing so will not work for me. As users become more used to these type of devices they will demand more control and I cannot see Apple or MS giving in to such demands. My Galaxy 10.1 is purring like a happy cat running ICS (Sammie, surprisingly, did a great job with the software for a change) ... so I have no reason in the world to change. Those now jumping at the Nexus 7 will also not want to give up the freedom they now will learn to appreciate.

I started off with iOS and the iPad was the greatest thing ever ... and Honeycomb sucked donkey balls. I hated my Galaxy 10.1 at first. All has changed in the mean time. I outgrew the iPad ... wanting more control ... and Android with ICS improved with leaps and bounds.
 
BeVonk! said:
My understanding is that Windows 8 phone/tablet apps will not be compatible with Windows 8 PC software. Two different types of Windows 8. If so, it will not offer a developer anything more enticing than Android.
Click to expand...

The technical side might matter for devs, and WP8 and Windows 8 will be sharing a ton of stuff making it very easy for the millions of Windows Devs to build for WP, but the bigger issue is one of getting the masses used to the metro look and way of doing things. Once the masses get used to it, and build up a list of loved Windows 8 apps and xbox branded games, it will be a lot easier for Microsoft to convince them to try Windows Phone. Until people build up a familiarity with metro, Microsoft simply has no chance convincing a lot of people to move away from ios and android because most have already invested quite a bit of cash in each ecosystem.
 
cerebus said:
Not to mention that even any WP7 apps that WERE developed now must be rewritten.
Click to expand...

This is totally incorrect. What is true is the relationship the other way round. It is WP8 apps that are not able to run on WP7.x devices. This is why there is a huge outcry about no upgrade to WP8 for current WP7.x devices.

If you had watched or read the Nokia press conference / launch event, you would have seen them demonstrating how a WP7 app works straight onto a new Lumia (WP8).
 
I hope the price is right, because the S3 has this licked (harware) before it even gets out of the starting block. By inference it means the Samsung W8 device will be better. For those getting exited about wireless charging and thinking Nokia is the first to implement it, think again, the S3 already has this. I don't know much about W8 so I will not speculate on the software side of things.
 
Just saw the 920 supports LTE across the 800/900/1800/2100/2600 ranges. Do any of our Mobile networks indicated what their 4G network ranges may be?
 
BeVonk! said:
Well, I can say the same for Google investing heavily to make Android on tablets work. Nexus 7. Google is now serious about tablets and the Nexus 7 is the first real shot from their side ... and it is a runaway success thus far. Then Amazon is also investing in the Android tablet business and Amazon is going to become a bigger and bigger player in this industry. Google + Amazon = powerful investors in the Android tablet sphere. I therefore don't see Windows 8 just grabbing tablet market share away from Android and iOS. There is a huge emphasis on tablets from all sides now.
Click to expand...

Do me a favor, read this article here
- Windows 8 is a No Compromise Ecosystem and this one
- The End of Android Tablets is Nigh
then come back with your revised opinion.
 
BeVonk! said:
My understanding at this stage is that MS is going to "lock down" Windows 8 on tablets/phones ... ie it will not be as open as Android. That will always be a major factor keeping me on the Android side. I want/need/demand freedom on my devices to sideload whatever I want where and when I want (into a file system Icontrol). Any ecosystem that will prevent me from doing so will not work for me. As users become more used to these type of devices they will demand more control and I cannot see Apple or MS giving in to such demands. My Galaxy 10.1 is purring like a happy cat running ICS (Sammie, surprisingly, did a great job with the software for a change) ... so I have no reason in the world to change. Those now jumping at the Nexus 7 will also not want to give up the freedom they now will learn to appreciate.

I started off with iOS and the iPad was the greatest thing ever ... and Honeycomb sucked donkey balls. I hated my Galaxy 10.1 at first. All has changed in the mean time. I outgrew the iPad ... wanting more control ... and Android with ICS improved with leaps and bounds.
Click to expand...

It's meant to be a Nokia thread and we're debating Android vs Win8 lol. Oh well at least it's a civil debate.

There's no doubt that Win8 will be more strictly locked than Android. But it might also be more powerful, from the POV of running full native MS software. I think historically, 'openness' of software has some saleability but in a limited, fragmentary long-tail kind of way (look at the situation with Linux for instance). 'Most' people don't really care much for it, versus other factors like quality of hardware, attractiveness of UI, and most crucially apps. Hoping that people will learn to appreciate openness - well - you can just keep hoping for that, IMO - people just don't value it very highly as it just means more mucking about in Settings.
 
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McCrazieGoalz said:
This is totally incorrect. What is true is the relationship the other way round. It is WP8 apps that are not able to run on WP7.x devices. This is why there is a huge outcry about no upgrade to WP8 for current WP7.x devices.

If you had watched or read the Nokia press conference / launch event, you would have seen them demonstrating how a WP7 app works straight onto a new Lumia (WP8).
Click to expand...

I heartily beg forgiveness. ;)
 
Zyzzyva said:
Once the masses get used to it, and build up a list of loved Windows 8 apps and xbox branded games, it will be a lot easier for Microsoft to convince them to try Windows Phone. Until people build up a familiarity with metro, Microsoft simply has no chance convincing a lot of people to move away from ios and android because most have already invested quite a bit of cash in each ecosystem.
Click to expand...

Fully agree with you, that is the reason why Microsoft wants to only launch these phones once Windows 8 is commercially available. Once everyone is using the new interface on their laptops and PC`s it will be a lot easier to get them to use it on their phones and tablets (basically how Apple started off with its popular Ipod and had people move to the Iphone and then the Ipad)

I will wait to test one out in a store and see how it feels, I'm not a fan of the big screens but i might get use to it.
 
cerebus said:
There's no doubt that Win8 will be more strictly locked than Android.
I think historically, 'openness' of software has some saleability but in a limited, fragmentary long-tail kind of way (look at the situation with Linux for instance). People just don't value it very highly.
Click to expand...

Further, while Android is not a locked OS, that might actually be its achillies heal. Not being locked means it is far much easier to hack. One tech journo (or was it an app developer) once wrote a detailed article of how useless it is for app developers to write apps for Android. This is because in a short amount of time, it becomes useless to charge for your app because it is so hacked it is free anyway even if you charge for it. The commentator was saying in a nutshell that Android is developed for hackers.

In contrast, Windows is the most secure OS.
 
McCrazieGoalz said:
Further, while Android is not a locked OS, that might actually be its achillies heal. Not being locked means it is far much easier to hack. One tech journo (or was it an app developer) once wrote a detailed article of how useless it is for app developers to write apps for Android. This is because in a short amount of time, it becomes useless to charge for your app because it is so hacked it is free anyway even if you charge for it. The commentator was saying in a nutshell that Android is developed for hackers.

In contrast, Windows is the most secure OS.
Click to expand...

Most secure, but dont they charge developers to develop apps?

I dont see why any developer would pay money, to develop an app for a small market share.

Unless Microsoft can think of ways to draw in more devs to increase their app database, the lack of apps is still a big hurdle for them

I like WP7 though, just wish they have more apps.
And I love android, becoz of the free aps
And I dig IOS, becoz I got one for free (iphone 4S) XD
 
They already pay through the backside to Microsoft on licensing fees through Android. There's nothing 'free' about devving on Android anymore. Believe it or not Apple aren't the world's only patent trolls lol. Just the others are less highly publicized.
 
Nameite said:
Most secure, but dont they charge developers to develop apps?
Click to expand...

No. Microsoft doesn't charge developers to develop apps.

What they do is charge a percentage for each app sold. They charge I think 33% of the selling price and use a sliding scale for larger sales with the lowest % charged being around 10% per app sale or something like that.

With each chargeable app being sold for not less than US$1.49, an app developer actually has a greater incentive for developing apps for Win8 because the developer will get at least US$1.00 for each paid for app. I am not sure how it works for Android and OS X.
 
McCrazieGoalz said:
Do me a favor, read this article here
- Windows 8 is a No Compromise Ecosystem and this one
- The End of Android Tablets is Nigh
then come back with your revised opinion.
Click to expand...

From the first article:

So how do I browse those files on this tablet? Even if I could figure out a way to open it on the iPad, there’s no native way to browse the file system. That compromise was made in the name of usability. Likewise, there’s no equivalent of File Explorer in the touch-centric Windows 8 environment. Files search on the Start screen doesn’t find files on removable drives. I can pick photo files from the Photos app, and browse for PDF files from the Reader app, but there’s no Windows 8 app that handles Word or Excel documents. Compromise.

But I can browse, copy, open, and manage files on that flash drive by going into File Explorer on the desktop. It’s not exactly touch-friendly, but I can get the job done with minimal frustration.

---

No file system on the device to move/copy files on the device's own memory = fail. I can do that on Android. On Android I have an on-device file manager that I can create folders, copy, paste, move, delete .... whatever. I can side-load and install stuff ... this article doesn't state that with Windows 8 I will be able to sideload install apps. With Android I can ... and not to be able to do so would be a compromise. So the "no compromise" MS talk is nonsense already.
 
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