O2 DOWN: UK mobile network crash

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Dave said:
GPS doesn’t require a data connection...
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Dave said:
I’ll tell you what, R100 to any charity (or you, if you need it) when you disprove the following statement;
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Well, technically your statement is false, given that GPS data needs to reach the device somehow.

So "GPS doesn’t require an active internet connection." would be the correct statement. ;)
 
Gordon_R said:
That's a completely willful misinterpretation of everything I have posted. I think your comprehension skills are as faulty as your logic.
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No it’s not, go back, read my post and then start reading all the Wikipedese you thought would make you look clever, even though not one iota refuted (or even was on topic) my statement.

You wanted to look clever and superior and ended up looking like a mug who knows how to use Wikipedia.
 
Totempole said:
Well, technically your statement is false, given that GPS data needs to reach the device somehow.

So "GPS doesn’t require an active internet connection." would be the correct statement. ;)
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True, that is much more accurate, I bow to your superior terminology ;).

Of course it’s only technically, as the topic was centred on the lack of an active data connection from the network causing google maps not to work.
 
Dave said:
No it’s not, go back, read my post and then start reading all the Wikipedese you thought would make you look clever, even though not one iota refuted (or even was on topic) my statement.

You wanted to look clever and superior and ended up looking like a mug who knows how to use Wikipedia.
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Geez dude, small man syndrome?

The guy did not say that GPS HAS to have a data connection but rather that, and bear with me in this one, that a lack of a data connection on a mobile phone's GPS CAN affect how functional it is.
The word "can" indicates the possibility of it.

And as someone who has written firmware for a vehicle tracking system, he's not wrong. A fast moving vehicle really, really struggles to pick up a GPS lock. Particularly in built up areas.
There's a reason that GPS fitness watches ask you to stay still why they're trying to obtain a position.

Now, I'm not saying aGPS won't work. Its relative usability does deteriorate without network coverage, however.
 
Messugga said:
Geez dude, small man syndrome?

The guy did not say that GPS HAS to have a data connection but rather that, and bear with me in this one, that a lack of a data connection on a mobile phone's GPS CAN affect how functional it is.
The word "can" indicates the possibility of it.

And as someone who has written firmware for a vehicle tracking system, he's not wrong. A fast moving vehicle really, really struggles to pick up a GPS lock. Particularly in built up areas.
There's a reason that GPS fitness watches ask you to stay still why they're trying to obtain a position.

Now, I'm not saying aGPS won't work. Its relative usability does deteriorate without network coverage, however.
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None of which refutes the statement that GPS does not require an (internet) data connection to work. Standard GPS simply requires a GPS connection.

He didn’t need to try and act smart and throw half a Wiki in answer to my post, and he needs to learn some humility, it’s that simple.

Now, little man, I’m going to get some sleep ;)
 
Messugga said:
Geez dude, small man syndrome?

The guy did not say that GPS HAS to have a data connection but rather that, and bear with me in this one, that a lack of a data connection on a mobile phone's GPS CAN affect how functional it is.
The word "can" indicates the possibility of it.

And as someone who has written firmware for a vehicle tracking system, he's not wrong. A fast moving vehicle really, really struggles to pick up a GPS lock. Particularly in built up areas.
There's a reason that GPS fitness watches ask you to stay still why they're trying to obtain a position.

Now, I'm not saying aGPS won't work. Its relative usability does deteriorate without network coverage, however.
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It's Dave, he will never believe anyone but himself. Even when he is wrong (which he mostly is on everything) he will just keep changing the goal posts.

Just put him on ignore like most people have done and move on. He really isn't worth responding to.
 
whatwhat said:
It's Dave, he will never believe anyone but himself. Even when he is wrong (which he mostly is on everything) he will just keep changing the goal posts.

Just put him on ignore like most people have done and move on. He really isn't worth responding to.
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Noted. He's acting super irrational en defensive for no reason that I can see...
 
Dave said:
None of which refutes the statement that GPS does not require an (internet) data connection to work. Standard GPS simply requires a GPS connection.

He didn’t need to try and act smart and throw half a Wiki in answer to my post, and he needs to learn some humility, it’s that simple.

Now, little man, I’m going to get some sleep ;)
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duty_calls.png
 
I see mobile operators in the UK care as little about their customers as the ones in SA do: https://www.bbc.com/news/business-46481797

Mobile operator O2 has said it will compensate its customers following a day of disruption to its data networks.

Customers with a monthly subscription will be refunded the cost of two days' service by the end of January.

Pay As You Go customers will get 10% extra when they top up their phone in the new year or 10% off when they buy data for mobile broadband devices.
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Hamish McPanji said:
You want them to give a month free, or something? Am sure the outage is already covered in their t&c or service targets.

A 24 hour down period in a year is still like 99.7% up
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A bit of context on why downtime has a disproportionate effect on a highly connected modern society: https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-46488969

The outage at the O2 network lasted for nearly 24 hours and served to underline how dependent we have become on being connected while on the move.

A few years ago this incident would have been a minor annoyance to the small number of smartphone users.

But average monthly mobile data use has increased twenty-fold in the UK since 2011, with phone owners using them for everything from streaming music to ordering taxis and takeaways.
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For the increasing number of people and businesses that depend on mobile apps to organise their work, this was more than an inconvenience - it cost them money.

Deliveroo couriers and Uber drivers could not work if they used O2. The information system at London bus stops was out of action, and a care agency that despatched staff to people's homes via an app reported that the outage "brought our company to a halt".
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Gordon_R said:
A bit of context on why downtime has a disproportionate effect on a highly connected modern society: https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-46488969
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You have no argument with me there. We run a vehicle tracking system with thousands of GSM devices. The cost to our business for downtime is substantial.

But you can't expect a service provider who you pay £10 a month per sim to give you 5 months free service for 1 day of downtime, even if the downtime cost you £200
 
Hamish McPanji said:
You have no argument with me there. We run a vehicle tracking system with thousands of GSM devices. The cost to our business for downtime is substantial.

But you can't expect a service provider who you pay £10 a month per sim to give you 5 months free service for 1 day of downtime, even if the downtime cost you £200
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Consumers have no expectation of compensation under the terms of the contract, I expect anyone actually on a business account (which won’t be Uber drivers or care assistants on giffgaff) will be getting a more personal review of losses.

How stupid are those Uber drivers though, it’s virtually a zero cost to have a second sim as a back up, stick £10 on a Three sim and you carry on working...
 
Normal GPS doesn't require data. I've had three standalone units and not one of them needed data.
You put it on you wait a few seconds it gets a lock by triangulating and then you go it adjusts as you drive. I keep a standalone for long trips and it's never let me down yet.
 
Lupus said:
Normal GPS doesn't require data. I've had three standalone units and not one of them needed data.
You put it on you wait a few seconds it gets a lock by triangulating and then you go it adjusts as you drive. I keep a standalone for long trips and it's never let me down yet.
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It’s one thing for the driver of a vehicle to know where he is, but it’s quite another for the company tracking him.
 
Spizz said:
It’s one thing for the driver of a vehicle to know where he is, but it’s quite another for the company tracking him.
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That still doesn't need data. GPS tracking uses the same tech as standalone gps devices. A-GPS uses data to assist the GPS.
 
Is there some type of external forces that is causing this, something we are not being told about?
 
Lupus said:
That still doesn't need data. GPS tracking uses the same tech as standalone gps devices. A-GPS uses data to assist the GPS.
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Did you read the previous comment? How do you think the position recorded by the GPS receiver is communicated back to the control center doing the tracking?

Hamish McPanji said:
You have no argument with me there. We run a vehicle tracking system with thousands of GSM devices. The cost to our business for downtime is substantial.
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