Sars under siege

MagicDude4Eva said:
Hore's clock was ticking as soon as he started to stick his fingers into other government departments. When the SARS COO started to interfere with Home Affairs it was clear that he will run into trouble. Then add all the favouritism/nepotism as part of the IT projects where only a select few (and some very incompetent/overcharging) service providers were involved, it is really obvious that it had to stop.

As much as Hore was instrumental with e-filing he was perceived by staff and suppliers as a ruthless executive who oftentimes put his own interests ahead of SARS (which become very apparent during his stints in 2012/2013).
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This
 
saturnz said:
I see queues outside ATMs, maybe towards the end of the month. The queues at SARS branch offices have grown in recent years, and they are not towards the end of the month, its everyday. If thats what modernisation aimed to accomplish then yes its been a success and Barry Hore deserves a huge bonus.
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To say that efiling is a failure is simply not true. Efiling serves millions very well. Where SARS fails greatly is with exception handling. Where things go wrong and no one knows what to do.

In this regard SARS failed by making Hore the Executive for Operations and Modernisation being a part of Operations. Hore should have been in control of modernisation but still subject to Operations and Legal inside SARS. A lot of systems have been built without due regard to operational and legal requirements.

It is good to see him go however I am concerned that this whole purge is much more sinister. Who was being spied upon? If it was enemies of Zuma nothing would have happened, obviously it was not.
 
Vrotappel said:
To say that efiling is a failure is simply not true. Efiling serves millions very well. Where SARS fails greatly is with exception handling. Where things go wrong and no one knows what to do.

In this regard SARS failed by making Hore the Executive for Operations and Modernisation being a part of Operations. Hore should have been in control of modernisation but still subject to Operations and Legal inside SARS. A lot of systems have been built without due regard to operational and legal requirements.

It is good to see him go however I am concerned that this whole purge is much more sinister. Who was being spied upon? If it was enemies of Zuma nothing would have happened, obviously it was not.
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Please quote the exact text where I said efiling is failing.
 
saturnz said:
Please quote the exact text where I said efiling is failing.
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don't let me get started how much of a failure this e-filing is ok. this wasn't thought out as carefully as you may think it was. I am going to give you a prime example of how it wasn't thought out properly and carefully.

I have just been involved in a huge fraud because some idiot SARS employee thought he was mighty clever using my practitioner number and handing out refunds to people left and right. this was unbeknown to me. this was not fiddly little bits of thousands of rands, we are talking millions. just to add insult to this all, this clown absconded when this all came out.

e-filing successful? yeah right, spin me another yarn. until i'm told my number is safe I will believe it is successful.
 
Celine said:
don't let me get started how much of a failure this e-filing is ok. this wasn't thought out as carefully as you may think it was. I am going to give you a prime example of how it wasn't thought out properly and carefully.

I have just been involved in a huge fraud because some idiot SARS employee thought he was mighty clever using my practitioner number and handing out refunds to people left and right. this was unbeknown to me. this was not fiddly little bits of thousands of rands, we are talking millions. just to add insult to this all, this clown absconded when this all came out.

e-filing successful? yeah right, spin me another yarn. until i'm told my number is safe I will believe it is successful.
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so one guy thinks I said efiling is a failure and another guy thinks I said its not, did any of you two actually read what I said?
 
The fraud committed via efiling is huge.

It still does not take away from the fact that millions can efile and get their assessments within seconds.

Surely Celine should have picked up this activity on her efiling page?
 
Modernisation? Really? All I know is I changed banking details... Submitted relevant docs through the e-filing site, only to be told I had to submit physical copies. E-filing forcing folk back into the branch is not a step forward in anyone's book.
 
greg0205 said:
Modernisation? Really? All I know is I changed banking details... Submitted relevant docs through the e-filing site, only to be told I had to submit physical copies. E-filing forcing folk back into the branch is not a step forward in anyone's book.
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Until someone changes your bank details to theirs online and take your tax refund.

Some things should be verified manually.
 
saturnz said:
I can't say I disagree with the purge, if you want to see how modernisation has failed, simply look at the queues outside any SARS branch, they have grown.

This executive rode the success of Pravin and become complacent under Oupa, they have to now go.
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As someone that worked on that modernization program for four years I have to tell you that you are talking crap. The project is far from a failure if you compare it to how and with what speed your tax was done in 2007 to what it is now.

And Barry Hore is an excellent leader. Him leaving SARS is a big loss IMHO.
 
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Offtopic, but lovely how the ruling party ignores stuff like buying South African, and imports T-Shirts from China.
Not like we don't have a local clothing industry that could have done the work or anything...

Go SA^HChina... grr.
 
saturnz said:
so one guy thinks I said efiling is a failure and another guy thinks I said its not, did any of you two actually read what I said?
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Since your Opel Monza car saga NO ONE take what you ever say Seriously. Just grow up in about twenty years time please!
 
Hamster said:
As someone that worked on that modernization program for four years I have to tell you that you are talking crap. The project is far from a failure if you compare it to how and with what speed your tax was done in 2007 to what it is now.

And Barry Hore is an excellent leader. Him leaving SARS is a big loss IMHO.
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you have no clue what you are talking about. there is a huge glitch in this system and I can verify this for you. if the taxpayer is not on your profile you do NOT know what is going on yet the practitioners number can be so easily used fraudulently making it look like the practitioner submitted the returns for a particular tax payer.
 
Celine said:
you have no clue what you are talking about. there is a huge glitch in this system and I can verify this for you. if the taxpayer is not on your profile you do NOT know what is going on yet the practitioners number can be so easily used fraudulently making it look like the practitioner submitted the returns for a particular tax payer.
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How does one glitch/bug in the system mean I have no clue what I'm talking about? And how is that an indicator of a failed program? Do most people not get paid within a day? Does the system not process your submission within a couple of seconds? Have we not plugged many loopholes? Is it not the most efficient gov institution? Do not more people than ever before pay tax?

Do you want go back to the paper based system - drop eFiling etc. all together? Go stand in queues or mail your tax form like in the good old days!

Being on the end user bitching part gives you a very narrow view of what's been done for you. You have no idea the influence this program has had on your daily life (and not all of it is tax related).

And as somebody that spent a considerable amount of my career on this stuff, sat through long nights because of SARS's draconian approach to timelines I take exception to an end user telling me I don't know what I'm talking about when all she does day after day is click a submit button on a screen.
 
I have to agree with Celine that there are some glitches within efiling. There are some improvements but they have gone backwards with many things. SARS does have feedback sessions with practitioners but they do not consider the input from practitioners who are working on efiling every day.

1. There is nothing preventing me from using a false practitioner number when submitting return.
2. The debit pull/credit push options for payments should have remained on for tax practitioners. I know they have problems with unpaid debit orders but if they really investigated it they would have found that this happens less with practitioners.
3. I remember a few years ago different returns were automatically loaded on your efiling profile and an email was sent to say that a new return is available. Now returns have to be requested. It's easy to miss requesting a return of you have 30+ clients on your profile as each client is different and would need different returns to be requested.
 
Hamster said:
... I take exception to an end user telling me I don't know what I'm talking about when all she does day after day is click a submit button on a screen.
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If that's what you think tax practitioners do all day then you have no idea what you talking about. All systems should be designed with the end user in mind.
 
signates said:
If that's what you think tax practitioners do all day then you have no idea what you talking about. All systems should be designed with the end user in mind.
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It was a heated response to a non-techie. And I cannot speak for eFiling or form user friendliness.

I'm not leaving looking for a flame war - from a technical point of view RSA is much better off.

And now for something more annoying - Christmas shopping
 
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