Sick leave definition

[SirFooK'nG]

She just needs to be diplomatic about it without causing damage to the employer / employee relationship. I can't see the company being able to legally wrangle their extreme sport terminology here at all. It wont fly in any CCMA dispute. But that is not the major concern here. She needs to take heed that the employer is unsatisfied with her recent sick days, she is now therefore on the "radar". The best she can do is try refrain from using the scooter until such time as she is more competent so as not hurt herself anymore. This in itself will serve as a "goodwill" gesture that would at the very least boost the employers confidence in her and their belief in her dedication to the company in question.

As for whoever posted that a company has no right to question a "Valid" sick note from a doctor... clearly you are wrong. A company does indeed have that right and can dismiss a sick note if it is justifiable.

 

[Other Pineapple Smurf]

Any absence due injury as a result of a voluntary activity, i.e. sport, extreme games, etc. does not qualify as sick leave and will be deducted from annual leave.

The company is taking a fat chance by using that clause. If they opted for the lack of sick leave days or the trend of sick leave days taken they MIGHT have had a better argument.

Reality is in a CCMA hearing they (CCMA) only care if the employer was and is consistent in enforcing this rule. But there is also too little information available from the OP and its all second hand to really make a call if the employer is unfair or not.

Personally as an employer, I would also have a problem with a staff member with this habit so early into her job. Not my problem how my staff get to work. I would (and we have) consulted an independent labourer consultant on what would be the best course of action as this damages the relationship between employee and employer.

But I in no way do I feel that clause is anyway right, a few months back a staff member broke her arm in a horse riding accident and was booked off for 5 weeks we opted to continue to pay her average salary (based on the previous 6 months) as 90% of her income is commission based even though our contract made no provision for this. Its called an accident for a reason.

 

[Other Pineapple Smurf]

...

As for whoever posted that a company has no right to question a "Valid" sick note from a doctor... clearly you are wrong. A company does indeed have that right and can dismiss a sick note if it is justifiable.

Yup, a fat urban myth that a sick note is top-secret. We once took on a staff member who was constantly sick and then pointed out that in her situation we were allowed to send her to our own doctor at our expense. She came clean that she was suffering from "Wingerd-griep". But we still used this during her disciplinary hearing (she also had other warnings) that led to her dismissal and was upheld by the CCMA.

 

[Celine]

actually the employer has every right in this instance to insist his employee gets to work safely. and in saying safely, i mean something that is not going to cause accidents i.e. in her case the scooter does not seem to be a safe form of transport for her and the employer has indentified this. the employer is also not responsible for her parking whatsoever. imagine if a company of 500 employees must ensure that all these employees have parking for their vehicles? some people really need to be realistic at times.

 

[Sonic2k]

Let's be honest here, many SA companies have a crap attitude.
I have personally had to go to work sick, made everyone else sick too, including the a$$h0le boss who denied me time off to recuperate, even with a doctor's note.

 

[RiaX]

Well before you run and gun with law how about just let her speak to her boss with an affidavit from the police explaining the accident and a doctors note to show proper injury.

No point making things bad with the boss on a new job it will just make her life difficult

if need be at a later stage take it up legally

 

[noxibox]

As for whoever posted that a company has no right to question a "Valid" sick note from a doctor... clearly you are wrong. A company does indeed have that right and can dismiss a sick note if it is justifiable.

They can question it, but if it is valid, i.e. a doctor issued it and stands by it, then at most the company can ask for a second opinion. If someone is off a lot they can look at incapacity, but that's hardly the case here - being off twice in six months. They also cannot simply question it because they feel like it, but must have good reason to be suspicious.

In fact this employer is breeding a hostile attitude. Employees see the company's view of their employees in ridiculous policies like this and it can only come back to bite the employer.

Yup, a fat urban myth that a sick note is top-secret.

It is in fact top secret. The employee's medical details do have to be kept confidential. Their medical certificate doesn't even have to state why they're being booked off.

actually the employer has every right in this instance to insist his employee gets to work safely. and in saying safely, i mean something that is not going to cause accidents i.e. in her case the scooter does not seem to be a safe form of transport for her and the employer has indentified this. the employer is also not responsible for her parking whatsoever. imagine if a company of 500 employees must ensure that all these employees have parking for their vehicles? some people really need to be realistic at times.

It's actually none of her employer's business. If they were allowed to dictate this then they could essentially claim they're allowed to control all aspects of their employee's life.

Actually good companies do ensure they make provision for parking for every single person that works for them.

Let's be honest here, many SA companies have a crap attitude.
I have personally had to go to work sick, made everyone else sick too, including the a$$h0le boss who denied me time off to recuperate, even with a doctor's note.

Companies also have their dodgy requirement for a doctor's certificate for Mondays and Fridays backfire on them like this. Employees are not going to spend R300 to satisfy it, so they instead come in sick, get sicker and make everyone else sick. Then everyone either ends up off for two days during the week or they slog it out barely working for a week or more. Very cost effective.

 

[Celine]

They can question it, but if it is valid, i.e. a doctor issued it and stands by it, then at most the company can ask for a second opinion. If someone is off a lot they can look at incapacity, but that's hardly the case here - being off twice in six months. They also cannot simply question it because they feel like it, but must have good reason to be suspicious.

In fact this employer is breeding a hostile attitude. Employees see the company's view of their employees in ridiculous policies like this and it can only come back to bite the employer.


It is in fact top secret. The employee's medical details do have to be kept confidential. Their medical certificate doesn't even have to state why they're being booked off.


It's actually none of her employer's business. If they were allowed to dictate this then they could essentially claim they're allowed to control all aspects of their employee's life.

Actually good companies do ensure they make provision for parking for every single person that works for them.


Companies also have their dodgy requirement for a doctor's certificate for Mondays and Fridays backfire on them like this. Employees are not going to spend R300 to satisfy it, so they instead come in sick, get sicker and make everyone else sick. Then everyone either ends up off for two days during the week or they slog it out barely working for a week or more. Very cost effective.

what planet are you on?

 

[Sonic2k]

n fact this employer is breeding a hostile attitude. Employees see the company's view of their employees in ridiculous policies like this and it can only come back to bite the employer.


It is in fact top secret. The employee's medical details do have to be kept confidential. Their medical certificate doesn't even have to state why they're being booked off.


It's actually none of her employer's business. If they were allowed to dictate this then they could essentially claim they're allowed to control all aspects of their employee's life.

Actually good companies do ensure they make provision for parking for every single person that works for them.


Companies also have their dodgy requirement for a doctor's certificate for Mondays and Fridays backfire on them like this. Employees are not going to spend R300 to satisfy it, so they instead come in sick, get sicker and make everyone else sick. Then everyone either ends up off for two days during the week or they slog it out barely working for a week or more. Very cost effective.

Whomever posted this (TL.DR entire thread) speaks the truth.
SA companies wish they could control your personal life. The mentality is you work for them, so you're their property, in effect, a slave. As for companies who have made me come to work sick, I have made them suffer enormously. Made mistakes, that cost them dearly, made other people very sick, once passed out, and fell onto something and broke it causing damage in excess of R1.1 mil.

Its a grey area they exploit to the full, it is exploitation of middle to upper income employees, employees who don't belong to unions, and are likely not to go running to the CCMA. Some companies actually treat their staff like crap and have a budget for CCMA payout orders.
I have taken a company to the CCMA before, what a waste of time. They referred me to some bargaining council, who then told me eeeeish you are not a wekka, you are not disadvantaged.

The CCMA is only for unionized employees below a certain salary threshold. That threshold I have determined to be around R105,236 per annum or > R10k per month

The day I worked for a non-South African company, with a foreign national as a boss, was the day my eyes were opened. If I even cough or look sick I get sent home immediately. Applies equitably across the board. I will NEVER, in my life, ever work for a South African boss again, especially not an Afrikaans or Jewish one.

 

[RexxGrim]

I would think that the the most simple solution would be to stop falling off the scooter. My 2c.

 

[droplet]

How can one have a learners scooter license, how does this work?

one applies for a learner's licence for a motorcycle. if the scooter > 125cc, one needs a full motorcycle licence. learner's licence entitles one to ride the bike without a passenger. a full licence (pass the driver's test) entitles one to lift a passenger.

 

[XennoX]

Am I the only one reading this and thinking:

Tell your girlfriend to go for training before she kills herself or worse someone else? There are training academies around the country that will teach her how to operate the vehicle and what to look out for. Additionally get her to hop over to the Think Bike forum. There are people there willing to help. When riding on our roads ignorance is not an option, especially when on a vulnerable vehicle like a motorcycle/scooter.

one applies for a learner's licence for a motorcycle. if the scooter > 125cc, one needs a full motorcycle licence. learner's licence entitles one to ride the bike without a passenger. a full licence (pass the driver's test) entitles one to lift a passenger.

No. On a learner's license you may operate any engine capacity motorcycle or scooter as long as you are 18 or older. If you are under 18 you are limited to a 125 cc. Additionally, taking your license on a scooter will earn you an endorsement of only being allowed to ride a automatic motorcycle/scooter.

-- Edit --

Also make sure she is wearing the proper gear. That means helmet (pref. full face), gloves, jacket, pants and boots.

 

[Cicero]

Am I the only one reading this and thinking:

Tell your girlfriend to go for training before she kills herself or worse someone else? There are training academies around the country that will teach her how to operate the vehicle and what to look out for. Additionally get her to hop over to the Think Bike forum. There are people there willing to help. When riding on our roads ignorance is not an option, especially when on a vulnerable vehicle like a motorcycle/scooter.



No. On a learner's license you may operate any engine capacity motorcycle or scooter as long as you are 18 or older. If you are under 18 you are limited to a 125 cc. Additionally, taking your license on a scooter will earn you an endorsement of only being allowed to ride a automatic motorcycle/scooter.

-- Edit --

Also make sure she is wearing the proper gear. That means helmet (pref. full face), gloves, jacket, pants and boots.

Agreed, this seems the best solution.