Struggle songs have a place - U2

[manesan]

Although I do not approve of his opinion in this case, he is quite knowledgable about African affairs on the whole.

I just think he should stick to his charitable efforts and not poke his nose into politics so publicly. Very few people would like it if a foreigner comes along and ventures an unsolicited opinion.

He was asked by the journalist about struggle songs and he responded by giving his personal account. In no way did he say that he supported Malema or Shoot the Boer. This is just Sunday Times sensationalist drivel.

 

[Fudzy]

He was asked by the journalist about struggle songs and he responded by giving his personal account. In no way did he say that he supported Malema or Shoot the Boer. This is just Sunday Times sensationalist drivel.

+1 Gazillion.

Get out bloody (news) agents!

 

[LazyLion]

He was asked by the journalist about struggle songs and he responded by giving his personal account. In no way did he say that he supported Malema or Shoot the Boer. This is just Sunday Times sensationalist drivel.

It really doesn't matter does it? Why come to a foreign country and start making comments about which you know nothing. He should have politely declined the question with a statement to the effect "I'm sorry, but I don't know enough about your situation here to comment".

I agree, the question from the journalist was a fishing attempt, but his answer was a dumb answer, and regardless of what he knows about our current situation put him in the firing line. It's his own fault for speaking where he did not know the facts. He spoke out of turn and the backlash is fully justified.

 

[Fazda]

He was asked by the journalist about struggle songs and he responded by giving his personal account. In no way did he say that he supported Malema or Shoot the Boer. This is just Sunday Times sensationalist drivel.

THANK YOU!!! That is what I have been trying to say for the past 24 bloody hours!!

 

[zippy]

U2 rocks. Can't believe they are touring SA after I left.

 

[zippy]

It really doesn't matter does it? Why come to a foreign country and start making comments about which you know nothing. He should have politely declined the question with a statement to the effect "I'm sorry, but I don't know enough about your situation here to comment".

I agree, the question from the journalist was a fishing attempt, but his answer was a dumb answer, and regardless of what he knows about our current situation put him in the firing line. It's his own fault for speaking where he did not know the facts. He spoke out of turn and the backlash is fully justified.

He has an opinion. As you and the rest here have an opinion about other countries. You all harp on about your right to express your opinion here, but it cuts both ways. I'm certain that Bono wouldnt care less whether you or others consider him a retard or not. In fact, I think he might be miffed if a bunch of whiteys longing for the good old aparrtheid days didn't consider him a retard

 

[LazyLion]

He has an opinion. As you and the rest here have an opinion about other countries. You all harp on about your right to express your opinion here, but it cuts both ways. I'm certain that Bono wouldnt care less whether you or others consider him a retard or not. In fact, I think he might be miffed if a bunch of whiteys longing for the good old aparrtheid days didn't consider him a retard

It is never wise to offer your opinion into a racially charged political situation. You can see the result for yourself. It is his own reputation that he has damaged through his careless words.
If he had come on here and offered his personal opinion, I don't think one of us would have batted an eyelid, but he came here as a performer and offered up an opinion on an issue that he had no business answering. I really don't care that he has screwed up his rep. with a bunch of people, it really doesn't phase me at all... I wasn't going to go watch him anyway.

But there it is... he put a blot on his own name, where if he had politely declined the question he could have avoided all of this. People are entitled to their own opinions, but it is always wise to check the context before shooting your mouth off. So he turned out to be a fool for speaking out of turn. Boo Hoo for him.

 

[Vrotappel]

He has an opinion. As you and the rest here have an opinion about other countries. You all harp on about your right to express your opinion here, but it cuts both ways. I'm certain that Bono wouldnt care less whether you or others consider him a retard or not. In fact, I think he might be miffed if a bunch of whiteys longing for the good old aparrtheid days didn't consider him a retard

So the ones not happy about his utterings are whiteys longing for apartheid? You should think about what you post.

 

[beeleguise]

I think it's right that they have been ordered to stop singing the song and it has no place in our modern society. I don't ever think Julius Malema cared as much about the song as simply not wanting to be told what to do by white people anyway. But Julius's fragile ego and chip on his shoulder is of little concern to me.

But did the media take this way out of proportion and are people being over sensitive about his comments in context ? Absolutely. What a silly country we are sometimes.

At the same time stop inciting hatred by perpetuating the false notion of "boer genocide". This myth itself has the potential to lead to the ill treatment/murder of black people by "boers." And it is a myth that is very divisive.

Consider studies like this and this found that whites are the ethnic group by far the least affected by violent crime.

Certainly there are not "thousands" of white being murdered each year as some people implied.

There's a lot of misinformation out there about "boer genocide" as well as many very real murders that make the blood boil (such as that of a three year old girl, or old people who are tortured for hours). I know it's a bit grim but for the sake of looking at the issue rationally here are some numbers you can work out by reading the studies. Going by the studies figures, of the 2 million white women in South Africa each year about 56 are murdered while 230 white males out of 2 million are murdered. Only a few of these are "boers".

(The white murder rate for white women is 2.8 per 100 000, and the murder rate for white males is 13 per 100 000.)

So out of the average of 19 000+ murders a year (Although the murder rate is now 16 800 these figures go back to 1994 where it was well above 20 000) 286 happened to white people. If whites were murdered at the average rate, given we are +- 10% of the population, you would expect 1900 white to be murdered a year just to be equal to other ethnic groups. However instead whites are 6.6 times less likely to be murdered than other groups. Even then many white murders are carried out by other whites. This does not make a good case for genocide.

Please feel free to read the studies and come to your own conclusions, but I do think it's important we undertake unpleasant subjects like this with a cool and rational head. If both sides refuse to look closer we allow ourselves to be manipulated by race rhetoric. Traditionally this has lead to genocide. So while it's probably not true there is anything close to genocide in this country, if both sides keep pushing each others buttons it could lead to it.

 

[Flanders]

I think it's right that they have been ordered to stop singing the song and it has no place in our modern society. I don't ever think Julius Malema cared as much about the song as simply not wanting to be told what to do by white people anyway. But Julius's fragile ego and chip on his shoulder is of little concern to me.

But did the media take this way out of proportion and are people being over sensitive about his comments in context ? Absolutely. What a silly country we are sometimes.

At the same time stop inciting hatred by perpetuating the false notion of "boer genocide". This myth itself has the potential to lead to the ill treatment/murder of black people by "boers." And it is a myth that is very divisive.

Consider studies like this and this found that whites are the ethnic group by far the least affected by violent crime.

Certainly there are not "thousands" of white being murdered each year as some people implied.

There's a lot of misinformation out there about "boer genocide" as well as many very real murders that make the blood boil (such as that of a three year old girl, or old people who are tortured for hours). I know it's a bit grim but for the sake of looking at the issue rationally here are some numbers you can work out by reading the studies. Going by the studies figures, of the 2 million white women in South Africa each year about 56 are murdered while 230 white males out of 2 million are murdered. Only a few of these are "boers".

(The white murder rate for white women is 2.8 per 100 000, and the murder rate for white males is 13 per 100 000.)

So out of the average of 19 000+ murders a year (Although the murder rate is now 16 800 these figures go back to 1994 where it was well above 20 000) 286 happened to white people. If whites were murdered at the average rate, given we are +- 10% of the population, you would expect 1900 white to be murdered a year just to be equal to other ethnic groups. However instead whites are 6.6 times less likely to be murdered than other groups. This does not make a good case for genocide.

Please feel free to read the studies and come to your own conclusions, but I do think it's important we undertake unpleasant subjects like this with a cool and rational head. If both sides refuse to look closer we allow ourselves to be manipulated by race rhetoric. Traditionally this has lead to genocide. So while it's probably not true there is anything close to genocide in this country, if both sides keep pushing each others buttons it could lead to it.

Oh brother, here we go......again.

 

[beeleguise]

Oh brother, here we go......again.

What kind of response is that ? All the content in my post based on studies and statistics. If you have counter studies to show it is wrong or valid critique about the actual studies please provide it. Putting your head in the sand because it doesn't suit your confirmation bias won't help your personal development one bit.

 

[BBSA]

Oh brother, here we go......again.

Is the bloody rooster back again?

 

[BBSA]

What kind of response is that ? All the content in my post based on studies and statistics. If you have counter studies to show it is wrong or valid critique about the actual studies please provide it. Putting your head in the sand because it doesn't suit your confirmation bias won't help your personal development one bit.

Hi Rooster,

Is things bit slow on your "Kill all Whitey" blog?

 

[racer]

I agree, the question from the journalist was a fishing attempt, but his answer was a dumb answer, and regardless of what he knows about our current situation put him in the firing line. It's his own fault for speaking where he did not know the facts. He spoke out of turn and the backlash is fully justified.

Civil rights group Afriforum has come out in support of U2 star Bono's statement that it was stupid to sing struggle songs in the public, Beeld reported on Monday.

“Bono says there is room for struggle songs and that it is stupid to sing these sings in public if it could offend others. That is actually the point that Afriforum has been trying to make,” said its legal representative, Willie Spies.

http://www.iol.co.za/tonight/news/afriforum-bono-on-the-same-page-1.1025781


I'm not Afriforum's greatest fan, but at least they seem to have braincells and are not jumping on the retard wagon like most who have commented on this.... Perhaps they actually also read Bono's statement. As for Steve Hofmeyer, he's fast closing in on Malema as the nation's biggest moron.


-r

 

[koffiejunkie]

So is there anywhere we can read a transcript of the entire conversation, i.e. the questions asked and his responses, quoted verbatim and in chronological order?

 

[Flanders]

What kind of response is that ? All the content in my post based on studies and statistics. If you have counter studies to show it is wrong or valid critique about the actual studies please provide it. Putting your head in the sand because it doesn't suit your confirmation bias won't help your personal development one bit.

Ok. I'll give you this much...

I think it's right that they have been ordered to stop singing the song and it has no place in our modern society. I don't ever think Julius Malema cared as much about the song as simply not wanting to be told what to do by white people anyway. But Julius's fragile ego and chip on his shoulder is of little concern to me.

But did the media take this way out of proportion and are people being over sensitive about his comments in context ? Absolutely. What a silly country we are sometimes.

Your response up 'til that point was fine. Then when you started on your usual tirade about how white people don't deserve to be especially angry about violent crime because other ethnic groups are also affected, you lost the plot.

 

[capd]

I think it's right that they have been ordered to stop singing the song and it has no place in our modern society. I don't ever think Julius Malema cared as much about the song as simply not wanting to be told what to do by white people anyway. But Julius's fragile ego and chip on his shoulder is of little concern to me.

But did the media take this way out of proportion and are people being over sensitive about his comments in context ? Absolutely. What a silly country we are sometimes.

At the same time stop inciting hatred by perpetuating the false notion of "boer genocide". This myth itself has the potential to lead to the ill treatment/murder of black people by "boers." And it is a myth that is very divisive.

Consider studies like this and this found that whites are the ethnic group by far the least affected by violent crime.

Certainly there are not "thousands" of white being murdered each year as some people implied.

There's a lot of misinformation out there about "boer genocide" as well as many very real murders that make the blood boil (such as that of a three year old girl, or old people who are tortured for hours). I know it's a bit grim but for the sake of looking at the issue rationally here are some numbers you can work out by reading the studies. Going by the studies figures, of the 2 million white women in South Africa each year about 56 are murdered while 230 white males out of 2 million are murdered. Only a few of these are "boers".

(The white murder rate for white women is 2.8 per 100 000, and the murder rate for white males is 13 per 100 000.)

So out of the average of 19 000+ murders a year (Although the murder rate is now 16 800 these figures go back to 1994 where it was well above 20 000) 286 happened to white people. If whites were murdered at the average rate, given we are +- 10% of the population, you would expect 1900 white to be murdered a year just to be equal to other ethnic groups. However instead whites are 6.6 times less likely to be murdered than other groups. Even then many white murders are carried out by other whites. This does not make a good case for genocide.

Please feel free to read the studies and come to your own conclusions, but I do think it's important we undertake unpleasant subjects like this with a cool and rational head. If both sides refuse to look closer we allow ourselves to be manipulated by race rhetoric. Traditionally this has lead to genocide. So while it's probably not true there is anything close to genocide in this country, if both sides keep pushing each others buttons it could lead to it.

+1 excelent post! its refreshing to have inteligent people posting here once in a while.

bono never said struggle songs should be sang in public. ofcourse struggle songs have a place in society, its the same as history books,same as family ancestors, and all normal humanbeings learn from the past.

 

[beeleguise]

Ok. I'll give you this much...



Your response up 'til that point was fine. Then when you started on your usual tirade about how white people don't deserve to be especially angry about violent crime because other ethnic groups are also affected, you lost the plot.

No.

Firstly other ethinic groups are not "also affected". They are FAR MORE affected.

Not only am I free in this country to express my opinions, but I am out of duty to my own sense of objectivity to report matters as the facts present them. In this case the facts do not support white genocide. Any claims of white genocide are thus bogus until someone can show me new, or better "facts". That's not to say there are not farm murders. Of course they are and many are horrific and shocking and some clearly racially motivated. This is not the same as saying there is a boer genocide. Because the facts is that whites are by far the least affected group of violent crime. If you talk about boer genocide you certainly must then talk about black genocide, or Jamaican genocide, or Columbian genocide etc. You may choose to ignore the facts and this is your right. That is putting your head in the sand though.

Anyone who wishes to supress a person who is only reporting the best known data on a subject is someone who is against truth. How could that be something you could support ? Especially when the lies about boer genocide, intentional or not, only can do harm, incite violence and divide people. With this is mind I reserve my right to express that I have not seen any evidence for boer genocide. If you have please enlighten me.

 

[Flanders]

+1 excelent post! its refreshing to have inteligent people posting here once in a while.

bono never said struggle songs should be sang in public. ofcourse struggle songs have a place in society, its the same as history books,same as family ancestors, and all normal humanbeings learn from the past.

Most refreshing of all is the fact that this time only your sig contains the word 'verkrampt' and not your post itself. That must be a world first.

Isn't it strange how some people are never to be found when other stories of a similar nature are discussed? By that I mean with regard to having the right to preserve one's heritage. You know, the common, everyday stuff like proposals and more to rename everything from cities down to back alleys. Or cries to remove apartheid-era statues because they remind us of the past? Granted, statues are displayed in public but then again they're not about to step off their plinths and go on a drunken weekend killing spree now are they? But no, THOSE things are the real threat to democracy and must be removed at all costs! The song is just a song, remember?

Not too often that we'll see you come along to declare that these things mentioned also "have a place in society", hey capd? Far too evocative of the verkrampte society of old I suppose so best they be removed?

 

[Flanders]

If you talk about boer genocide you certainly must then talk about black genocide, or Jamaican genocide, or Columbian genocide etc. You may choose to ignore the facts and this is your right. That is putting your head in the sand though.

Firstly, let me make it clear that I'm not even Afrikaans and secondly, I'm not one of those who harps on specifically about genocide. Whether or not it's techically classed as genocide I cannot say as I haven't gone to great lengths to determine whether the techical definition matches the situation in SA right now. One thing's for sure though; there are big problems and that I do not try to downplay in any way. So as far as my head being in the sand goes, I beg to differ.

One aspect that surely makes your theory fall through its own bunghole with respect to

If you talk about boer genocide you certainly must then talk about black genocide...

is that for it to be considered genocide, is it not required that there be more than one group involved -- ie. the victim and the perpetrator?

Black genocide?! Who's doing the killing here exactly?