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Tanking issues since Cata (Cata patch)
- Thread starter Pitbull
- Start date
Pitbull
Verboten
With enough Vengence stacked, crits go up to 50-60k
Explain this vengence to me please?
It was mentioned yesterday, and for some reason I have no clue as to what that is
Tinuva
The Magician
Haha thats why you will see I said for single target rotation at the start do SB before SS
Explain this vengence to me please?
It was mentioned yesterday, and for some reason I have no clue as to what that is
From wowwiki
Say a warriors base health is 60k at 85, at full Vengence you gain 6k ap
When running a few heroics, I've seen my dps go up to 18k on trash...it stays around 8k on single targetsJust looking at your gear, at 85 you want to aim for 1.15% more parry than dodge (because of Diminishing Returns) and keep stacking mastery (it's prot warrior's best stat
). Hit isn't as important as it was in Wrath, so you can reforge it out into the more important survival stats (I have 2% hit at 85)
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Pitbull
Verboten
Is this per hit, or does it stack as your received damage increases? Meaning: I get hit straight of the bat for 6k damage which is equal to 10% of my unbuffed health. Now I will get a 10% buff till my next damage done? Or does it stack per hit I receive to a maximum of 10% per hit. Meaning 10% for one hit received, 10% more for another and so on, stacking to I would assume a cap ?
Kaine
Expert Member
blood strike, death strike, bum strike wuteva. its face + keyboard = win
Say the mob keeps hitting for 10k, you'd gain 500 ap each time you get hit until you've got a total of 6k ap (assuming you have 60k unbuffed hp)
It's why warriors struggle the most with inital threat (well because we start off rage starved too), once vengence has started stacking your threat sky-rockets
EDIT: Vengence lasts until about 5sec after combat ends
Tanks joke about only chain pulling to keep their vengence up
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Pitbull
Verboten
Say the mob keeps hitting for 10k, you'd gain 500 ap each time you get hit until you've got a total of 6k ap (assuming you have 60k unbuffed hp)
It's why warriors struggle the most with inital threat (well because we start off rage starved too), once vengence has started stacking your threat sky-rockets
EDIT: Vengence lasts until about 5sec after combat ends
Tanks joke about only chain pulling to keep their vengence up
Right !
Now I understand this better. Thanks mate. Should help me tank allot better now that I know what is causing my threat
My warrior is now my enchanting bitch. Sitting in Stormwind with full ilvl359 tanking gear and kak aggro.
So now, with my arcane mage, I am currently pulling aggro of our bear tanks who told me the reason I dont get a progression raid spot is that I cant hold the boss on the pull when everyone goes ape**** with the cd's the instant I pull.
On trash i pop arcane power on the pull, nuke, and when the horrible adds comes storming into the ranged group with all healers and everyone gets those lovely debuffs, i hit ice block, and type "wtf, aggro guys !!!"
So now, with my arcane mage, I am currently pulling aggro of our bear tanks who told me the reason I dont get a progression raid spot is that I cant hold the boss on the pull when everyone goes ape**** with the cd's the instant I pull.
On trash i pop arcane power on the pull, nuke, and when the horrible adds comes storming into the ranged group with all healers and everyone gets those lovely debuffs, i hit ice block, and type "wtf, aggro guys !!!"
Pitbull
Verboten
But don't you think that is a bit counter productive?
Couple of things here:
1. As a DPS you should know how to manage your aggro. (If you guild fails at knowing that I doubt anyone can help them)
2. As you have been playing a tank you know it's just causing crap for everyone in the raid is a DPS tart pulls aggro out of spite. You're lucky though as you have ice block. If you where any other class I would let you die
Tinuva
The Magician
ROFL sad to hear that.
While prot is not my main spec, I am the first dps that get asked to Tank when we have a tank shortage. Why? I am always there, and while I joined the guild as a DPSer, they wont think twice to swap me to maintank if they dont have the tanks.
I'd say my aggro as a warrior is just fine if I can tank dps'ers pushing 38k dps right of the bat. You just learn how, and as gear improve your aggro improve with it.
Yup
Call me cautious but I only started tanking heroics at 352 ilvl, mainly because the heroics can be quite a lot different to the normals and the average quality of pugs means you'll get a slacker healer and aggro happy dps 90% of the time
After running nearly every heroic at least once; I've improved positioning, pulls, when to blow cooldowns and what to CC if it's required
No ways? Didnt you get stupidly extremely bored? I started tanking at 333 as soon as i could, i got sworn at a few times but i still made it
No ways? Didnt you get stupidly extremely bored? I started tanking at 333 as soon as i could, i got sworn at a few times but i still made it
Nope, I hit 85 when the new crafted stuff became available, took my time getting my profs up, reps up and learnt to tank all the cata instances. I've dps'd everything, healed everything and took it slow on my tank
Tinuva
The Magician
Never a bad approach, to each their own, I usually go cautious as well, except at start of Cata I was the only tank between my group of friends and had a buddy who healed like a King, so we just went at it and did fairly well.
If you are improving like that just after running a heroic once, very well done, that is very impressive. Even for me I learn things and improve on them more than 1 round later, so maybe a bit slower but I tend to try and perfect them after a while.
Pitbull
Verboten
Thanks again for all the input guys.
I have done a few changes as suggested by Oculate. Please feel free to view my armory again. I have to admit it's going ALLOT better now. I'm only 1/2 into 84 (83.5) and I'm actually getting to a point where I'm feeling comfortable taking in heroics and raids again. It did cost allot of learning again (not that the learning is over) but even multi-mob tanking is waaaaay easier now than when I started in Cata.
I have noticed one thing now though...
I'm very rage starved since I made the changes. Not so bad that I can't tank but I had way more rage to use with my other setup. I would say I'm on the border line
now of just enough to be able to tank all mobs vs having too much rage. Anyone else experienced this? Maybe I'm doing something wrong again?
Rotation:
Heroic throw; charge; rend; thunder clap; Shock wave; shield block; shield slam; devastate; revenge; devastate; and so on.
I have done a few changes as suggested by Oculate. Please feel free to view my armory again. I have to admit it's going ALLOT better now. I'm only 1/2 into 84 (83.5) and I'm actually getting to a point where I'm feeling comfortable taking in heroics and raids again. It did cost allot of learning again (not that the learning is over) but even multi-mob tanking is waaaaay easier now than when I started in Cata.
I have noticed one thing now though...
I'm very rage starved since I made the changes. Not so bad that I can't tank but I had way more rage to use with my other setup. I would say I'm on the border line
now of just enough to be able to tank all mobs vs having too much rage. Anyone else experienced this? Maybe I'm doing something wrong again?
Rotation:
Heroic throw; charge; rend; thunder clap; Shock wave; shield block; shield slam; devastate; revenge; devastate; and so on.
Tinuva
The Magician
Good to hear.
I can't see your armory updated for some reason, still shows you as level 82 with the old talents. Looking even at the old talents I can't see what you had twhat would give you more rage?
For comparison sake, here is what I use: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/sylvanas/Ehl/talent/primary
However by the sounds of it you doing a lot better, however I don't remember running out of rage so often at that level, in fact then I still had more than enough rage to work with, especially once you start running heroics with 333 ilevel gear.
I can't see your armory updated for some reason, still shows you as level 82 with the old talents. Looking even at the old talents I can't see what you had twhat would give you more rage?
For comparison sake, here is what I use: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/sylvanas/Ehl/talent/primary
However by the sounds of it you doing a lot better, however I don't remember running out of rage so often at that level, in fact then I still had more than enough rage to work with, especially once you start running heroics with 333 ilevel gear.
Pitbull
Verboten
Checked it now. It's not updated yet for some reason. Might be the system restarts today that is causing the delay.
Macros:
Rend to charge (mouse wheel up once to charge and again to apply rend)
Demo shout to Thunderclap
Shield Block to Shield Slam
I don't have a rotation, it's more of a priority list.
My usual order is;
Berserker Rage + Commanding/Battle Shout (depending on the buff given in the party)
Heroic Throw and/or Charge and/or Heroic Leap
If I charge it goes Rend > Thunderclap > Demo Shout > Shield Slam > Shockwave for inital aggro. I weave in thunderclaps to keep the rend debuff up, use cleave on groups or heroic strikes on single targets when above 70 rage and spam devastate if Revenge or Shield Slam don't proc