Indeed. Kinda makes you wonder if we have been discovered at some point, but were deemed unworthy by the alien visitors. Probably not, but one never knows.
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The Moon
- Thread starter Joe_Soap
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Indeed. Kinda makes you wonder if we have been discovered at some point, but were deemed unworthy by the alien visitors. Probably not, but one never knows.
SaiyanZ
Executive Member
Could also be that the aliens passed by in the other 99.9999% time of the earths existence where there wasn't any intelligent life on earth.
Also, the bulk of the galaxies/stars in the universe are over 5 billion light years away from earth. So the earth/sun doesn't even exist yet to most of the visible universe. i.e. using any known tech available, it would be impossible to detect earth. Someone looking at our portion of space would just find a really huge star. The star that exploded and formed our sun and planets. No sun, no earth. If another earth developed somewhere in exactly the same manner as ours and at the same time, they wouldn't know we exist and we wouldn't know they exist.
OrbitalDawn
Ulysses Everett McGill
You are implying there's some kind of significance to organic life. Why? Why is organic life any more significant than any other feature of the universe? Why are you not applying it to the rings of Saturn?
We don't know what other forms of life could (or do) exist, we don't know how many planets had life on it before, we don't know what universes with other fundamental constants look like. We don't know how many universes there are, we don't know the 'tune' of the universe.
Life is not a significant feature? 
We know of universal laws that can create the rings of Saturn but none that can create life and indeed all are against life, the universe and life are winding down. 125 constants that make life possible. Not just organic life but any life. Just a little difference in most of them and a coherent universe would not exist. Then the fact that life can't just routinely spring up by chance because chance is against it. To "address" this we have some imagined multiverse. Something that is neither scientifically falsifiable or verifiable and is also less likely.
We know of universal laws that can create the rings of Saturn but none that can create life and indeed all are against life, the universe and life are winding down. 125 constants that make life possible. Not just organic life but any life. Just a little difference in most of them and a coherent universe would not exist. Then the fact that life can't just routinely spring up by chance because chance is against it. To "address" this we have some imagined multiverse. Something that is neither scientifically falsifiable or verifiable and is also less likely.
Nick333
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Life is not a significant feature?
We know of universal laws that can create the rings of Saturn but none that can create life and indeed all are against life, the universe and life are winding down. 125 constants that make life possible. Not just organic life but any life. Just a little difference in most of them and a coherent universe would not exist. Then the fact that life can't just routinely spring up by chance because chance is against it. To "address" this we have some imagined multiverse. Something that is neither scientifically falsifiable or verifiable and is also less likely.
Less likely than a creator god? Only in your mind.
And only in your mind is it more likely.
Nick333
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Could someone please quanitfy the likelyhood of a) the existence of a multiverse and b) the existence of a creator god.
Speculation about the existence of a multiverse or a continually expanding and collapsing universe is at least part of a thought process in trying to account for the finely tuned nature of our universe. Accepting that God done it is as much effort as cavemen put into it.
Speculation about the existence of a multiverse or a continually expanding and collapsing universe is at least part of a thought process in trying to account for the finely tuned nature of our universe. Accepting that God done it is as much effort as cavemen put into it.
That is precisely the point. There is no quantification for any of it so the odds might as well be 50/50 on all of them. There is no thought process and just a bunch of guessing so whatever your position is it's one of faith.
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Nick333
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Hmmm well, actually certain branches of theoretical physics suggest the possibillity of other universes. So, no. Not 50/50. Not all opinions are equal. Unless, of course physicists invented string theory to account for our existence without a creator god. Those pesky scientists and their godless agenda.
Which branches? If it were experimental physics it would be a different case but theoretical coming from theoretical is still just theoretical. It's just piling one invention on another.
Yes, the evidence does appear to suggest that the universe is fine-tuned for intelligent life or as it states "the set of life-permitting universes is small amongst the universes that we have been able to explore". SO it does appear that the universe is as a result of a non-random process. Then again, I don't think anybody has observed a truly random process so it shouldn't come as a surprise.
You would need to be clear on definitions. And these two concepts are not mutually exclusive and the truth of the one won't make the possibility of the other or relevance of the other to be any less.
Anyway, talk of "multiverse" comes across (to me anyway) as a bit silly considering that the universe can be defined as the "sum total of ALL material substances". If there is actually a "multiverse" then it would seem to me to imply that our universe is not actually a universe but just a small part of "sum total of ALL material substances" i.e. just a small part of the actual universe.
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AlphaJohn
Honorary Master
That depends if you talking about the universe or the Universe.
Also remember the word Universe was coined long before we even started looking at the quantum, and we do know that languages also evolve.