The Official Seacom MOAN thread...

hehe I am happy, just like to expect the worst, so no dissapointment!
 
pierrehugo said:
Anyone here planning on abusing the first 'unlimited' offers that are inevitably going to arise when Seacom lands?

I think this is part of the problem with unlimited offers, if everyone was on an unlimited offer the heavy users would be balanced out by the light, but when an expensive option is the only unlimmited one only people who are using more than a limmited one for the same price are going to consider it... w

catch my drift... my money is on a few unlimited offers in the R800.00 range (ADSL BW) coming threw, and the 4mbps guys getting used to the novelty pulling 1TB + a month... which is gonna cause the beginner ISPs to suffer... or am I being naive? (BTW I realise that ISPs who buy BW from upstream providers are not 'capped' ) but as history in the US, Europe, Japan, China has shown, uncapped will be abused, and is it going to be worth it for new ISPs to come into the market with unlimited deals, or are we going to have to wait for the Big Boys like Telkom & Mweb to offer Unlimited?

As an example, I bet the average MWEB user would use about 200% of there current BW if they had unlimited, therefor if Mweb gets back haul at less than 50% of current price, they can offer unlimmited and maintain profits... (in simple math? :o)

Or am I mistaken?
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........ I c being a drama queen is no longer limited to us gay folk!
 
pierrehugo said:
You are not paying 1000 times more than him... lol
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Where did I say that? :confused:

@alf101 I have storage of more than 10 Terabytes at home, increasing every month, and I burn to DVDs as much as possible as much as is needed. The main people I share with (about 8 friends) each have an external Terabyte hard drive or MviX. I have sold one Terabyte Mvix every month since December.
 
What amazes me more is that you guys in South Africa complain about what is normal for users in other countries. Caps are only just being introduced to some ISPs in the USA... and not without controversy. I don't see why we should be forced to accept caps, especially with increased bandwidth on the way?

Somebody mentioned the analogy of water. We don't have free water, but it is uncapped. Would you be happy with the Municipality or Rand Water board telling you that you are capped at 1000 kiloliters a month? and that you have to pay R80 for every additional liter?

If you would not accept that on your water usage, why would you accept it on your bandwidth usage?

is your electricity capped? Your television feed? Your telephone calls? Is your air capped? Because you would not stand for that.
 
Garyvdh said:
What amazes me more is that you guys in South Africa complain about what is normal for users in other countries. Caps are only just being introduced to some ISPs in the USA... and not without controversy. I don't see why we should be forced to accept caps, especially with increased bandwidth on the way?

Somebody mentioned the analogy of water. We don't have free water, but it is uncapped. Would you be happy with the Municipality or Rand Water board telling you that you are capped at 1000 kiloliters a month? and that you have to pay R80 for every additional liter?

If you would not accept that on your water usage, why would you accept it on your bandwidth usage?

is your electricity capped? Your television feed? Your telephone calls? Is your air capped? Because you would not stand for that.
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+1
 
Garyvdh said:
I thought the whole point of unlimited was to download whatever you want? Why should we in South Africa make do with caps when the most of the rest of the world does not even have to buy an "unlimited" account... they are all unlimited by default?

What they should rather do is make all accounts unlimited (within a year we are going to have more bandwidth in South Africa than we can possibly use or know what to do with), and then sell a few ultra-cheap "capped" accounts.

Why settle for less? Seriously? Demand what you are entitled to.

btw, as many of you know I am also very partial to sharing... just give me a shout.
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They are not all just unlimited,,,,you making people believe that this is what is like our there...I have checked a few international ISP's and they have had different accounts you can choose from, with caps up to uncapped, dont BS the people here.
 
Garyvdh said:
What amazes me more is that you guys in South Africa complain about what is normal for users in other countries. Caps are only just being introduced to some ISPs in the USA... and not without controversy. I don't see why we should be forced to accept caps, especially with increased bandwidth on the way?

Somebody mentioned the analogy of water. We don't have free water, but it is uncapped. Would you be happy with the Municipality or Rand Water board telling you that you are capped at 1000 kiloliters a month? and that you have to pay R80 for every additional liter?

If you would not accept that on your water usage, why would you accept it on your bandwidth usage?

is your electricity capped? Your television feed? Your telephone calls? Is your air capped? Because you would not stand for that.
Click to expand...

+2
 
Garyvdh said:
What amazes me more is that you guys in South Africa complain about what is normal for users in other countries. Caps are only just being introduced to some ISPs in the USA... and not without controversy. I don't see why we should be forced to accept caps, especially with increased bandwidth on the way?

Somebody mentioned the analogy of water. We don't have free water, but it is uncapped. Would you be happy with the Municipality or Rand Water board telling you that you are capped at 1000 kiloliters a month? and that you have to pay R80 for every additional liter?

If you would not accept that on your water usage, why would you accept it on your bandwidth usage?

is your electricity capped? Your television feed? Your telephone calls? Is your air capped? Because you would not stand for that.
Click to expand...


If people started leaving there taps on 24/7 then capping would be a good idea.
 
wHiTe*LiGhTnInG said:
They are not all just unlimited,,,,you making people believe that this is what is like our there...I have checked a few international ISP's and they have had different accounts you can choose from, with caps up to uncapped, dont BS the people here.
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sure, you can find cheaper and capped options, but the default is unlimited. What I am saying is that offering uncapped is both common and inexpensive in most of Europe and the USA. Why should we be any different? Especially with all the bandwidth that is on its way?
 
Garyvdh said:
Somebody mentioned the analogy of water. We don't have free water, but it is uncapped. Would you be happy with the Municipality or Rand Water board telling you that you are capped at 1000 kiloliters a month? and that you have to pay R80 for every additional liter?

If you would not accept that on your water usage, why would you accept it on your bandwidth usage?
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Re-read what you just said. It supports my argument, not yours. There is no 'cap' on bandwidth you can use per month on your line. Only a cap on the accounts you buy. Same with water.

Water is not capped, but you pay for every single drop you use. Your argument is you should pay a flat rate and use as much as the pipe can support in a month. Totally different.
 
Gaz{M} said:
Re-read what you just said. It supports my argument, not yours. There is no 'cap' on bandwidth you can use per month on your line. Only a cap on the accounts you buy. Same with water.

Water is not capped, but you pay for every single drop you use. Your argument is you should pay a flat rate and use as much as the pipe can support in a month. Totally different.
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aw come on... water costs a few cents per liter FOR A LIFE GIVING RESOURCE!!!

If you gonna argue along that line, then bandwidth should cost less than water.

I WOULD BE VERY HAPPY WITH THAT! :D

3 cents per gigabyte!!! Whoo hoo!!!!! :D

so to use as much water/bandwidth as I want and need would/should cost me around R400 to R600 a month. That is what we have been asking for all along.

I think the main reason why South African users whine about those who have uncapped is just jealousy. But your turn will come when prices come down. Then you will also be maxing out your line. In the meantime, as I said, if you want something PM me... I am more than willing to help.
 
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Garyvdh said:
If you would not accept that on your water usage, why would you accept it on your bandwidth usage?

is your electricity capped? Your television feed? Your telephone calls? Is your air capped? Because you would not stand for that.
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Water was capped in 2005 in Cape Town during the drought. Also Eskom has "capped" electricity when demand has outstripped supply (rolling blackouts). As for television feed, as it is a broadcast signal there is no limit to availability, therefore demand cannot outstrip supply. Telephone calls are also capped in the sense that you pay for what you use, there is no such thing in SA as uncapped (free) calls.

Restrictions are placed out of necessity. It is neccesary to cap bandwidth as there is not enough available. Everyone knows what it's like trying to surf the net on the last day of the month when everyone is trying to finish off their caps. Even is the whole of the SAT3 cable was opened up, it would still not be enough to satisfy demand.

Untill the supply passes demand, bandwidth will allways be controlled (capped) and expensive.
 
dogphish said:
Water was capped in 2005 in Cape Town during the drought. Also Eskom has "capped" electricity when demand has outstripped supply (rolling blackouts). As for television feed, as it is a broadcast signal there is no limit to availability, therefore demand cannot outstrip supply. Telephone calls are also capped in the sense that you pay for what you use, there is no such thing in SA as uncapped (free) calls.

Restrictions are placed out of necessity. It is neccesary to cap bandwidth as there is not enough available. Everyone knows what it's like trying to surf the net on the last day of the month when everyone is trying to finish off their caps. Even is the whole of the SAT3 cable was opened up, it would still not be enough to satisfy demand.

Untill the supply passes demand, bandwidth will allways be controlled (capped) and expensive.
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um, that's why they are bringing more undersea cables. Did you notice the title of this thread? Seacom? Seacom is a new undersea cable that is bringing lots more bandwidth to South Africa, oodles of it. Kinda negates your post then. No need to cap as will be swimming in bandwidth. We will be able to bath in it and pave our roads with it. That is... if Greed was not a factor in the provisioning of it.
 
Seacom charges $50 per mbit (lets say).

Remember:
THey do not charge per megabyte of data transferred. That's their business model, and will make their money back in 3-5 years.


So, a 4 mbit line will cost $200, from the source.Add the cost of marketing, overheads, and everything else, and lets say it comes to $800.


So a 4mbit line will cost unlimited $800, to the ISP.



Now,

Making profit

Step 1:

- Get clients to share that bandwidth. So, if 20 people share the 4 mbit line, it will cost $40 per user (after costs remember) [$800/20ppl].

-CHarge the client $100 - immediate $60 gain...yes? Remember this is on an unlimited line.


Step 2: Guide to super abnormal profits....

- Get even more clients to share the bandwidth. How? Charge per megabyte.

- If client can only download 3gb per month, they will use the full 4mbit line for 2-3 hours?

- So suddenly, by charging per GB, you can now fit 200 clients in the space of 20 - or even higher?

-$4 per user in a limited bandwidth environment. Profit margin = $100 - $4 = $96

Catch the drift? Selling something which can be bought in unlimited, but splitting it up, and selling smaller portions - that's perfect way to make money.
 
kpopat said:
Seacom charges $50 per mbit (lets say).

Remember:
THey do not charge per megabyte of data transferred. That's their business model, and will make their money back in 3-5 years.


So, a 4 mbit line will cost $200, from the source.Add the cost of marketing, overheads, and everything else, and lets say it comes to $800.


So a 4mbit line will cost unlimited $800, to the ISP.



Now,

Making profit

Step 1:

- Get clients to share that bandwidth. So, if 20 people share the 4 mbit line, it will cost $40 per user (after costs remember) [$800/20ppl].

-CHarge the client $100 - immediate $60 gain...yes? Remember this is on an unlimited line.


Step 2: Guide to super abnormal profits....

- Get even more clients to share the bandwidth. How? Charge per megabyte.

- If client can only download 3gb per month, they will use the full 4mbit line for 2-3 hours?

- So suddenly, by charging per GB, you can now fit 200 clients in the space of 20 - or even higher?

-$4 per user in a limited bandwidth environment. Profit margin = $100 - $4 = $96

Catch the drift? Selling something which can be bought in unlimited, but splitting it up, and selling smaller portions - that's perfect way to make money.
Click to expand...

Sense at last :D

Now one needs to find out how much the user pool will use if not limmited...

I once read an article that stipulated that 5% of the internet population use 70% of the BW...
 
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