They walk among us....

Maybe God made humans intelligent so that humans can create drugs so that you could get pregnant.
Maybe God created evolution so that you may be a human with a big enough brain to search the internet. Maybe evolution made that scientist's brain big enough to make those drugs.

Maybe, maybe not... who cares, who knows, why does it upset you.
 
PythonFSi said:
what? The mindless stupidity?
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Yes! He's not the mindless stupid one... why does he care? In fact he should be celebrating the fact that hes not a moron!

Do you make fun of disabled people? So why make fun of stupid people?
 
blunomore said:
People need emotional crutches and religion is one of them. Just let it be.
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You can't group all theists together like that. I know of many whose religion is far more than a simple emotional crutch...
 
AcidRaZor said:
Yes, the same way, when you work with a patient in hospital, you give them good news beforehand because they're more likely to pull through surgery than if they were worrying about DA TOOOMER!
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Any studies you can point to that support this claim?

The reason I ask is not to be difficult, I've just read a couple of articles and studies, and I've not come across anything remotely definitive that suggests that prayer is beneficial under these circumstances. Generally, it has precisely zero effect when people are unaware they are being prayed for (as I'd expect), and oddly, hospitalized people who are aware they are being prayed for actually get stressed because they feel 'pressure' to get better (out of guilt?) and this makes matters worse, not better.
 
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Vegeta said:
Maybe God made humans intelligent so that humans can create drugs so that you could get pregnant.
Maybe God created evolution so that you may be a human with a big enough brain to search the internet. Maybe evolution made that scientist's brain big enough to make those drugs.
Click to expand...

if we can contribute that to god, we might as well do this:

Vegeta said:
Maybe God made humans intelligent so that humans can create guns so that people can get murdered.
Maybe God created evolution so that you may be a human with a big enough brain to search porn on the internet. Maybe evolution made that scientist's brain big enough to make those nuclear weapons.
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Are you sure you want to go this route? :confused:
 
Keeper said:
if we can contribute that to god, we might as well do this:

Maybe God made humans intelligent so that humans can create guns so that people can get murdered.
Maybe God created evolution so that you may be a human with a big enough brain to search porn on the internet. Maybe evolution made that scientist's brain big enough to make those nuclear weapons.

Are you sure you want to go this route? :confused:
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Exactly my point sure God did... its just rational that people should believe that if there is a God and he made all these wonderful things(medicine etc, by making us intelligent and self aware) then he also made the bad things(nukes wars, again by making us intelligent and self aware).

If it is God will that the OP's wife got pregnant then its also God's will that kids die of hunger and get stabbed to death.

If a person can't see that then they are simply not rational. Problem is most people are not rational.

Why is it so hard for people to sleep at night knowing God created everything good and bad?? Its not so glamorous if you say well all those people died in that bombing and it was Gods will is it? But if you believe in God you have to believe that too otherwise you're being selective.
 
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OP:

Are you 100% sure that it was not the will of God?

Why do you feel so offended by these remarks? Does the idea that potentially the creator of the entire universe who loves you dearly, took time out of his busy day to extend some love and kindness to you and your wife, even though you vehemently deny his possible existence?

Your friends were praying for you, I was praying for you, (and possibly your wife was also secretly praying?)
Just saying...thats a lot of praying to simply discredit prayer as a possibility in a scenario with 50/50 possibility, using a sample of 1 observation.
 
Benster said:
OP:

Are you 100% sure that it was not the will of God?

Why do you feel so offended by these remarks? Does the idea that potentially the creator of the entire universe who loves you dearly, took time out of his busy day to extend some love and kindness to you and your wife, even though you vehemently deny his possible existence?

Your friends were praying for you, I was praying for you, (and possibly your wife was also secretly praying?)
Just saying...thats a lot of praying to simply discredit prayer as a possibility in a scenario with 50/50 possibility, using a sample of 1 observation.
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On the other hand, there have been several studies that have attempted to show that prayer has an effect. If any of them had shown this, you'd be sure that they'd be trumpeted from the rooftops.

I think there's a time and a place for offense, and I can understand why some people are indeed offended. That said, I am not sure I recall the OP saying they were offended - Every time a non-religious person comments about a religion, does not mean there's any offense involved...

Reminded me of this:

tumblr_m66nzmsGBs1qcjwm7o1_r1_1280.png
 
SoulTax said:
Thanks for the congrats as well. Had a 12 week scan the other day and I must admit, it is pretty special seeing the little thing move around in there. I told myself I wouldn't be one of those cheesy-expecting-fathers.
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I dunno dude, if you did a scan and something was moving in you, then maybe she was right, or you doing it wrong, but heck......:wtf:
 
HavocXphere said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Efficacy_of_prayer#First_person_studies

It has a calming effect, which should theoretically reduce cortisol levels which in turn should improve recovery. Good news, prayer, meditation etc should all work.

The catch is that it doesn't prove anything regarding god. If you believe in pink unicorns hard enough those too will work.
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I must just point out, that I'm referring to a situation of person A praying for person B, and the effect this has on person B - As related in the scenario discussed in the first post - For this, there is no data that I am aware of that 'proves' (which was the statement I took issue with) a positive effect (and in fact, as I mentioned, it can cause unnecessary stress).

That prayer and meditation can help the individual is easy to accept, of course, as it's precisely the same as placebo medicine, which has a well documented effect on people.
 
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It annoys that people thank deities for getting better before they thank the doctors they went to.

Or when they thank the Jesus for removing a tumer, surgeon must be thinking, hmmkay...

I suppose if some theists didn't go to a doctor and relied on god, they wouldn't have a heartbeat to thank anyone.

Like the saying goes: There are no theists in hospital waiting rooms.
 
The OP shouldn't concern himself with what the lady said but rather the fact that she's excited and happy about the pregnancy.
If anything this woman will provide invaluable support to his wife during the time she's expecting and when the baby comes.
We can't always rely on doctors anyway because they can only do so much.
 
DrYes said:
If anything this woman will provide invaluable support to his wife during the time she's expecting and when the baby comes.
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No, not really, this type of person is usually too self absorbed. What kind of person doesn't go "congratulations, my friend!" but goes, "Oh, yeah, that was me having a word with God. Thank me." instead? Subtle ****, man! Subtle ****! :D :p
 
copacetic said:
I must just point out, that I'm referring to a situation of person A praying for person B, and the effect this has on person B - As related in the scenario discussed in the first post
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Was in response to your response to Acid's hospital comment:

AcidRaZor said:
Yes, the same way, when you work with a patient in hospital, you give them good news beforehand
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copacetic said:
Any studies you can point to that support this claim?
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Meaning person B knows about the "positive" knowledge/prayer/whatever. I agree with you that if person B doesn't know he/she is being prayed for then its not gonna work.

But yes, it seems we agree regardless of the misunderstanding.
 
I felt the same way as the OP when I landed a new job this month.

My parents had a prayer planned around the time of my interview and now they say I got the job because of the prayer. They also tell me that I should fast/pray and thank god for his blessings. I'm not religious so I laughed at this on the inside. My parents don't know that I don't believe in magic. Someday they will have to find out.
 
There actually has been a study which shows that prayers have zero effect, but placebos do help.

Think it was it was mentioned in The God Delusion, or mentioned somewhere else by Dawkins.
 
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