Kornhub
Blackburn Fan
Yeah,what idiots.
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Yeah,what idiots.
thestaggy
Honorary Master
Anderson has also looked the best he ever has and he is pretty much a holding midfielder, very similar to the role a DM would play but with a little more versatility. Fergie would not have off-loaded O'Shea and Hargreaves if he was uncertain of his depth in the middle of the park. True, Hargreaves is an inury waiting to happen but if Fergie was worried he'd have kept him or made a serious effort to pick up a DM, but at no point was a DM a major priority. Fergie does good business. He filled what he felt were pressing; a long term solution to van der Sar, a natural replacement for Giggs and quality youth in the backline. Carrick will be back, he always has poor starts fitness wise to his season and I saw Fletcher in action for Scotland at the weekend, so he'll definitely be back in the squad.
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The resemblence is uncanny. Replace Fergie with Pep and the players names with some from the Barca squad and you wouldn't even know the difference.
Anyway. You rating your youthfull side after 3 matches a bit premature imo. Your young defense let in 2 and allowed a lot of chances against an utter ****e Arsenal side.
Ashley Young was a quality player and a very good buy. The rest is still unproven and the jury is still out on your goalkeeper. That one can still go either way. As for "Fergie does good business"...Bebe anyone.
two matches and you believe his all that? How often did Arsenal attack through the middle and where was Cleverley?
Both Anderson and Cleverley push so high up the defence had to sit on the half way line... When Arsenal attacked they had ample of space between the midfield and the defence, United had to rely on the defence to make that last ditch tackle.
Time will tell if trying to outscore the other team will win us the 20th
thestaggy
Honorary Master
The resemblence is uncanny. Replace Fergie with Pep and the players names with some from the Barca squad and you wouldn't even know the difference.
Anyway. You rating your youthfull side after 3 matches a bit premature imo. Your young defense let in 2 and allowed a lot of chances against an utter ****e Arsenal side.
Ashley Young was a quality player and a very good buy. The rest is still unproven and the jury is still out on your goalkeeper. That one can still go either way. As for "Fergie does good business"...Bebe anyone.
Yes, one of those goals was due to a blunder by de Gea as it went straight through his legs. It is a sin for a 'keeper to let one go through the legs. The goal conceded against West Brom was due to de Gea as well. No team can stop an opponent from having at least one shot at goal so de Gea should be expected to make saves, and easy ones at that. I will not argue that de Gea is a potential weak spot, but I have not being hyping him have I? To his credit he came up big and saved van Persie's penalty. Did you watch the Arsenal-United game? How could United not have gone forward? It was too easy. Add in the butchered easy goals - of which there were at least 3 - and United could have rattled up double figures. Fergie brought Park and Giggs on early to slow the pace down, as while he felt they could have easily kept scoring, they could have potentially leaked a couple of needless goals in the process.
Unproven? Seriously? Did you watch England vs Bulgaria? Smalling, Jones, Young and Welbeck. Bulgaria were comprehensively thumped. Smalling has Europa and Champions league experience. Cleverley saved Wigan from relegation and has a full Premier League season as a starter under his belt. Jones played all over the park for Blackburn last term, right back, centrehalf, defensive midfield. Welbeck was a top performer for Sunderland last season. Right now that lot have more Premier League credibility than Mata, Lukaku, McEachran or Bertrand. Unproven?
Bebe? Seriously? Chicarito (If Fergie bought him post World Cup it is believed his price tag would have doubled), Ronaldo (bought for 12 and sold as a star for a cool 80), Park (A BMT player of note and a hard grafter), Smalling, Jones & Young (English internationals who are really impressing, but then again they're a bunch of mugs with zero experience). Eric Cantona, Roy Keane, Peter Schmiechel (bought from an obscure Danish club), Solskjaer (bought straight from Norway for 1.5 mil and scored the winner against Bayern in the 1999 CL final), van der Sar cost him a mere 2mil, Vidic was bought for 7 and is now rated at 18+ and is recognised as one of Europe's top centrehalves, Denis Irwin cost around half a million pound and played in over 500 games as first choice left back, Ruud van Nistlerooy fresh off of a ruptured knee that many felt could harm his career, a la Michael Owen. Yeah, Bebe, a blot on Fergie's record. If you wanted to raise a stinker I would have personally chosen Juan Sebastian Veron, the only player Fergie publically regrets buying. But what's worse, Fergie buying him for 28 million when he had a reputation or Chelsea taking him off of Fergie's hands for 15 million even though it had been established that he was a disaster in England? Maybe Hargreaves as second choice, but then again he had been the only player to come out of England's limp effort in the 2006 World Cup with his reputation strengthened and not weakened and injuries have savaged him since.
Bebe is also only 21 and was a low key buy, seeing as he was bought at the same time as Chicarito was.
thestaggy
Honorary Master
Are you even a United fan? If you are then you are the most pessimistic one I have come across in ages. I know of Liverpool & Arsenal fans that have more faith in their teams than you seem to have in yours. Yes I am excited by the United squad. Just look at them. A bunch of youngsters enjoying football and taking it onto the international stage. I never said they're ready to go and hammer Barca 789-1 at the Nou Camp. All I said is they're young, fresh, playing great football and their future looks brighter than Chelsea's right now. I also recall predicting City as my champions and not United, with United's youth boding well for the future. Why? Because while they look good, I would not be surprised if they err when it's crunch time and I'll forgive them that.
You are way too optimistic and seemingly gloat about how good people are when they've only played 2 matches... I'm a realist I enjoy the success as they come I don't go around telling other fans how their players will fail when - true as bob - their team whips ours... Murphy's law
thestaggy
Honorary Master
Mata has played how many Premier League games? As mentioned, the EPL is one of the toughest leagues to adjust to. Just ask Andriy Shevchenko. He scored goals for fun in Italy but it was fun trying to watch him score in the Premier League. And I do recall Chicarito being quite a a little star at the World Cup over here.
- He was shortlisted for the PFA Young Player of the Year award for the 2010-11 season.
- He opened the scoring in the 2–1 quarter-final win over Chelsea in the Champions League. You should remember United putting Chelsea out?
- He scored after 36 seconds to help United beat your Chelsea 2-1, a result leaving them 1 point from the title. The goal against Chelsea made him the first United player since Ruud van Nistelrooy in the 2001–02 season to score 20 goals for the club in his debut season.
- He won the Sir Matt Busby Player of the Year Award, as voted for by the United fans.
- The International Federation of Football History and Statistics named him their ''World Goalgetter 2011''. He was voted ahead of Radamel Falcao and one Lionel Messi. And the IFFHS is a FIFA recognised organisation.
For the 2010-11 Premier League season he bagged 13 goals in 29 games and he nailed 4 goals in 9 Champions League games. Since his international debut in 2009 he he has scored 22 goals in 31 matches. Yeah, another overrated United player that has done nothing. What was I thinking saying this guy is a pretty good footballer?
And tell me were I ''derided" Mata? I do recall saying that Chicarito, Welbeck, Smalling, Young and Jones have MORE PREMIER LEAGUE EXPERIENCE than he does - which they do - but nowhere did I say Mata was garbage.
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thestaggy
Honorary Master
You are way too optimistic and seemingly gloat about how good people are when they've only played 2 matches... I'm a realist I enjoy the success as they come I don't go around telling other fans how their players will fail when - true as bob - their team whips ours... Murphy's law
OH. MY. GOSH. Dude, you are killing me.
Cleverely - Full Premier League campaign under his belt as a starter. Highly acclaimed during that season for helping Wigan avoid the drop, showing resolve and ability.
Welbeck - Prior senior experience with United. Fresh off of a full campaign with Sunderland which done wonders for his reputation.
Smalling - Two rotational seasons in the Prem with Fulham and United. Experience in Europe at both Europa and Champions League level. Has been England's starting RB for their last two Euro qualifiers.
Young - A veteran of 177 Premier League games and had 15 English caps before United picked him up.
Jones - Fresh off a full campaign as a Blackburn regular, playing almost all over the backline and in the midfield.
And another one putting words in my mouth. Where did I say anyone would fail? Please quote me. I said RIGHT NOW the guys starring for United and England have MORE PREMIER LEAGUE EXPERIENCE than Chelsea's youngsters and that for the most part Chelsea's younsgters are UNPROVEN AT PREMIER LEAGUE LEVEL. Nowhere did I say Mata is cr@p and will be a bust a la Shevchenko/Crespo/Mutu. I said he ain't done a thing yet, while all the guys appearing for United have shown they can play Premier League football and on that basis I would take Young/Welbeck over him. Frankly, saying Mata is just as good as someone who has actual Premier League experience is more fantastical than anything I have said. Mata has a few minutes of Prem football and now he is a star in the Premier League? I'd take David Silva/Kun Ageuro/Edin Dzecko over him as they have also shown they can cut it.
Anybody with half an idea of English football will know it is the hardest league to adjust to in Europe outside of the Eastern European ice-boxes due to the speed it's played at and the physicality involved. The physical aspect is a huge shock for most continental players.
And seriously, read a paper. Preferably an English sports paper and you will see a country that is excited by the young talent coming through in England and a large part of that has been fuelled by the scintilating start by United's 6 (Jones, Smalling, Cleverley, Young, Welbeck & Rooney), all save Cleverley have been capped in the past 2 English sides.
'It is a very young team at the moment, but it's one full of energy and of great ability, and I'm enjoying watching them.' - Sir Alex
So, yeah, we’ve got a good nucleus of young players in the club which gives you the foundation to be able to protect the future and know it’s going to be alright. - Sir Alex
But yeah, I guess Fergie is a bit of an idiot for getting pumped too? I mean, he has turned one batch of youth into quality before (The Nevilles, Beckham, Butt, Giggs, Scholes) so what does he know about talent? What an old fart for being optimistic.
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Anyone who leaves Italy does terribly, ask Kaka.
What's your point to them being unproven?
What's your point to them being unproven?
All papers are like that in their respective country, plus you should know English media LOVE!! hyping players.
SinghDude
Chief Sports Analyst
Yup, the English media will make you believe that they will win the WC in 2014.
Every 4 years it was Englands time to win, the golden generation.
thestaggy said:
thestaggy said:
Wow amazing the amount of derailing and off topic you pull out, first you talk about Cleverly then you drag up 5 other players when your statement clearly states Cleverely
After two matches and you said Chelsea lack that spark, I'd hate to hear what you gotta say for Arsenal
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thestaggy
Honorary Master
Wow amazing the amount of derailing and off topic you pull out, first you talk about Cleverly then you drag up 5 other players when your statement clearly states Cleverely
After two matches and you said Chelsea lack that spark, I'd hate to hear what you gotta say for Arsenal
A - You said United lack a creative/attacking midfield player. So I asked "And what exactly is Tom Cleverley"? Seeing as he has played like a creative/attacking player.
B - And I quote you ''You are way too optimistic and seemingly gloat about how good people are when they've only played 2 matches... I'm a realist I enjoy the success as they come I don't go around telling other fans how their players will fail when - true as bob - their team whips ours... Murphy's law''.
Because you said ''people'' and have basically being questioning United's youth I took it as a critique on all of them and their lack of experience by saying they've played 2 matches. So I informed you of all of their experience. And regardless, Cleverley has a full season under his belt as a starter and yes, I did watch him play for Wigan and yes, Roberto Martinez - Wigans' gaffer - wanted him back. Where do you come off saying ''they've only played 2 matches"?
thestaggy
Honorary Master
Okay, bugger my unjustified excitement. I'll take your line and become morbidly depressed about them and start fearing them making the Champions League next season. And bugger the excitement of millions of other people. But what of Fergie's excitement? Or is he just an old fart that is detached from reality? He has no reason to be excited because he has no idea what to look out for in a promising young player. 'Bout time he retires and tends to his roses, huh?
Wow amazing... Change your story much?
It seems to me like you rather read these "newspapers" and believe their propaganda instead of their performances over a period of time. English press tend to over hype and throw praises to any player that is born English.
Playing for Wigan does not make you the best player since slice bread, time will tell - what I'm trying to say is don't jump the gun like a lot of United fans I've seen (act like Harold Camping)
fishfly said:
thestaggy said:
thestaggy said:
That statement goes to Jones and Cleverly and de Gea considering you raving at how great United's youngsters are doing so well, etc... you said I'm being pessimistic for being cautious.
It seems to me like you rather read these "newspapers" and believe their propaganda instead of their performances over a period of time. English press tend to over hype and throw praises to any player that is born English.
Playing for Wigan does not make you the best player since slice bread, time will tell - what I'm trying to say is don't jump the gun like a lot of United fans I've seen (act like Harold Camping)
SAF has insight into his team, we don't, can't rely on press to give a correct assessment on players that have only played a few games
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Tom Cleveryly for Wigan 2010/11 - 19 Starts 6 Subs - 3 Goals 2 Assists.
So you don't think playing for relegation strugglers Wigan is slightly different than playing for United. I think the point Fish is making is that the lad has started 2 competative games for United and although he has made a good start is he still has a lot to prove ie unproven at that level.
So you don't think playing for relegation strugglers Wigan is slightly different than playing for United. I think the point Fish is making is that the lad has started 2 competative games for United and although he has made a good start is he still has a lot to prove ie unproven at that level.
You can't use newspapers as a credible source, especially english papers, that's just stupid. Of course Fergie is going to be excited by them he's the manager.