Tyre Woes

[Fulcrum29]

I am not arguing that a good tyre could possible prevent and accident, because it can, potentially... What I am saying is that they are sometimes priced so much more than legal and cheaper alternatives that its not worth it. Obviously if you have a car that does not have at least ABS you should get the best tyre around.

Yep, in this perspective it is totally agreeable.

A good thing would be to get a tyre within the same specification range as the originals, which can be more affordable over the long-term (until the vehicle is replaced or sold).

 

[DominionZA]

I have ABS and Audi Brake Assist and I will STILL rather spend the money on a good quality tyre and and not some budget cr@p.
If you transport your family in the vehicle it becomes more important.

Two most important things that need good quality components are tyres and brakes IMO. They mean the difference between life and death, and the money saved buying budget tyres means squat if you're freaking dead.

 

[Splinter]

Tyres, like toilet paper, are consumables. Get the cheapest legal ones and let it rip.

I am not arguing that a good tyre could possible prevent and accident, because it can, potentially... What I am saying is that they are sometimes priced so much more than legal and cheaper alternatives that its not worth it. Obviously if you have a car that does not have at least ABS you should get the best tyre around.

You seemed to be saying exactly that paying more for a decent tyre is a waste? The only thing that connects your car to the road are your tyres - which actually makes them the most important item you could ever purchase for your vehicle.

 

[SauRoNZA]

I have ABS and Audi Brake Assist and I will STILL rather spend the money on a good quality tyre and and not some budget cr@p.
If you transport your family in the vehicle it becomes more important.

Two most important things that need good quality components are tyres and brakes IMO. They mean the difference between life and death, and the money saved buying budget tyres means squat if you're freaking dead.

I think there needs to be some distinction made here.

You get budget aka super cheap noname brand like tyres, then you get middle ground "compromise" tyres often made by the same manufacturer but for the buyer who wants to pay less for largely the same thing (like VW & Audi exist side by side with 95% the same cars) and then you get premium aka expensive tyres.

The budget tyres are not great and probably a 20% loss in performance over the premium brands.

The compromised ones on the middle like Hankooks and Achilles are probably 5-10% off the Premium brands performance wise but probably 40% less in price.


Ultimately it comes down to doing your research and not just walking into the shop asking for the cheapest ones they've got because they are the cheapest. You want to strike a balance between cost, performance and longevity.

Depending on your driving habits you might very well end up with a premium brand manufacturer but NOT the performance version of the rubber because you don't need it because you want them to last longer.

In the same way the performance rubber from a lesser brand could very easily trump the economy rubber of a premium brand and still for less money.


*****

Then of course there is the seat of the pants test. My car came with Hi Flys that I've never heard of but I drove it hard and quite happily and never had a problem with them. That being said if I saw them on the shelf not having driven them I would never have touched them due to lack of any information that I could find on them.

 

[Splinter]

Tyres, like toilet paper, are consumables. Get the cheapest legal ones and let it rip.

I think there needs to be some distinction made here.

You get budget aka super cheap noname brand like tyres, then you get middle ground "compromise" tyres often made by the same manufacturer but for the buyer who wants to pay less for largely the same thing (like VW & Audi exist side by side with 95% the same cars) and then you get premium aka expensive tyres.

The budget tyres are not great and probably a 20% loss in performance over the premium brands.

The compromised ones on the middle like Hankooks and Achilles are probably 5-10% off the Premium brands performance wise but probably 40% less in price.


Ultimately it comes down to doing your research and not just walking into the shop asking for the cheapest ones they've got because they are the cheapest. You want to strike a balance between cost, performance and longevity.

Depending on your driving habits you might very well end up with a premium brand manufacturer but NOT the performance version of the rubber because you don't need it because you want them to last longer.

In the same way the performance rubber from a lesser brand could very easily trump the economy rubber of a premium brand and still for less money.


*****

Then of course there is the seat of the pants test. My car came with Hi Flys that I've never heard of but I drove it hard and quite happily and never had a problem with them. That being said if I saw them on the shelf not having driven them I would never have touched them due to lack of any information that I could find on them.

Although you touch on performance, you seem to omit braking distance and handling in the wet? Or was that included in your definition of performance? I do like your quoting of percentages - care to back them up with statistics?

Your analogy about VW/Audi is a bit flawed - both these vehicles come from a high quality German firm. Unless you are saying the tyres come from the same firm, it is not a valid comparison.

 

[tRoN]

I can't see why the OP is asking this question.

If the OEM tyre fitted has given him 56k with 4mm more to go then it's obvious he should fit those.

I once got 80k on Michelin energy on a 3 series BMW E36

 

[SauRoNZA]

Although you touch on performance, you seem to omit braking distance and handling in the wet? Or was that included in your definition of performance? I do like your quoting of percentages - care to back them up with statistics?

Your analogy about VW/Audi is a bit flawed - both these vehicles come from a high quality German firm. Unless you are saying the tyres come from the same firm, it is not a valid comparison.

Yes I consider braking distance as part of performance. An economy tyre will be harder than a performance tyre and will not brake as well but will obviously last longer.

Of course the percentages are pure bull****, it was for illustration purposes only. It stands to reason that a significantly cheaper tyre is made from significantly cheaper/lesser chemical compounds and will therefore be inferior purely based on cost.

On the other end of the scale however you find supply and demand playing a role where a price is pushed up by what the market dictates it's willing to pay. The same factory can however make exactly the same tyre graded slightly lower (bull**** 10% I mentioned) and sell them for less money with largely the same performance.

A super cheap manufacturer using super cheap compounds however cannot simply make a better tyre for less money.

And yes I do imply that the brands come front the same manufacturers. VW exists with the same model next to Audi because the mothership knows that a particular buyer thinks they are getting more value buying VW while another thinks they are getting a premium car from Audi even though they are mostly the same.

This is done for the simple reason of not giving away your profits to someone else. Under cut your own brands and compete with them and all the money still lands in your own pocket. Offer only one product and you give the sale away.

 

[Paul_S]

I drive a Cerato 2.0 SX and went from Khumo 215/45 17s to Toyo T1 Sport 215/50 17s.
The different is like night and day.
The Toyos grip much better than the Khumos especially on wet roads. Hitting 1cm of water with the Khumos at 100km/h resulted in hydro planning. The Toyos still stick at 150km/h in the same conditions without pulling sideways when hitting the puddles.
The Toyos stick better in the dry too and don't spin as much when pulling off.
The Toyos are a lot quieter and comfortable probably due to a softer compound but they have 25000km on them and still plenty of life left. I paid around R1400 per tyre fitted in March.

 

[Rouxenator]

OEM tyres does go very far, the Dunlops on my Corsa D will probably last me 4 years / 45,000km.

However that is not always the case, I had a Corsa Lite once that tried to kill various family members with its poor OEM tyre/wheel setup. I think it was Firestone; aquaplaned, over and under steer frequently without pushing the envelope, just generally crap handling. I pimp'd the car a bit by getting wider 15" semi-vulgar A-line rims and Hero tyres which was the cheapest that would fit. The ride was much better and the car felt more under control all the way to its max, even in the wet.

 

[SauRoNZA]

Often OEM fitted Tyres are inferior to the exact same make model fitted after the fact.

I've found this every single time with my bikes, fit the exact same tyre as the OEM to replace and it's always a stickier better overall tyre.

Granted comparing brand new Tyres with worn ones isn't exactly fair, but the entire feel changes based on the entire lifetime.

 

[Splinter]

Yes I consider braking distance as part of performance. An economy tyre will be harder than a performance tyre and will not brake as well but will obviously last longer.

Of course the percentages are pure bull****, it was for illustration purposes only. It stands to reason that a significantly cheaper tyre is made from significantly cheaper/lesser chemical compounds and will therefore be inferior purely based on cost.

On the other end of the scale however you find supply and demand playing a role where a price is pushed up by what the market dictates it's willing to pay. The same factory can however make exactly the same tyre graded slightly lower (bull**** 10% I mentioned) and sell them for less money with largely the same performance.

A super cheap manufacturer using super cheap compounds however cannot simply make a better tyre for less money.

And yes I do imply that the brands come front the same manufacturers. VW exists with the same model next to Audi because the mothership knows that a particular buyer thinks they are getting more value buying VW while another thinks they are getting a premium car from Audi even though they are mostly the same.

This is done for the simple reason of not giving away your profits to someone else. Under cut your own brands and compete with them and all the money still lands in your own pocket. Offer only one product and you give the sale away.

I got a bit lost with all the, umm, detail. Not sure what your point is anymore. So besides making up falsified percentages to support your own viewpoint, you seemed to miss what I was querying - VW/Audi are from the same global brand, hence you cannot make this comparison unless the tyres you are talking about come the same stable as well?