Upgrade from 8 to 7 possible?

[AlmightyBender]

I need office functionality to get work done. And I need the traditional way to work with multiple windows, or then multiple desktops.

Windows 8 can be mind-blowing but it is not aimed at getting work done. It is only impressive if one's a teen with half a brain.

You've clearly never used Windows 8. It is exactly the same as Windows 7 with metro added on. Literally exactly the same. It is in no way less functional than Windows 7. And if you install ClassicShell then it is literally and completely exactly the same functionality as Windows 7. You do not have to see the tiles or metro. Ever.

 

[reneg8or]

Depends on the version. Not all had full downgrade rights either.
For example you could not go Windows 7 Home edition to Windows XP Professional or Home
or from Windows XP Home to Windows 2000 (XP Home could only go down to Windows 98/ME).

I know people naturally presumed they had full downgrade rights on all versions, but they did not. Windows 8 & 7 does change in the fact that only Windows Pro versions are down-gradable.

Thirty years ago, my first boss said: ''Computer people are complicators.'' I am not sure that this blanket statement is true but the intricate world of software licensing seems to be a minefield that will turn even the best sapper grey in no time.

I took a closer look at PCLinuxOX and then also the newly announced MakuluLinux. Although LibreOffice's Impress does not impress, it seems sensible then to stop the agony, install Linux, encrypt everything superbly (crime, theft) and go computing happily without a moment's concern over legal issues.


I'm one of the few freaks who isn't anti-Windoze because I like some Linux distro's. If I were more biased, the choice would have been easier. Also, I am not alone but returning from retirement and having to consider the clearest path that will also help the younger ones who will be following. They have yet to learn how to juggle between multiple spreadsheets, complicated business plans, presentations and executive summaries without losing the plot. This is where the plain vanilla, even boring, interface of Libre really shines. MS Office deviated from that long ago. Eye-candy does not rush for deadlines with sanity.

If only IBM did not shelf Lotus - by far a superior office suite and Outlook cannot even today compare with the final Lotus Organizer of 1999. Same goes for 1-2-3.

 

[reneg8or]

You've clearly never used Windows 8. It is exactly the same as Windows 7 with metro added on. Literally exactly the same. It is in no way less functional than Windows 7. And if you install ClassicShell then it is literally and completely exactly the same functionality as Windows 7. You do not have to see the tiles or metro. Ever.

Nobody near me has 8. My only exposure to it is at Incredible, which we all know is not ideal. I have to go by the posts on many blogs. Multiple windows side by side and even multiple desktops: the entire chorus agrees that 8 just cannot do it.

I am hands-on with Ubuntu, Mint and XP, I did have machines with Vista and 7 ultimate bot sold them. Oddly, Vista never gave me a single hassle.

 

[AlphaJohn]

Thirty years ago, my first boss said: ''Computer people are complicators.'' I am not sure that this blanket statement is true but the intricate world of software licensing seems to be a minefield that will turn even the best sapper grey in no time.

I took a closer look at PCLinuxOX and then also the newly announced MakuluLinux. Although LibreOffice's Impress does not impress, it seems sensible then to stop the agony, install Linux, encrypt everything superbly (crime, theft) and go computing happily without a moment's concern over legal issues.


I'm one of the few freaks who isn't anti-Windoze because I like some Linux distro's. If I were more biased, the choice would have been easier. Also, I am not alone but returning from retirement and having to consider the clearest path that will also help the younger ones who will be following. They have yet to learn how to juggle between multiple spreadsheets, complicated business plans, presentations and executive summaries without losing the plot. This is where the plain vanilla, even boring, interface of Libre really shines. MS Office deviated from that long ago. Eye-candy does not rush for deadlines with sanity.

If only IBM did not shelf Lotus - by far a superior office suite and Outlook cannot even today compare with the final Lotus Organizer of 1999. Same goes for 1-2-3.

Was never a fan of Lotus, but do get why some people liked it. Currently Running Ubuntu + Cinnamon (UI) and love Libre Office. I use to run Microsoft Office till 2003 when they introduced the ribbon even on Linux.

As for the ease of use on licencing terms in Linux or shall I say GPLv3 is only neat when you do not touch or redistribute your development aka if you are an end user. Once you enter development it can be a minefield of note, esp once you start borrowing libraries from other projects.

 

[AlmightyBender]

Nobody near me has 8. My only exposure to it is at Incredible, which we all know is not ideal. I have to go by the posts on many blogs. Multiple windows side by side and even multiple desktops: the entire chorus agrees that 8 just cannot do it.

I am hands-on with Ubuntu, Mint and XP, I did have machines with Vista and 7 ultimate bot sold them. Oddly, Vista never gave me a single hassle.

Windows 8 is not only the metro interface. You still have your normal familiar desktop which does indeed handle multiple windows and desktops. Trust me on this one, I use it every day. I never see the tiles. When I login it goes straight to desktop and it is EXACTLY the same as Windows 7. Just cleaner and more efficient. I will send you a screenshot when I get home on Monday if you still don't believe me

 

[AlphaJohn]

Nobody near me has 8. My only exposure to it is at Incredible, which we all know is not ideal. I have to go by the posts on many blogs. Multiple windows side by side and even multiple desktops: the entire chorus agrees that 8 just cannot do it.

I am hands-on with Ubuntu, Mint and XP, I did have machines with Vista and 7 ultimate bot sold them. Oddly, Vista never gave me a single hassle.

This may help. Just use a fake email address from 10 minute mail and get a copy.

That is if you want to try learn about 8, before the downgrade.

 

[w1z4rd]

I need office functionality to get work done. And I need the traditional way to work with multiple windows, or then multiple desktops.

Windows 8 can be mind-blowing but it is not aimed at getting work done. It is only impressive if one's a teen with half a brain.

No, its very production orientated. I have no problems with it and as I said, I am constantly using multiple OS`s. Some people dont like change and have difficulty adapting to doing things differently. Its hard to unlearn things. You not been able to work outside the box is the problem here. You are used to doing something one way and have difficultly learning other ways. Even if they are more efficient. A start button is inefficient (takes up unnecessary screen real estate for a superfluous function). But you are so used to it its hard for you to break out of that rut.

I use multiple OS`s and none of them have a start button. Heck, most of mine dont even have task bars because theyre also outdated (but people in general are not ready to be without a task bar).

 

[reneg8or]

No, its very production orientated. I have no problems with it and as I said, I am constantly using multiple OS`s. Some people dont like change and have difficulty adapting to doing things differently. Its hard to unlearn things. You not been able to work outside the box is the problem here. You are used to doing something one way and have difficultly learning other ways. Even if they are more efficient. A start button is inefficient (takes up unnecessary screen real estate for a superfluous function). But you are so used to it its hard for you to break out of that rut.

I use multiple OS`s and none of them have a start button. Heck, most of mine dont even have task bars because theyre also outdated (but people in general are not ready to be without a task bar).

OK, so what is the story about "Windows not being Windows as there are no windows but just a window?" Incredible salesman cannot show me multiple documents open side-by-side on 8 and he says it is impossible. Now please tell me what the truth is here. I am used to drag-and-drop freely between Excel, Word, PowerPoint and then also to/from LibreOffice, all on one workspace. In Linux, I have my email and system utils on workspace 4, Libre on 3, browser ons 2 and immediate tasks and Skype on workspace 1.

I am even prepared to buy a lekker big screen to be doing my work, if it can work this way still.

 

[kingrob]

I just love all these people defending Microsoft for a crap OS....guess Microsoft can't do wrong anymore, cos their legion of followers will polish any turd for them.

The weird thing is....why doesn't the global sales of Windows 8 not reflect what you are saying?

Maybe you're just dumb and other people see it for what it is, or are we all stupid and you somehow saw the magic.

 

[reneg8or]

Thanks, AlphaJohn, I just placed my order.

And I will see if I can find a more clued-up computer dealer in Cape Town who has a proper demo machine.

 

[reneg8or]

I just love all these people defending Microsoft for a crap OS....guess Microsoft can't do wrong anymore, cos their legion of followers will polish any turd for them.

The weird thing is....why doesn't the global sales of Windows 8 not reflect what you are saying?

Maybe you're just dumb and other people see it for what it is, or are we all stupid and you somehow saw the magic.

The problem is this: 98% of gathered intelligence is incorrect. Discerning which 2% is correct, is the challenge of the military commander. CAR and our slain soldiers bear witness to that. The situation here is no different as comments generally are not based upon fact but opinion. Making an informed decision amidst obvious bias is not easy.

I just love Linux but have to think with my brain and not my heart. MS Windows is a superb OS, despite what critics say. I compare it side-by-side with Linux. Cost is a factor as I can order a Mecer notebook from ComX without an OS but, if I want Windows with the same level of encryption, it means 7 Ultimate 64 at well over R2k.

Then, I have a very expensive platform to run LibreOffice on - why not then get the full monty, spend another R2k+ and have MS Office? I just don't want to spend extra money to get what I already have - which is why I will never buy Apple. It is just too expensive of a platform to run LibreOffice on! If Apple were trouble-free, the price would have been justified. But no system is perfect and all have strengths and weaknesses.

 

[kilobits]

OK, so what is the story about "Windows not being Windows as there are no windows but just a window?" Incredible salesman cannot show me multiple documents open side-by-side on 8 and he says it is impossible. Now please tell me what the truth is here. I am used to drag-and-drop freely between Excel, Word, PowerPoint and then also to/from LibreOffice, all on one workspace. In Linux, I have my email and system utils on workspace 4, Libre on 3, browser ons 2 and immediate tasks and Skype on workspace 1.

I am even prepared to buy a lekker big screen to be doing my work, if it can work this way still.

Uhm... Windows 8 can do "multi-windows" and copy paste between multiple open applications open on the desktop all at the same time... see..

View attachment 45517

Just like any other Windows version.

Perhaps he means the Windows RT version on the surface tablet... the "arm" version of Windows... exclusively "Metro" apps only. Here you can only run "Metro" apps available from the MS Store, these can also share a screen, and here too info can be copied and pasted between these apps... more restrictive than Windows non RT.


Windows 8 = 7 = Vista = XP = 95 as far as multiple applications open on the desktop. no change here at all.

 

[reneg8or]

Uhm... Windows 8 can do "multi-windows" and copy paste between multiple open applications open on the desktop all at the same time... see..

View attachment 45517

Just like any other Windows version.

Perhaps he means the Windows RT version on the surface tablet... the "arm" version of Windows... exclusively "Metro" apps only. Here you can only run "Metro" apps available from the MS Store, these can also share a screen, and here too info can be copied and pasted between these apps... more restrictive than Windows non RT.


Windows 8 = 7 = Vista = XP = 95 as far as multiple applications open on the desktop. no change here at all.

Now what the hell are the multitudes of bloggers and "industry experts" on about - they have been lamenting the un-Windowing of Windows far and wide ever since the beta release of 8. And it is about time that young people selling computers and cell phones develop their skills by getting practical experience even if it means missing out on a few beers, buds, socialising and sleep. We old-timers acquired our wisdom in the wee hours of the morning and were prepared to work sometimes for an entire week with no proper break, other than a quick pie & Coke or the loo. We had the integrity to educate ourselves and, when I retired from this lot in 1999, I was considered a guru by anybody except myself.

I only have a matric and no IT training but my former employer's large business sailed seamlessly into 2000 while other branches and other stores had to fight corrupted data for months afterwards. I was so tired that I wasn't even awake when 2000 appeared. Not a hiccup anywhere in my domain, though. Some retailers found that their new computers still corrupted electronic invoices and inventories, modems could not switch, etc. I had NO trouble at my place of work.


Some with higher qualifications and who drove AS/400's while I only saddled up a LAN and a few servers, laughed at my solutions but they had to travel deep into the platteland to sort out the mess created by their systems! It had taken them between 2-3 months to get all data correctly restored and, even so, much of it had to be punched in by junior clerks working overtime - doing it manually.

 

[biometrics]

Just checked the Frontosa price list. They sell Vista, 7 and 8. No reason why you can't get 7 for years to come.

 

[DrJohnZoidberg]

Windows 8 is really, to me at least, an abomination. The only thing that saves it is some 3rd part software that makes it behave like Windows 7. Metro is the worst possible interface for a desktop computer. Microsoft should have taken a page from Apple's book and kept desktop and touch interfaces separate.

 

[w1z4rd]

Now what the hell are the multitudes of bloggers and "industry experts" on about - they have been lamenting the un-Windowing of Windows far and wide ever since the beta release of 8. .

You should have seen people cry when they introduced the the start button when they went from Windows 3.1 to Win95. People didnt wanna buy 95 because it was so different at first. I know my home PC stayed on Win3.1 cause my mom refused to upgrade at the time :/

 

[kilobits]

I dunno really what the hubbub and boohaahaa about 8 is.

Very simply, there is a "Normal" Windows 8 that runs on run-of-the-mill everyday desktop / laptop CPUs from Intel and AMD and all the compatible software. This version of Windows 8 has 2 "modes"... the normal Windows desktop that has been around for ever nearly, and the new "Metro" (yes, I know it's not called Metro no more) mode / interface. This Metro mode works with apps downloaded from the Microsoft Store... more than one of these apps can be active at the same time, and up to 3 can share the screen simultaneously. This Metro mode has been aimed at touch screens and tablets more than mouse and keyboard.

The old Start button has been removed and the Start Menu has been replaced by the Metro Desktop and the old shortcuts on the old Start Menu are now little squares called tiles on the "Metro" Desktop launcher. If you move your mouse to the bottom left corner of the screen the new hidden start button becomes visible, clicking on this gets you to your shortcuts - also pressing the Windows logo key on the keyboard does the same thing.

There is another version of Windows made for CPUs used in mobile phones and devices. This is called Windows 8 RT. You cannot run any software on this that can be run on the usual desktop / laptop machines with Intel and AMD type CPUs... you need to get Windows RT applications (apps) from the Microsoft Store. These and only these can be run on Windows RT. If the app is not available on the Microsoft Store, you cannot run it on Windows RT. This version is almost like Android or Apple IOS in the way you can install and use apps.

And that is it really.

If you have a laptop or desktop with an AMD or Intel CPU and you get Windows 8 on it, it is the version that will run applications in the same way as Windows 7, Vista, XP did. You will really only have to decide to work with the new way of working with the Metro / Start Menu or installing a free / $5 old type start menu launcher. You are not limited at all... except if you used Windows XP mode... this has been replaced with Hyper V that integrates virtual drives directly into the OS but requires a CPU that supports this - or you can install and use VMWare or Virtual Box.

 

[AlmightyBender]

Now what the hell are the multitudes of bloggers and "industry experts" on about - they have been lamenting the un-Windowing of Windows far and wide ever since the beta release of 8.

This is a very good question indeed and I cannot fathom an answer to it.

 

[reneg8or]

I dunno really what the hubbub and boohaahaa about 8 is.

Very simply, there is a "Normal" Windows 8 that runs on run-of-the-mill everyday desktop / laptop CPUs from Intel and AMD and all the compatible software. This version of Windows 8 has 2 "modes"... the normal Windows desktop that has been around for ever nearly, and the new "Metro" (yes, I know it's not called Metro no more) mode / interface. This Metro mode works with apps downloaded from the Microsoft Store... more than one of these apps can be active at the same time, and up to 3 can share the screen simultaneously. This Metro mode has been aimed at touch screens and tablets more than mouse and keyboard.

The old Start button has been removed and the Start Menu has been replaced by the Metro Desktop and the old shortcuts on the old Start Menu are now little squares called tiles on the "Metro" Desktop launcher. If you move your mouse to the bottom left corner of the screen the new hidden start button becomes visible, clicking on this gets you to your shortcuts - also pressing the Windows logo key on the keyboard does the same thing.

There is another version of Windows made for CPUs used in mobile phones and devices. This is called Windows 8 RT. You cannot run any software on this that can be run on the usual desktop / laptop machines with Intel and AMD type CPUs... you need to get Windows RT applications (apps) from the Microsoft Store. These and only these can be run on Windows RT. If the app is not available on the Microsoft Store, you cannot run it on Windows RT. This version is almost like Android or Apple IOS in the way you can install and use apps.

And that is it really.

If you have a laptop or desktop with an AMD or Intel CPU and you get Windows 8 on it, it is the version that will run applications in the same way as Windows 7, Vista, XP did. You will really only have to decide to work with the new way of working with the Metro / Start Menu or installing a free / $5 old type start menu launcher. You are not limited at all... except if you used Windows XP mode... this has been replaced with Hyper V that integrates virtual drives directly into the OS but requires a CPU that supports this - or you can install and use VMWare or Virtual Box.

I hope your next job is to review software for major publications. It seems that both MS and BB get targeted by disinformation to sway people towards Android. Truth is that BB is by far the most secure mobile OS and it is currently outselling even its nearest competitor, Nokia, six to one in the Asia-Pacific region, South America, Africa, Indonesia, Phillipines, etc.

I was treated badly on three Linux forums and that made me reconsider. Some of the frigid rigid stalwarts are autocrats who are totally intolerant even of the most mundane mistakes. Newcomers get zapped in no time. Two very nice people, though, did much to restore my confidence. AlphaJohn & DrJohnZoidberg.

I am not sure if I can share space with some others, though.

 

[reneg8or]

Windows 8 is really, to me at least, an abomination. The only thing that saves it is some 3rd part software that makes it behave like Windows 7. Metro is the worst possible interface for a desktop computer. Microsoft should have taken a page from Apple's book and kept desktop and touch interfaces separate.

8 seems to lack the BitLocker that came with 7 Ultimate. I need to research this a bit.

Windows users can also benefit from TrueCrypt which is a Linux service as far as I know and it can also be set to load before Windows. I have used it within XP, though, to encrypt data folders and also my SD cards and flash drives. Ubuntu 12.10 encrypts your entire installation if you so prefer but you can still encrypt your home folder separately.