US Election 2020

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Gnarls said:
Apply that to South Africa where we have huge structural unemployment. You might think that it is exploitation but if you were an entrepreneur struggling to get your business going, labour is going to be your biggest expense and your perspective is going to be much different.

I'd also like to add that we need more entrepreneurs. Ideally, I think we want the same thing - a living wage for all. I just think that the free market can solve this problem better than government can. Also, we live in cancel culture. I can only speak for myself but I won't support a company with exploitative business practices.

I am against taking that choice away from the person selling their labour.



Artificial caps or floors disrupt supply and demand. Demand will adjust accordingly. Simple economics.
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I think the redirection to SA here is a massive and pointless red herring. What works in one place doesn't necessarily work elsewhere, wouldn't you agree? It depends on specific circumstances, and SA's circumstances are drastically different.

Do you think the US is more comparable to SA or a place like Australia or NZ, or anywhere in Western/Northern Europe, for example?

Why can those countries have low unemployment and much higher minimum wages but the US can't?

In fact, in Australia, they found lifting the minimum wage increased employment.
 
Murkowski is furrowing her brow.

www.businessinsider.com.au

Sen. Lisa Murkowski calls Mattis' scathing essay about Trump 'true, honest,' and 'overdue,' says she's struggling to support the president in 2020

In one of the strongest rebukes of President Donald Trump from any Republican in Congress, Sen. Lisa Murkowski of Alaska told reporters she supported former Defence Secretary James Mattis speaking out against the president. Murkowski had generally avoided direct condemnations of Trump, often...
www.businessinsider.com.au www.businessinsider.com.au
 
*Sad trombone

Ukraine found no evidence against Hunter Biden in case audit: former top prosecutor

KIEV (Reuters) - An audit of thousands of old case files by Ukrainian prosecutors found no evidence of wrongdoing on the part of Hunter Biden, the former prosecutor general, who had launched the audit, told Reuters.

Ruslan Ryaboshapka was in the spotlight last year as the man who would decide whether to launch an investigation into former Vice President Joe Biden and his son Hunter, in what became a key issue in the impeachment of President Donald Trump.

President Volodymyr Zelenskiy described Ryaboshapka as “100 percent my person” on a call in July 2019 in which Trump asked Zelenskiy to investigate Biden, the man who became his main rival in the 2020 presidential race.

After taking office, Ryaboshapka in October announced an audit of old cases he inherited, including those related to the energy company Burisma, where Hunter Biden was a board member between 2014-2019.

The audit was intended to probe whether cases Ryaboshapka had inherited from his predecessors had been handled properly, given the reputation of the prosecution service as being riddled with corruption and influence-peddling.

The audit was part of a broader reform of the prosecution service but became politically charged given some of the cases related to Burisma’s founder.

“Regarding the call to Zelenskiy and this story with Burisma. I can say that there was no pressure on me,” Ryaboshapka said. “The audit was completed.”

“I specifically asked prosecutors to check especially carefully those facts about Biden’s alleged involvement. They answered that there was nothing of the kind,” he added.

Ryaboshapka was fired in March after lawmakers accused him of not moving quickly enough in prosecuting cases. Ryaboshapka said he was axed because he had started bringing real reform to the prosecution service for the first time in a way that threatened the interests of corrupt politicians.

Trump was impeached on charges of abuse of power and obstruction in the Democratic-led House of Representatives after he asked Ukraine to investigate the Bidens. He was acquitted by the Republican-controlled Senate.

Hunter Biden’s activities at Burisma have also been the target of scrutiny by a U.S. Senate committee.

Unwittingly caught up in the impeachment row last year, Zelenskiy has said Ukrainians are “tired” of the issue and does not want Ukraine being dragged into the 2020 presidential race.
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OrbitalDawn said:
I think the redirection to SA here is a massive and pointless red herring. What works in one place doesn't necessarily work elsewhere, wouldn't you agree? It depends on specific circumstances, and SA's circumstances are drastically different.

Do you think the US is more comparable to SA or a place like Australia or NZ, or anywhere in Western/Northern Europe, for example?

Why can those countries have low unemployment and much higher minimum wages but the US can't?

In fact, in Australia, they found lifting the minimum wage increased employment.
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No, this is economics. Artificial caps and floors don't work. Any first year economics student will tell you this. Also see below:

This paper evaluates the wage, employment, and hours effects of the first and second phase-in of the Seattle Minimum Wage Ordinance, which raised the minimum wage from $9.47 to as much as $11 in 2015 and to as much as $13 in 2016. Using a variety of methods to analyze employment in all sectors paying below a specified real hourly wage rate, we conclude that the second wage increase to $13 reduced hours worked in low-wage jobs by 6-7 percent, while hourly wages in such jobs increased by 3 percent. Consequently, total payroll for such jobs decreased, implying that the Ordinance lowered the amount paid to workers in low-wage jobs by an average of $74 per month per job in 2016. Evidence attributes more modest effects to the first wage increase. We estimate an effect of zero when analyzing employment in the restaurant industry at all wage levels, comparable to many prior studies.

Source
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Trump, 1990, on Tiananmen Square:

When the students poured into Tiananmen Square, the Chinese government almost blew it. Then they were vicious, they were horrible, but they put it down with strength. That shows you the power of strength. Our country is right now perceived as weak... as being spit on by the rest of the world.
 
Gnarls said:
No, this is economics. Artificial caps and floors don't work. Any first year economics student will tell you this. Also see below:
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I literally just gave you evidence it does. Or should we rather say, can?

There are some problems with the Seattle study and trying to extrapolate its findings, though. Worth reading. It also links some large studies that are worth consider, like this one:

"Cenzig et al’s (2018) analysis of 138 state-level minimum wage increases, including those as high as Seattle’s, which finds no significant evidence of reduced employment among low-wage workers, including among new entrants and incumbents."

And regarding Seattle specifically, peak unemployment just before the increase happened was 4.5%. It kept on decreasing as the wage rose, to 2.6%.

And this study found that in the hospitality industry, the most affected one, wages increased and there was no discernible drop in employment. In fact there was a boom in restaurant openings.

And if your business model doesn't work without exploiting labour, there's clearly a problem.

And again, this is not the case in Australasia, the advanced Asian economies, Western or Northern Europe. They have very low unemployment and higher minimum wages.

Why can't the US manage it?
 
rietrot said:
News polls doesn't mean anything. I can vote disapprove now if I think he didn't take harsh enough action.
I can't even seem to find very basic mythology like how many people were polled and from were.
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Captain tryhard over there's attempt at propaganda and manufacturing consent using MSM.
 
OrbitalDawn said:
I literally just gave you evidence it does. Or should we rather say, can?
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Dude, you said applying it to SA is a pointless red herring. It's not, it's economics.

Also, the policy doesn't appear to solve the problem

Unfortunately, the empirical evidence hasn’t borne this out. Instead, multiple studies have demonstrated little to no relationship between a higher minimum wage and reductions in poverty.

Economists have identified three confounding factors: First, many people living in poverty don’t work and thus cannot benefit from a higher wage; second, a large number of minimum wage earners are not living in poor families; finally, raising the minimum wage can have the unintended consequence of reducing demand for the least-skilled employees.

Source
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As rietrot stated, you're simply pricing out the lower and younger portion of your economic workforce.

OrbitalDawn said:
And if your business model doesn't work without exploiting labour, there's clearly a problem.
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This argument is a nonsense guy.
 
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rietrot said:
News polls doesn't mean anything. I can vote disapprove now if I think he didn't take harsh enough action.
I can't even seem to find very basic mythology like how many people were polled and from were.
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Not everything you believe is a myth my brother and there are methods to find it out. :p
 
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