Voting?

[RVQ]

what if there isn't any party you believe in? Then you did vote, with your absinthe. The DA's increase in votes in Pretoria in the previous municipal election was as a result of ANC members not voting.

Then what is your solution or is it that you do not believe there is a problem?

 

[doubletrouble]

If God wanted us to vote, He would give us suitable candidates to vote for

 

[Nicodeamus]

Newsflash... people DO win the lotto. [

yes 1 in 20 million, however for the other 19million 9hundred thousand, 9thousand and 99, the Lotto might as well be called Idiot tax.

My wife got an illness that only affects one in ten million people.

so what? the chances of me having the same illness is probably also 10/1million, however that is irrelevant.

And then she got it again three years later... and the chances of that were one in a hundred million.

not really, her chances were probably higher, given that she already had the first illness her body or metabolism might have been more susceptible to the sickness.
You're also assuming population homogeneity. Someone with a weak immune system or an immune system that is more susceptible to illness A is more likely to get it get it again.

There have been plenty of examples, did you even look through the links I gave, or are you just blustering on in your own ignorance?

Just because I don't agree with you I am ignorant? I glances through 3 links that you gave me and yes I didn't bother to read them all as they said more or less the same thing.

Condition A occurred in place A, therefore it is likely to happen to you! (surely you can see that this is failed logic)

I also did enough mathematics and probability to know that my chances to chance the outcome of an election decreases with greater voter participation, in the previous SA elections voter participation increased.

Yes an individual decision CAN chance the outcome, however given the amount of times it has done so and given the fact that in my ward the winning party gets in by almost a majority (DA ward), there is absolutely no chance that my vote will determine the outcome of the election. If there were only 4 people voting, then that might make a bit of a difference. However that is unlikely, if not impossible to happen.

 

[Nicodeamus]

Then what is your solution or is it that you do not believe there is a problem?

First define the problem. All the parties campaign and want government to do things, I want them to stop doing things.

 

[Nicodeamus]

Every vote counts. If 5 million people abstain then that could have been 5 million individual votes going to another party. If every single person just votes following their brain/logic/common sense then it would make a big difference. Take emotion out of the equation.

it could also have meant 5 million votes going to the ANC, in fact most of the obstained voters in the last election were voters who previously voted for the ANC (of those who already voted). Would you have them go back and vote for the ANC?

 

[LazyLion]

apathy and laziness FTW!

 

[ponder]

Would you have them go back and vote for the ANC?

I would want them to use logic & common sense instead of voting with emotion & some long lost sense of obligation. If you can't do that then you deserve what the government gives you.

 

[Garson007]

I am a big fan and supporter of the DA, because I've seen their work and the subsequent related improvements that result, BUT, I have, and have had, a gripe with them for a very long time now...

WHY THE #@%^ DO THEY NOT COMMIT THEMSELVES TO VOTER EDUCATION?!

The story contained within this thread is neither new nor shocking, it's general knowledge, as far as I'm concerned.

"ANC or nothing."

That is many things, mostly lunacy and idiocy, but it stems almost entirely from a lack of [voter] education.

TEACH the ANC-failed people what Democracy is, how it works, what a vote entails and means and how best to use it.

I have traveled across large parts of ZA, some atrocious and some not so, but in a personal capacity, I will confidently tell you that there are very large areas of our country which are inhabited by the predominant type the ANC prey on for blind support. Nothing much has changed in these areas since '94.

Easy pickings for an opposition party...

DA: We know how great you can be, how about actively converting the rest of us now?

NOTE: This actually applies to any and all opposition parties, but the DA were the ones in question and are the largest of the lot.

Exactly!

Adult people don't even know how our system works. Everyone should know what the national assembly is, how many seats it has and how it works. Same goes for the council of provinces. Etcetera. There is a huge dearth in political education of South Africans. I have absolutely no idea why there aren't many lectures based on this during high school life orientation periods.

The problem is that the DA is supremely biased. What we need is for the IEC to hold massive gatherings of people to educate them about how the system works.

 

[RVQ]

First define the problem. All the parties campaign and want government to do things, I want them to stop doing things.

So you don't see a problem in SA...

 

[Garson007]

To vote for either of them is to give my explicit approval to the process

[mod cut]There is nothing wrong with our electoral process.

I do however agree that DA does not stand for what I stand, so I will not be voting them. Closer to the time I'll pick out some small party that might not even win a seat, but so be it. It's part of the process.

 

[Pitbull]

Why do some people love to generalise?

I've been speaking to a petrol attendant for months and learned that he had matric. He is in his 20's. So don't assume everyone is uneducated.

Erm, no one said that because he is a petrol attendant that he is uneducated (except for you). He is however uneducated if he refuses to vote for the ANC and then doesn't vote instead of voting for another party.

Not voting is a vote in itself for the ruling party. So the ANC still get's his vote in a way even if he doesn't vote.

 

[Merlin]

@Merlin it's a costly, time consuming and dangerous process. With limited resources trying to fight the might of the ANC is like trying to convince a Church full of people that God doesn't exist. That said there are continuous campaigns in ANC strongholds like Soweto, Alex but we will only see change when average Joe chooses the future of this country/planet over time standing in line for the latest iPhone or Gaga tickets.

There are millions of ANC members but how many people do you know that are active members of one of the other parties?

Sometimes small gestures can make big waves.

We live in the viral marketing age...

I can think of a number of examples, but one that sticks out to me is a personal experience from a few years ago. I was out cycling in my suburb when I came across a real estate agent who, of her own accord, had stopped to pick up a widespread field of litter next to and across the main road. Yes, she probably was doing it in order to improve the immediate area and thus improve the probability of a sale for her at the adjacent complex, BUT, she had taken the time and expended the effort to start the cleaning process. I was so impressed that I put my bike down and helped her for a good twenty minutes until the area was spotless. I don't know if she ever said thank you, I can't recall, but I liked how she operated and I think of the day whenever I see her car around town.

Whilst we were busy with that cleaning operation, there was an intermittent cacophony from passing motorists hooting at our efforts. No-one else stopped, but they appreciated it and I'm sure they spoke about it with others later on. Next time, they might stop and help...

Do you see my point?

I don't know even one active DA member personally. I'm sure there are some here in the office but they are awfully quiet about it. The ANC members that I happen to know are very vocal about it.

That's probably because the DA members are working hard to change things, not sitting around mumbling inane tripe about inexcusable political failings and potential criminal actions.

To the poster who asked about voter education: parties campaigning and being out there in public and delivering good services in the areas in which they are in power IS = voter education.

Yes, I agree, but we need more of it!

However, there are a lot of people who just won't vote at all. My girlfriend being one of those people. She says that voting will do nothing. It won't effect her - She is a DA supporter. However won't vote for them. Trying to reason with her always ends up in a fight, so, I don't bother anymore.

I will definitely be voting for DA. Reason: I want change. For me, personally, the ANC have done nothing but made things worse. The DA is a glimmer of hope. Might not be a perfect party - but they're better than the ANC.

You will find a lot of black people voting ANC. Why?

Loyalty; for what they did 18 years ago.

I wish, people would see what the ANC have done in recent times and see, that this is not how a party should go about delivering services to its people.

You're far more tolerant than I. It is irresponsible, near criminal and downright dangerous to overlook your vote. If she doesn't vote, I hope she understands that she's essentially conceded all rights whatsoever to complain about anything the government has control over.

What, exactly, did the ANC do 18 years ago? Please, for the love of something holy, don't reply by telling me that they ended Apartheid.

 

[Hemps]

I do however agree that DA does not stand for what I stand, so I will not be voting them. Closer to the time I'll pick out some small party that might not even win a seat, but so be it. It's part of the process.

Maybe you should think about everyone else then, although you might not agree with the DA , the country will move forward with them in charge,at the moment it's stagnant.

 

[Grimspoon]

Maybe you should think about everyone else then, although you might not agree with the DA , the country will move forward with them in charge,at the moment it's going down the tubes.

Fixed.

 

[Merlin]

Maybe you should think about everyone else then, although you might not agree with the DA , the country will move forward with them in charge,at the moment it's stagnant.

No, it's not. We're in free fall.

 

[Priapus]

You're far more tolerant than I. It is irresponsible, near criminal and downright dangerous to overlook your vote. If she doesn't vote, I hope she understands that she's essentially conceded all rights whatsoever to complain about anything the government has control over.

[/i].

I'm sorry, I actually forgot to add that to my post. She conceded that yes, she has zero right to complain about government and the way things are going. She doesn't complain. So, I give her that.

Over the next year, I will be doing more to convince her to vote - small steps.

 

[Cool E]

It seems DA members are starting to recruit here on MYBB.

Shame i will never leave myANC.

 

[Garson007]

Maybe you should think about everyone else then, although you might not agree with the DA , the country will move forward with them in charge,at the moment it's stagnant.

I'm not going to vote for someone that doesn't represent me. It defeats the purpose of voting.

 

[Hemps]

I'm not going to vote for someone that doesn't represent me. It defeats the purpose of voting.

In what City do you live in?
I live in East London, every morning when I drive to work I have to avoid 24 potholes, on the pavements I see litter lying everywhere, I then read in the newspapers about money that our ANC run municipality has made vanish, we then have to listen to countless excuses why things don't get repaired.
Beginning of the year I was in Cape Town, felt like I had entered another country, the road was being fixed, people cleaning the pavements and surrounds, I could feel the change in the air.

 

[Cool E]

In what City do you live in?
I live in East London, every morning when I drive to work I have to avoid 24 potholes, on the pavements I see litter lying everywhere, I then read in the newspapers about money that our ANC run municipality has made vanish.
Beginning of the year I was in Cape Town, felt like I had entered another country, the road was being fixed, people cleaning the pavements and surrounds, I could feel the change in the air.

are you trying to say if DA wins , they will fix all potholes in the country?