Why attacks against foreigners are not viewed in the same light?

intel8080 said:
Attacks against foreigners in South Africa, are (correctly) called Xenophobia. The very same attacks in Greece are "racist" hate crimes. WTF
http://www.iol.co.za/news/crime-courts/foreigners-shops-looted-in-kroonstad-1.1524810
http://www.iol.co.za/news/crime-courts/pe-cops-arrest-21-for-violence-1.1524834
And in Greece: http://www.iol.co.za/news/world/hate-crimes-divide-greek-coalition-1.1524814
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Xenophobia and racism is the same thing, except in SA black people cannot be racist in the media and thus "Xenophobia"
 
I don't think you are thinking this through, a zulu killing a shona because they are shona is not racism or is it? A zulu killing a somali because they are somali might be racist since we have been conditioned to see somalis as different, the difference between a shona and a zulu is also due to conditioning, there really is no difference, a zulu killing a white man because they are white is racist, but then this difference has also been taught

Now, a frenchman killing a dutchman because they are dutch is not racist by the same token, a french man killing a slovak because they are slovak is also not racist, a frenchman killing a zulu because they are zulu is racist

Well, this was a waste of time, not helpful at all, need to think some more
 
mine_dump said:
I don't think you are thinking this through, a zulu killing a shona because they are shona is not racism or is it? A zulu killing a somali because they are somali might be racist since we have been conditioned to see somalis as different, the difference between a shona and a zulu is also due to conditioning, there really is no difference, a zulu killing a white man because they are white is racist, but then this difference has also been taught

Now, a frenchman killing a dutchman because they are dutch is not racist by the same token, a french man killing a slovak because they are slovak is also not racist, a frenchman killing a zulu because they are zulu is racist

Well, this was a waste of time, not helpful at all, need to think some more
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NO.
A frenchman killing a zulu because he is BLACK is racist. A frenchman killing a zulu because he's zulu is xenophobic.
Anyway, I thought we were all part of the human race? So if someone cries racist when I insult him, is he admitting he's not human?
 
Sinbad said:
NO.
A frenchman killing a zulu because he is BLACK is racist. A frenchman killing a zulu because he's zulu is xenophobic.
Anyway, I thought we were all part of the human race? So if someone cries racist when I insult him, is he admitting he's not human?
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Are you not confusing 'race' with 'species'. I believe the movie StarTrek in the late 60's, stated the confusion and now even 'aliens' from other worlds are simply called 'a different race'. The South African movie District9, used this very same confusion when they asked 'the locals' in South Africa, what they think about the 'aliens'. The confusion went so far that even the ANC government used to refer to the immigrants as 'aliens' WTF This is what happened when a county chooses to internally communicate in a foreign language.
 
Sinbad said:
NO.
A frenchman killing a zulu because he is BLACK is racist. A frenchman killing a zulu because he's zulu is xenophobic.
Anyway, I thought we were all part of the human race? So if someone cries racist when I insult him, is he admitting he's not human?
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This is where my life is simple. I hate everyone of the human race equally :D
 
intel8080 said:
Are you not confusing 'race' with 'species'. I believe the movie StarTrek in the late 60's, stated the confusion and now even 'aliens' from other worlds are simply called 'a different race'. The South African movie District9, used this very same confusion when they asked 'the locals' in South Africa, what they think about the 'aliens'. The confusion went so far that even the ANC government used to refer to the immigrants as 'aliens' WTF This is what happened when a county chooses to internally communicate in a foreign language.
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Why do we speak of human race then? I've never heard reference to a black race or a white race...
 
Fudzy said:
Wow... just wow, species? Don't you mean ethnicity? And alien is a common term for a non-resident of a country, btw.
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Oh Fudzy. Never mind. Did you bother to read his post? Do you understand the meaning thereof? But then again - never mind.
 
Madman88 said:
Xenophobia and racism is the same thing, except in SA black people cannot be racist in the media and thus "Xenophobia"
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Ditto. It was an excuse lodged by Zuma and his criminal elite gang to give the [-]prove[/-]impression they are not racists. It softened the blow of reality. The other excuse of cause is justified [-]racism[/-]prejudice and legalized discrimination against young white South Africans.
 
Sinbad said:
Why do we speak of human race then? I've never heard reference to a black race or a white race...
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Because of confused people :D Here is a helpful link which places humans in context.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human
A species can further be divided in subspecies and races and then ethnicity and families. But don't worry. Even people 'in knowing' are mixing up things on occasion.
 
intel8080 said:
Are you not confusing 'race' with 'species'. I believe the movie StarTrek in the late 60's, stated the confusion and now even 'aliens' from other worlds are simply called 'a different race'. The South African movie District9, used this very same confusion when they asked 'the locals' in South Africa, what they think about the 'aliens'. The confusion went so far that even the ANC government used to refer to the immigrants as 'aliens' WTF This is what happened when a county chooses to internally communicate in a foreign language.
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In Star Trek they discovered unknown species, made contact and some being accepted into the Federation under conditions, thus is not Alien anymore.

Alien:

ADJ:
- Owing political allegiance to another country or government; foreign: alien residents.
- Belonging to, characteristic of, or constituting another and very different place, society, or person; strange. See Synonyms at foreign.
- Dissimilar, inconsistent, or opposed, as in nature: emotions alien to her temperament.

N:
- An unnaturalized foreign resident of a country. Also called noncitizen.
- A person from another and very different family, people, or place.
- A person who is not included in a group; an outsider.
- A creature from outer space: a story about an invasion of aliens. - District 9 never moved beyond this point, the audience required to understand this in layman terms
- Ecology An organism, especially a plant or animal, that occurs in or is naturalized in a region to which it is not native.

In SA there is various groups being alienated and this is where Xenophobia occurs.
 
Sinbad said:
Why do we speak of human race then? I've never heard reference to a black race or a white race...
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There is always the ol' nazi reference of white skin, blue eyes, blonde hair - Aryan Race. I think the term "human race" is arbitrary in the sense that it is referring to a species as a whole where race should be more of a sub species reference. For example -eagles have different sub species based on appearance, size etc... one could argue that humans share the similar differences based on appearance, bone structure, origin etc.

I know some people may be super keen to blow the "we are all the same you racist pig" horn, and I will respond by pointing out that nigerians are generally very tall (6foot and up) and asians are generally quite short (5 foot and down), vikings were massive, brits were tiny, the facial structure of different "races" is obvious... therefor we all fit into sub-species of the human species.

Race should therefor (based on the above theory) be interchangeable with sub-species.

I think the reason this is so confusing for humans is simply our breeding habits, we don't bar inter-species relations where in other parts of nature... well... you don't see a bunch of half emperor half jackass penguins running around.

If a fight is territorial it is xenophobic, if it is based on "i don't like your skin color" it is racist, if it is "i don't like your religion" you are a bigot, if it is "i don't like the shape of your nose" you are a dick - there are way to many reasons for people to knock each other off to find a socially acceptable name for them all. Common courtesy would dictate that attackers ought to declare why they are trying to smear them off the face of the earth.
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenophobia

Xenophobia is a very human but irrational or unreasoned fear of that which is perceived to be foreign or strange.[1][2] It comes from the Greek words ξένος (xenos), meaning "stranger," "foreigner," and φόβος (phobos), meaning "fear."[3]
Xenophobia can manifest itself in many ways involving the relations and perceptions of an ingroup towards an outgroup, including a fear of losing identity, suspicion of its activities, aggression, and desire to eliminate its presence to secure a presumed purity.[4] Xenophobia can also be exhibited in the form of an "uncritical exaltation of another culture" in which a culture is ascribed "an unreal, stereotyped and exotic quality".[5] Vienna Declaration and Programme of Action urges all governments to take immediate measures and to develop strong policies to prevent and combat all forms and manifestations of racism, xenophobia or related intolerance, where necessary by enactment of appropriate legislation including penal measure.[6]
....

Dictionary definitions of xenophobia include: deep-rooted, irrational hatred towards foreigners (Oxford English Dictionary; OED), unreasonable fear or hatred of the unfamiliar.(Webster's)[7]
A xenophobic person has to genuinely think or believe at some level that the target is in fact a foreigner. This arguably separates xenophobia from ordinary prejudice. In various contexts, the terms "xenophobia" and "racism" seem to be used interchangeably, though they can have wholly different meanings (xenophobia can be based on various aspects, racism being based solely on ethnicity, and ancestry). Xenophobia can also be directed simply to anyone outside a culture. Basically, a completely biased opinion regarding foreign matters.
Stereotypes arise from a fundamental human knowledge structure, the concept which generalizes prototypes from many instances. The problem comes when you start discriminating based on these stereotype in ways that counter accepted cultural values. Discriminating is the act where stereotyping is the thought process. When discriminating you start attributing good and bad evaluations of people based on that stereotype.
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Electron1 said:
[URL="Xenophobia[/URL]
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Xenophobia is a very human but irrational or unreasoned fear of that which is perceived to be foreign or strange.[
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Read that and comprehend it?

Are these people attacking the foreigners fearing them? NO! Do they think these foreigners are strange? NO!

They know who and what they are but prefer to chase them away and kill them because they achieve what the locals can not i.e make a better life for themselves and run a business. It's the not haves trying to get rid of those that have made a success locally as they perceive these people are taking something away from them. Now eat that you imbeciles that believe differently.

They are savages of the worst kind.
 
Seriously said:
Read that and comprehend it?

Are these people attacking the foreigners fearing them? NO! Do they think these foreigners are strange? NO!

They know who and what they are but prefer to chase them away and kill them because they achieve what the locals can not i.e make a better life for themselves and run a business. It's the not haves trying to get rid of those that have made a success locally as they perceive these people are taking something away from them. Now eat that you imbeciles that believe differently.

They are savages of the worst kind.
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I think they are fearing those who come into their communities and cause crime and extra strain on our already failing social welfare programmes.
 
Fudzy said:
I think they are fearing those who come into their communities and cause crime and extra strain on our already failing social welfare programmes.
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Well there are more of them creating their own crime in the first place. They must thank Zuma and the ANC for their current poverty and circumstances and for opening the borders to everyone from the north. Vote for the ANC if you want the country to become even more infested with foreigners.
 
Seriously said:
Well there are more of them creating their own crime in the first place. They must thank Zuma and the ANC for their current poverty and circumstances and for opening the borders to everyone from the north. Vote for the ANC if you want the country to become even more infested with foreigners.
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Well yes, hopefully they are learning this now. Open borders FTL.
 
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