Your Thoughts, Please

[Lycanthrope]

i'm also on facebook Lycanthrope, but we seem to find different forums. compared to many of the COPE and VF+ supporter groups i visit, the ANC facebook group is FAR superior. all you have to do is look at the individuals and the people that speak up.

To be honest, Facebook holds no real appeal for me. I just stumbled across the ANC's Facebook group thanks to blunomore's one thread in the Current Affairs section. I wanted to find out why they support the ANC and compare their chosen "leaders" to mine.

I'm over it though - dealing with imbeciles who insist on voting for a political party based on the colour of their skin, or because it's "the party" they believe in, not the current leader (Zuma) and that Zuma isn't forever, but the ANC is, is like discussing the meaning of life with a patch of turnips.

For all I know, there might be truth to what they say, but I've lived under ANC constituency and experienced "international" standards and government long enough to know that the ANC is not good for this country or its people.

In fact, I believe that Inkwenkwe (Malema) is the voice through which the majority of the ANC speak - and all of them think the exact same way he does. The only difference is that Inkwenkwe isn't afraid to open his trap. I also certainly doubt that the ANC leaders, cabinet, etc are any different.

I believe that most of them harbour racism and hatred to whites, and even to their own kind who can see past the racial tension and "dare" to be friends with us.

I've joined the DA Group on Facebook and have had the privilege of reading some of the groups discussions and posts. I think it's awesome. One guy in particular, Zak Mbhele, has actually astounded me with his reason and logic. I think he's frikkin' awesome.

The comparison between the ANC and the DA... Jeez... It's what excrement is to cream.

 

[Lycanthrope]

Make no mistake, I think Zuma is a clown and I'm not an ANC supporter, but I'm adamant he didn't rape that woman. If you followed the whole thing, you'd remember that it came out in court that she did in fact cry rape a previous time as well (with someone else, not Zuma), and that charge also didn't stick.

To be honest, I wasn't aware of that. But thank you for informing me I actually feel the need to look it up and find out more. I guess it's true... We're always eager to lay blame on the ones we despise instead of taking a moment to step back and be certain.

Thanks.

 

[STS]

To be honest, Facebook holds no real appeal for me. I just stumbled across the ANC's Facebook group thanks to blunomore's one thread in the Current Affairs section. I wanted to find out why they support the ANC and compare their chosen "leaders" to mine.
I believe that most of them harbour racism and hatred to whites, and even to their own kind who can see past the racial tension and "dare" to be friends with us.

The comparison between the ANC and the DA... Jeez... It's what excrement is to cream.

i have a problem with facebook, some days work is boring and i'm addicted to it i would have ignored the ANC's group altogether if it wasn't for people writing to me and telling me that i should criticise them when the ANC said even worse things than they did. so i went to the group and was impressed with what was there, however i haven't been to the DA's group yet

i think a lot of black people do have a resentment towards white people, but i experience more white racism because of the area i live and the people i work with, so it's a more apparent problem to me i won't deny that it's there, i've even come across it, but i come across it far more seldom than most others, so my perspective will be different

 

[Alan]

the difference is Madiba wasn't Mugabe, and neither is Zuma. who's playing the race card now? how were races that were previously seperated suppose to integrate into a new South Africa? poof! magic overnight, and the ANC scores!

Only you've played the race card.

i know a lot of parties represent freedom. i also know a lot of parties have different focuses, am i suppose to vote for a party that doesn't agree with my focus? the thing about when voting for a party isn't about who is the most moral or the best person, it's how do I benefit and ensure a better future for myself?

Perhaps you should vote for the party that ensures a better future for the country instead.

stop assuming people are impersonal cattle who don't have lives or personalities, and only live to make your life harder by voting for a party that you hate.

They must have pretty warped personalities and lives to vote ANC then

 

[Lycanthrope]

i have a problem with facebook, some days work is boring and i'm addicted to it i would have ignored the ANC's group altogether if it wasn't for people writing to me and telling me that i should criticise them when the ANC said even worse things than they did. so i went to the group and was impressed with what was there, however i haven't been to the DA's group yet

i think a lot of black people do have a resentment towards white people, but i experience more white racism because of the area i live and the people i work with, so it's a more apparent problem to me i won't deny that it's there, i've even come across it, but i come across it far more seldom than most others, so my perspective will be different

*nod*

I doubt I'd ever deny that we have "white racists." But I think that a number of people branded as "racists" end up getting frustrated with a barrage of generalisation. You drive your car, a taxi swerves right in front of you -narrowly missing your car - a black dude's driving it. One point on the racial-meter. You're walking around in Pick 'n Pay, a black woman starts screaming in your ear, jams her trolley into your heel or whatever. A few more points add on. You're happily minding your own business and you get mugged at gunpoint by a black dude. A few more points. Hijacked, more and more points. Oh, look, that sonofabitch just spat out phlegm right in front of you, narrowly missing you.

White people are a minority. It's only inevitable that more black people would work on your tits because there's that much more of them. So it becomes a racial stigmatisation when your best friend might be a black guy or girl. Obviously it's a generalisation, and it's not always something directed at "black people" so much as it is perhaps "black South Africans."

*sigh* I think I'm failing miserably at getting my point across. I just think people notice "skin" when they get frustrated long before they notice gender, or social status or whatever. I'm not saying that's a good thing... But I just think that's how it plays out more often than not.

I also feel like it's not only a white thing, but that blacks feel the same and have the exact same generalised frustrations.

Someone shoot me... My brain isn't in the right place today

 

[STS]

i read your posts and they were very well thought out, i felt like the first guy was very unfair to you, but he might of just had bad experiences there is also another situation that we rarely notice, that how often bad things DON'T happen it's hard for people to imagine good things about taxis, and the news just reinforces bad images, but we so often miss the road-worthy taxis and the decent drivers.

another way is that it could be said that all white people are racist, when they walk past 15 nice white people, and they barely notice it, and then one white person is rude and says a racially insulting word, and they feel like the stereotype has been reinforced again. the reason we don't notice good taxi's and taxi drivers is becoz they dont' affect our life negatively, they stay out of the light and press it's the same with african newspapers, they're rather claim hate speech and hate crimes than report on how well a community is doing.

it is too early, i want ot go back to bed!

 

[DeadCore]

why did the black guy call him a dog,oh i forgot he is racist

 

[STS]

Only you've played the race card.

Perhaps you should vote for the party that ensures a better future for the country instead.

They must have pretty warped personalities and lives to vote ANC then

that is what a vote is, it's up to them to decide. is the majority warped? imagine if the warped minority had to decide, or the decision of one man.

better future for you = better future for your country. what good is your country if you don't have a future in it?

you just stated how much worse things have been since the ANC has been elected, and i made a joke. life WOULD be dramatically better if youcould go anywhere without havign to carry an ID all the time, and not having to be seperated becoz of yoru race. even you have to concede that that has improved our country.

 

[Lycanthrope]

haha @ smalltownsky

I agree completely. To be honest, one of my other half's colleagues at work was mentioning how her taxi driver stopped at the side of the road to see if a person lying there was all right. I actually thought that was pretty impressive - not to mention commendable.

Unfortunately, I don't think all taxies and taxi drivers are like that though They'd be sworn at 'til kingdom come if their passengers are late

I'm actually pretty sick of the racial card being played at every opportunity. I don't understand how people can be considered "equal" if you have to watch what you say to someone when you'd normally say the exact same things to someone of your own race, you know?

I agree - bed sounds wonderful :3

 

[STS]

why did the black guy call him a dog,oh i forgot he is racist

*Edit*

ACTUALLY he had a picture of a dog up. do you see how fast people are to jump on racism? racism is an ATTITUDE, not words or insults.

wait is that sarcasm?

 

[Lycanthrope]

why did the black guy call him a dog,oh i forgot he is racist

haha I think he had to resort to insults because that was the fastest way for him to get under my skin

And it wasn't a doggie - it was a wolfie

I agree with smalltownsky - his motives for the insult might've been racially-inspired, but the insult itself wasn't racist.

Edit:

Which reminds me, I never quite understood the following:

You are missing a lot, including a face.

I wonder if he was trying to use his l33t IQ.

 

[STS]

haha @ smalltownsky

I agree completely. To be honest, one of my other half's colleagues at work was mentioning how her taxi driver stopped at the side of the road to see if a person lying there was all right. I actually thought that was pretty impressive - not to mention commendable.

Unfortunately, I don't think all taxies and taxi drivers are like that though They'd be sworn at 'til kingdom come if their passengers are late

I'm actually pretty sick of the racial card being played at every opportunity. I don't understand how people can be considered "equal" if you have to watch what you say to someone when you'd normally say the exact same things to someone of your own race, you know?

I agree - bed sounds wonderful :3

i agree, but some people still have a purpose in painting things in a bad light. if people just see negativity all the time it really does affect people and a lot of people DO think certain people are all the same, and they freak out if you try to be a little more optimistic or fair

i'm sick of the racial card too. i don't think people are equal, people decide themselves who they want to be, but race really doesn't affect who is better or worse. i think people should say what they truely believe, that way they won't haev to feel ashamed about who see's it or who it affects, becoz it IS what they believe

 

[STS]

haha I think he had to resort to insults because that was the fastest way for him to get under my skin

And it wasn't a doggie - it was a wolfie

I agree with smalltownsky - his motives for the insult might've been racially-inspired, but the insult itself wasn't racist.

Edit:

Which reminds me, I never quite understood the following:


I wonder if he was trying to use his l33t IQ.

i need to get my eyes checked

i think a lot of the time people want to be able to see the face of the person that they're debating so they can try figure out what kind of person they are

 

[Lycanthrope]

i agree, but some people still have a purpose in painting things in a bad light. if people just see negativity all the time it really does affect people and a lot of people DO think certain people are all the same, and they freak out if you try to be a little more optimistic or fair

i'm sick of the racial card too. i don't think people are equal, people decide themselves who they want to be, but race really doesn't affect who is better or worse. i think people should say what they truely believe, that way they won't haev to feel ashamed about who see's it or who it affects, becoz it IS what they believe

You know - what you said is actually quite beautiful. I agree - people should say what they believe and shouldn't feel ashamed.

I've been thinking - for a fairly long while - we - as a people, as a country - can't "heal" because we're afraid of pointing out the problem.

Yes, blacks are pissed off at whites for what they had to go through, for what they feel they still have to go through. And yes, whites - especially the new, younger generations - are pissed off too for being treated like second-class citizens and not being able to get opportunities they worked hard for. Some are pissed off because the old government gave them freedoms and liberties that the new government has taken away - their families pay dearly for that too.

We're all pissed off but we're afraid of telling each other just how angry we are because we're afraid of being labelled racists or being ganged up on. I think most of us try to hide our frustrations for so long that to a degree we become racist and begin having racist thoughts.

You know, in all honesty, I have the world of respect for most black people. For the circumstances they have (and do) live in, for the incredibly hard work that they do. Look at labourers, gardeners and maids. They work their butts off each and every day - they put their bodies into their work. There is so much honour in work like that, and yet I'm sure they feel worthless, when they shouldn't.

In front of my apartment complex a few buildings have been constructed over the last year. They look PHENOMENAL. There is just something amazing about seeing a group of people working together, taking ground, clay, brick and mortar and making something astounding out of it. That is something to be proud of - to be respected for.

Perhaps my point isn't getting across - I seem to fail miserably at that lately. I respect the ANC because of Madiba. Because our country was given another chance thanks to him. But the ANC, right now, is Zuma. I don't respect Zuma. Nor will I support a political party that has - over 14 years - proven to be incapable of sustaining our country, our people and our loved ones.

I've seen our squatter camps, I've seen people suffer, and that's not the way people should live. Yes, there are people that are comfortable with their lives, but that's not the be all and end all. People need to be educated and given the chance to grow, to have skills to be able to make their own decisions on how they want their lives to progress. That is something the ANC has still failed to do.

Yet they want to give Zimbabwe R10billion? That's 1000 schools that could be build across our nation. Children that could be educated and given chances at life. The same chances and opportunities we have. They deserve that.

So no, I have no respect for the ANC. I have no respect for people who insist on calling their fellow country men and women racists or coconuts because they disagree with them. And I have no respect for worthless idiots who insist on making a mockery of the freedoms we have all been granted.

I believe in the DA... I believe they'll be different.

 

[Lycanthrope]

i need to get my eyes checked

i think a lot of the time people want to be able to see the face of the person that they're debating so they can try figure out what kind of person they are

I'm a wolfie Vishiss and mean and cute and fluffy all in one go

Mew

 

[DeadCore]

You know - what you said is actually quite beautiful. I agree - people should say what they believe and shouldn't feel ashamed.

I've been thinking - for a fairly long while - we - as a people, as a country - can't "heal" because we're afraid of pointing out the problem.

Yes, blacks are pissed off at whites for what they had to go through, for what they feel they still have to go through. And yes, whites - especially the new, younger generations - are pissed off too for being treated like second-class citizens and not being able to get opportunities they worked hard for. Some are pissed off because the old government gave them freedoms and liberties that the new government has taken away - their families pay dearly for that too.

We're all pissed off but we're afraid of telling each other just how angry we are because we're afraid of being labelled racists or being ganged up on. I think most of us try to hide our frustrations for so long that to a degree we become racist and begin having racist thoughts.

You know, in all honesty, I have the world of respect for most black people. For the circumstances they have (and do) live in, for the incredibly hard work that they do. Look at labourers, gardeners and maids. They work their butts off each and every day - they put their bodies into their work. There is so much honour in work like that, and yet I'm sure they feel worthless, when they shouldn't.

In front of my apartment complex a few buildings have been constructed over the last year. They look PHENOMENAL. There is just something amazing about seeing a group of people working together, taking ground, clay, brick and mortar and making something astounding out of it. That is something to be proud of - to be respected for.

Perhaps my point isn't getting across - I seem to fail miserably at that lately. I respect the ANC because of Madiba. Because our country was given another chance thanks to him. But the ANC, right now, is Zuma. I don't respect Zuma. Nor will I support a political party that has - over 14 years - proven to be incapable of sustaining our country, our people and our loved ones.

I've seen our squatter camps, I've seen people suffer, and that's not the way people should live. Yes, there are people that are comfortable with their lives, but that's not the be all and end all. People need to be educated and given the chance to grow, to have skills to be able to make their own decisions on how they want their lives to progress. That is something the ANC has still failed to do.

Yet they want to give Zimbabwe R10billion? That's 1000 schools that could be build across our nation. Children that could be educated and given chances at life. The same chances and opportunities we have. They deserve that.

So no, I have no respect for the ANC. I have no respect for people who insist on calling their fellow country men and women racists or coconuts because they disagree with them. And I have no respect for worthless idiots who insist on making a mockery of the freedoms we have all been granted.

I believe in the DA... I believe they'll be different.

+infinity,i agree 100% with you.i vote for the DA every year (2 years now) but nothing is coming out of it the ANC keeps geting more votes so i ask why are they geting more votes when the obvious has been pointed out that they do not deserve to lead a coutry anymore?

 

[Lycanthrope]

+infinity,i agree 100% with you.i vote for the DA every year (2 years now) but nothing is coming out of it the ANC keeps geting more votes so i ask why are they geting more votes when the obvious has been pointed out that they do not deserve to lead a coutry anymore?

I think it's a lot to do with what I said somewhere near the beginning of this thread. From what I've discovered from the ANC members in that group, specifically, they will vote for the ANC because:

• Zuma isn't the ANC, and the ANC will out-live Zuma.
• They support Zuma.
• They owe allegiance to the ANC for democracy.

Actually, a Blackadder quote comes to mind:
"Give the likes of Baldrick the vote and we'll be back to cavorting druids, death by stoning and dung for dinner."

 

[Buddha]

You know - what you said is actually quite beautiful. I agree - people should say what they believe and shouldn't feel ashamed.

I've been thinking - for a fairly long while - we - as a people, as a country - can't "heal" because we're afraid of pointing out the problem.

Yes, blacks are pissed off at whites for what they had to go through, for what they feel they still have to go through. And yes, whites - especially the new, younger generations - are pissed off too for being treated like second-class citizens and not being able to get opportunities they worked hard for. Some are pissed off because the old government gave them freedoms and liberties that the new government has taken away - their families pay dearly for that too.

We're all pissed off but we're afraid of telling each other just how angry we are because we're afraid of being labelled racists or being ganged up on. I think most of us try to hide our frustrations for so long that to a degree we become racist and begin having racist thoughts.

You know, in all honesty, I have the world of respect for most black people. For the circumstances they have (and do) live in, for the incredibly hard work that they do. Look at labourers, gardeners and maids. They work their butts off each and every day - they put their bodies into their work. There is so much honour in work like that, and yet I'm sure they feel worthless, when they shouldn't.

In front of my apartment complex a few buildings have been constructed over the last year. They look PHENOMENAL. There is just something amazing about seeing a group of people working together, taking ground, clay, brick and mortar and making something astounding out of it. That is something to be proud of - to be respected for.

Perhaps my point isn't getting across - I seem to fail miserably at that lately. I respect the ANC because of Madiba. Because our country was given another chance thanks to him. But the ANC, right now, is Zuma. I don't respect Zuma. Nor will I support a political party that has - over 14 years - proven to be incapable of sustaining our country, our people and our loved ones.

I've seen our squatter camps, I've seen people suffer, and that's not the way people should live. Yes, there are people that are comfortable with their lives, but that's not the be all and end all. People need to be educated and given the chance to grow, to have skills to be able to make their own decisions on how they want their lives to progress. That is something the ANC has still failed to do.

Yet they want to give Zimbabwe R10billion? That's 1000 schools that could be build across our nation. Children that could be educated and given chances at life. The same chances and opportunities we have. They deserve that.

So no, I have no respect for the ANC. I have no respect for people who insist on calling their fellow country men and women racists or coconuts because they disagree with them. And I have no respect for worthless idiots who insist on making a mockery of the freedoms we have all been granted.

I believe in the DA... I believe they'll be different.

QFT!

please can some1 post that into the group's 'discussion' kthanxbi!