40% students consider emigrating

Ekhaatvensters

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Some thoughts

Well here were the report is supposed to be
www.idasa.org.za/Output_Details.asp?RID=675&PID=2&OTID=4

Sadly it does not work.

I would like to add the following
document into the discussion. Caution, it is a word document.

From this document it I would like to bring out several important facts.
The thing that is most interesting to me is that 40% of the white population earns less R35,000.00 a year.

It seems not all whites are rich hey?

Interesting there are more blacks earning R35,000.00 a year or more (3,5 million) than there are whites (3.25 million).

The amount of whites in the lowest income groups climbed 30% and the amount of blacks in the lowest income groups decreased by 16%. Considering the disparateness of the population numbers of white and black (4.5 million) and 30 million that is huge difference.

In 2001 the percentage of black people in the civil service increased to 86%

The civil service spends 25% of its procurement budget on consultants.

60% of empowerment deals in 2003 went to two people Tokyo Sexwale and Patrice Motsepe.

Black South Africans control virtually all levels of government and of public administration representing 28% of GDP.

The number of graduates from South African universities doubled from 478 198 in 1992 to 975 993 in 2001.

According to a survey conducted by the Institute for Race Relations, the number of Black graduates increased by 259% between 1991 and 2002, Indians by 104%, and coloured graduates by 27% and the number of white graduates declined by 11%.

Whilst all students in all countries showed very high levels of patriotism and pride in their identity as citizens of their own country (80%), and felt committed to the future of development of their country; 79% of students had considered moving to another country when they graduated, and only 17% had never considered it. (This is a reference to the SADC region not SA)

In short, we can see some the effects the governments policies have had. Such significant progress in black upliftment is laudable, however the question should be is it necessary to punish the whites through punitave actions to acieve the upliftment. Can the upliftment not take place without retribution.

If it cannot, why should we stay to be the victims of the retribution, especially as the end for it is not in sight.
That is very interesting, thanks.

but how can something decrease by 259%.. maby i'm just being stupid.. but surely something can only decrease by 100%, as that is all it is?
 

supersunbird

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Why are they leaving, don't the IT and financial industries need a lot of skilled people right now?
Because they didn't necesarily study in that direction, maybe its not where their passion is, the money is better overseas, the crime rate is increasing (despite what the officials say), those two industries are getting more and more pressured for racial transformation, many reasons they can have...
 

RichardP

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Why are they leaving, don't the IT and financial industries need a lot of skilled people right now?
Getting a job as an IT professional in a financial field is really the dog work.... Maintaining COBOL mainframes and 30 year old desktop programs.. if thats what you want to do... great... Web designers dont usually need university degrees

(not all financial institutions use legacy software.. and there are some high tech ones that are few and far between)
 
K

kingrob

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Getting a job as an IT professional in a financial field is really the dog work.... Maintaining COBOL mainframes and 30 year old desktop programs.. if thats what you want to do... great... Web designers dont usually need university degrees

(not all financial institutions use legacy software.. and there are some high tech ones that are few and far between)
I TOTALLY agree!

Who wants to work on old coputer hardware & software in South Africa, when you can work on the latest & greatest in the UK or America?

*One of the reasons I decided to quit I.T. when I moved back from the UK to South Africa.
 

Drone 42

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I TOTALLY agree!

Who wants to work on old coputer hardware & software in South Africa, when you can work on the latest & greatest in the UK or America?
Some of the banking systems in the UK are older legacy systems than what we have here. Definitely not he latest and greatest. Some of the banks in the UK are just plain backwards :) Anyway that's off topic
 

krycor

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I was thinking yesterday what i've actually learnt at university in terms of actual practical work/job-related experience and was struggling to say what well except for a few courses(new blood in university admin does good).

In the end i realized that most of it was 1st yr stuff and here and there the other stuff was mainly me learning how to do something myself and then applying it to accomplish something required/needed for a course i.e. more teaching yourself than actually just siting in a classroom and being taught school-like which is funny now that i think of it, as i sit here learning about new css techniques etc, cause everyone places a lot of effort on degree's etc and 1/2 those people don't really know how to do things. Off topic i guess.

But yah the thing i could and still can't understand is why telecoms in SA is a user of technology and not a producer in terms of cellular and rural access. I mean we live in the perfect environment come to think of it.. struggle to reduce costs and maintain access in harsh 'African' environments.. we should be leading the way with development of technology best suited to Africa. But instead we just buy European/Asian technology and adapt it and then claim its expensive due to cost while our telecoms companies are the most profitable. :eek: someone in gov. needs to get bitch slapped.
 

nthdimension

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What part of my R10000 a semester does the govt subsidise?
Where are you paying R10,000 per semester for tuition?

I was thinking yesterday what i've actually learnt at university in terms of actual practical work/job-related experience and was struggling to say what well except for a few courses(new blood in university admin does good).
That's not what education is about. Anyone who wants to be trained for a job should go to trade school or a technikon.
 

tibby.dude

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What part of my R10000 a semester does the govt subsidise?
It is rather elementary.

For example the govt gives UCT R244.5 million each year as a subsidy which covers 63% of their funding requirements and the rest they get from student fees and other grants and investments etc .....

Afaik a total of 5 BILLION is allocated to tertiary institutions in the budget.

So it is a fact this govt PAYS for a BIG chunk of your studies and without their funding you would frankly not be able to do so unless your parents could cough up double or triple what they are paying now.
 

sludge

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The gov pays nothing! That is our own tax money being appropriated to the whole country. People give money, the gov spreads it and in the proccess they waste a lot of it unfortunately. This whole concept of the "gov gives money" is flawed and non-existant, that is the publics tax money being spent! Not the gov's money!

Who cannot grasp this simple concept? I can see a few here that struggles to
think logically.
 

rwenzori

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It is rather elementary.

For example the govt gives UCT R244.5 million each year as a subsidy which covers 63% of their funding requirements and the rest they get from student fees and other grants and investments etc .....

Afaik a total of 5 BILLION is allocated to tertiary institutions in the budget.

So it is a fact this govt PAYS for a BIG chunk of your studies and without their funding you would frankly not be able to do so unless your parents could cough up double or triple what they are paying now.
Big chunks of this subsidy money go to fund those who can't or won't pay, and to provide fat salaries for the new unnecessary "management" layers added when the govt forced the merging of institutions. So research declines, academic standards decline, and we are left with glorified technikons instead of universities.
 
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Syndyre

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It is rather elementary.

For example the govt gives UCT R244.5 million each year as a subsidy which covers 63% of their funding requirements and the rest they get from student fees and other grants and investments etc .....

Afaik a total of 5 BILLION is allocated to tertiary institutions in the budget.

So it is a fact this govt PAYS for a BIG chunk of your studies and without their funding you would frankly not be able to do so unless your parents could cough up double or triple what they are paying now.
What about the fact that the amount a lot of our parents pay in taxes during the years that we study FAR outweighs any subsidy we may receive, not even taking into account all the other years they paid taxes in. So in effect the government is still making a profit off us. So if they want to stop their funding then let them stop it, but then they must stop collecting taxes from us too.
 

tibby.dude

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So in effect the government is still making a profit off us.
Have you checked the budget lately ... we have a deficit in our budget (govt expenditure exceeds revenue) ... it has been ages since we had a "profit" or surplus.
 

Syndyre

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Have you checked the budget lately ... we have a deficit in our budget ... it has been ages since we had a surplus.
I mean individually, the amount a lot of parents pay in far exceeds what they and their children consume in the form of government services/subsidies.
 

RichardP

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I can agree with the 40% emigration... the professional person gets about R40 000 per month, 42% of that is TAX.. R16 800 a month is gone! R201 000 a year goes back in to govt coffers every year. The govt must get off their high horse that "THEY" fund the universities... they dont - taxpayers do. Without the people, the government is nothing.... so I think they should re-think what they spend the cash on and invest more in to the people.... police, medical, education etc etc.

Embeselment is not an expense, on the part of the Govt and learning institutions.
 

kingmonty

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It is rather elementary.

For example the govt gives UCT R244.5 million each year as a subsidy which covers 63% of their funding requirements and the rest they get from student fees and other grants and investments etc .....

Afaik a total of 5 BILLION is allocated to tertiary institutions in the budget.

So it is a fact this govt PAYS for a BIG chunk of your studies and without their funding you would frankly not be able to do so unless your parents could cough up double or triple what they are paying now.
mostly correct - except when studying through UNISA.
 

kingmonty

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Have you checked the budget lately ... we have a deficit in our budget (govt expenditure exceeds revenue) ... it has been ages since we had a "profit" or surplus.
Sure, we have a deficit on the national budget, but that being said, the idiots in charge of expenditure in various departments (including Education) have failed rather frequently to expend their entire budget allocation. good going.
 

vespax

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really debating going back overseas in August.

I know my other classmates are also considering going, and half of them are from the SADC region. The one girl who is the top of our programme and a SA citizen told me on Friday she might be going to the states at the end as well.

So yeah, I believe the 40% is low.
 

Alan

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really debating going back overseas in August.

I know my other classmates are also considering going, and half of them are from the SADC region. The one girl who is the top of our programme and a SA citizen told me on Friday she might be going to the states at the end as well.

So yeah, I believe the 40% is low.
Nooo please stay. Stay forever in S.A. I will miss you to much honest ;)

If you do insist on going back then I'll see you there:cool: . Also be sure not to vote under any circumstances. :p

:D
 
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