Afrihost CAPPED ADSL Feedback (MTN)

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techead said:
Unbelievable
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+1

Originally Posted by AfriMan
We've discussed this extensively. Being oversubscribed implies that we have too many users or have oversold our bandwidth but our reports tell us that existing users are demanding more bandwidth and demand has growing (is growing) at an exponentially faster rate than new signups. We've been clear and open about this.
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Speaks volumes about the efficacy of capacity planning done. Marketing and infrastructure are clearly not on the same page. Econ 101 - supply and demand. Increase supply, in this case make the product so cost attractive, and your demand will increase. So like I said - marketing and infrastructure capacity planning are clearly not aligned.
 
steel_dog said:
+1


Speaks volumes about the efficacy of capacity planning done. Marketing and infrastructure are clearly not on the same page. Econ 101 - supply and demand. Increase supply, in this case make the product so cost attractive, and your demand will increase. So like I said - marketing and infrastructure capacity planning are clearly not aligned.
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This is what I've been explaining to them for the last couple of pages but the lift doesn't go all the way to the top
 
AfriMan said:
We've discussed this extensively. Being oversubscribed implies that we have too many users or have oversold our bandwidth but our reports tell us that existing users are demanding more bandwidth and demand has growing (is growing) at an exponentially faster rate than new signups. We've been clear and open about this.
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This has been a long year so please correct me if I'm wrong about this, because what you are saying is:

That your existing clients' usage is growing so fast that current capacity is under strain, yet you keep adding more clients (which will probably follow the same trend)! So all this load and strain on your capacity is evident in all the posts, but you do not call it oversubscribed?

In plain and short, oversubscribed is when you cannot meet current demand (not planned or future demand) and this is exactly the boat Afrihost is in. Year in and year out, the same story.

I want to say "Well done" on your success and growth, but you are the victim of your own success. From history you only seem to plan for 6 months in advance and this causes a lot of bad publicity and long term damage to the brand.

Afrihost has gone from the best and market leader in the industry, to just another ISP with nothing special to offer. If you do not keep innovating and keep up with trends/usage/growth whatever you want to call it, you melt away in the market. Sad but true!
 
You know this whole thing reminds me of the old adage - Be careful what you wish for. You might just get it.
Seems apt here. AH clearly gained the Marketshare they sought. Reputation tho has as a result taken a pounding.
Sadly it's the consumer who pays the penalty. There should be recompense. But that my friends is just my Christmas with for us all ;)
 
Something to consider, we have systems in place to chart our client base growth, this allows us to predict how much and more or less when we will need to upgrade our bandwidth and network to ensure that our client's continue to have the experience they expect from us. This is pretty standard, most ISPs do this, and as you guys pointed should pretty much be standard practice. You take known factors and predict a trend to extrapolate data from it.

However, the known factors changed in a way we could not predict, AfriMan has re-iterated this, the current network issues were not caused by too many new clients, but rather our current clients changing their bandwidth usage patterns in an unexpected way. This is generally exemplified by Peer to Peer usage dropping significantly and streaming becoming the new, preferred method of bandwidth consumption. This is great! But it did take us by surprise!

This is why we had to speed up our timetable for our network upgrades, so once again as AfriMan pointed out, each individual user is consuming significantly more bandwidth than was previously the case, and this is awesome. But it did mean that things were slightly slower than we were expecting for a while. Very soon the upgrades in all Regions will be in place, and there will be noticeable improvements in network speeds.
 
This understandable and good to know that you have an eye on things, however, I think people are upset because broadband is part of our homes now. It is used for entertainment, education, business and even keeping in touch with loved ones far away. We pay to good money for specific packages because that is what is promised/described.

Imagine if an ISP just said "UP TO 100Mbps depending on network load or usage patterns" and didn't provide any other packages. So hidden T&C's will state that 1 user on the network can get 100Mbps but 2000 users will only get 384Kbps.

So my points are:

1. Why aren't the other ISP's affected as much as Afrihost?
2. Are processes and systems going to be put in place to minimize the chance of this happening again?

I know you can't predict market trends, but this didn't happen overnight, your reports should show increases/decreases in traffic trends and this should enable you to create better infrastructure roadmaps.

Also be careful on your answer here, as it might get quoted a year from now
 
AfriGenie said:
Something to consider, we have systems in place to chart our client base growth, this allows us to predict how much and more or less when we will need to upgrade our bandwidth and network to ensure that our client's continue to have the experience they expect from us. This is pretty standard, most ISPs do this, and as you guys pointed should pretty much be standard practice. You take known factors and predict a trend to extrapolate data from it.

However, the known factors changed in a way we could not predict, AfriMan has re-iterated this, the current network issues were not caused by too many new clients, but rather our current clients changing their bandwidth usage patterns in an unexpected way. This is generally exemplified by Peer to Peer usage dropping significantly and streaming becoming the new, preferred method of bandwidth consumption. This is great! But it did take us by surprise!

This is why we had to speed up our timetable for our network upgrades, so once again as AfriMan pointed out, each individual user is consuming significantly more bandwidth than was previously the case, and this is awesome. But it did mean that things were slightly slower than we were expecting for a while. Very soon the upgrades in all Regions will be in place, and there will be noticeable improvements in network speeds.
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This is interesting...

Are you really saying that the new trend of iptv is the culprit?

Coz that is what I'm reading...
 
Aquiva said:
This understandable and good to know that you have an eye on things, however, I think people are upset because broadband is part of our homes now. It is used for entertainment, education, business and even keeping in touch with loved ones far away. We pay to good money for specific packages because that is what is promised/described.

Imagine if an ISP just said "UP TO 100Mbps depending on network load or usage patterns" and didn't provide any other packages. So hidden T&C's will state that 1 user on the network can get 100Mbps but 2000 users will only get 384Kbps.

So my points are:

1. Why aren't the other ISP's affected as much as Afrihost?
2. Are processes and systems going to be put in place to minimize the chance of this happening again?

I know you can't predict market trends, but this didn't happen overnight, your reports should show increases/decreases in traffic trends and this should enable you to create better infrastructure roadmaps.

Also be careful on your answer here, as it might get quoted a year from now
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Yes... AfriMan did warn me about that... :)

I will be honest, I have not even looked at any other ISP's accounts recently, or even tested any of them for an extended period of time. But I do know most ISPs shape their Uncapped accounts across all services, not just P2P as we do. I can imagine that this allows them to absorb significant spikes in bandwidth usage over the short-term. But don't take this as fact, I don't use any other ADSL services other than Afrihost. :whistle:
 
AfriGenie said:
Yes... AfriMan did warn me about that... :)

I will be honest, I have not even looked at any other ISP's accounts recently, or even tested any of them for an extended period of time. But I do know most ISPs shape their Uncapped accounts across all services, not just P2P as we do. I can imagine that this allows them to absorb significant spikes in bandwidth usage over the short-term. But don't take this as fact, I don't use any other ADSL services other than Afrihost. :whistle:
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Haha! The sad part is Afrihost is still the best value for money (capped account wise), but I just reached the end, and now I have to pay more just to get what I had again I had my line, dsl, mobile and hosting with Afrihost. It was such a comfort to have a one-stop-shop for everything. I'm sure I'll have some billing nightmares for the next two months to get everything sorted again.
 
Eish...
He's a piece of sage advice from someone who's been delivering enterprise IT Outsource services for years...
If the problem is yours acknowledge responsibility with explanation however without excuse. NEVER attempt to offer "plausible reasons" during follow-ups or when things aren't going to plan, simply re-affirm responsibility and focus all efforts on the resolution. Make sound commitments and hit them with no compromises - this means driving your service providers aggressively. When things don't go to plan the senior company officials need to be front and center managing the issue - importantly being seen by the client to be engaged.
Anyhow. I'm patiently awaiting the upgrade.
 
techead said:
This is interesting...

Are you really saying that the new trend of iptv is the culprit?

Coz that is what I'm reading...
Click to expand...

I believe I said Streaming has replaced Peer to Peer downloads as the largest consumer of bandwidth on our network, the associated change in usage patterns that entails was a significant contributor.
 
AfriGenie said:
Our IPC Upgrades in the North are fully online and operational, you should not be experiencing any bandwidth or latency issues. At least related to our ADSL network.
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Things are looking better. It was just a slow server causing my issue. Other services running smoothly :)
 
Nuro said:
Things are looking better. It was just a slow server causing my issue. Other services running smoothly :)
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That is great to hear! Please continue to keep an eye on your connection and let us know if any change occurs.
 
So you were surprised that Capped, unshaped users would actually want to use the 160GB (OR whatever amount they chose). If you have sold a package of Capped Data, vs Uncapped, you have a fixed quantity, why be surprised that I want to use what I payed for?

AfriGenie said:
...However, the known factors changed in a way we could not predict, AfriMan has re-iterated this, the current network issues were not caused by too many new clients, but rather our current clients changing their bandwidth usage patterns in an unexpected way. This is generally exemplified by Peer to Peer usage dropping significantly and streaming becoming the new, preferred method of bandwidth consumption. This is great! But it did take us by surprise!
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I chose capped bandwidth, and recommended it to others, for the simple reason that capped, unshaped is perfect for streaming. You have been well aware for over a year now that South Africans were using Hulu, Netflix and iTunes not to mention several other streaming services of a slightly more dubious nature. Even DSTV are streaming locally and your own AUP states that you will never shape streaming.International carriers and ISP's have been bleating for the past few years that streaming is the largest consumer of bandwidth and yet you say that streaming took you by surprise, it sounds more like another excuse to me.
 
caroper said:
So you were surprised that Capped, unshaped users would actually want to use the 160GB (OR whatever amount they chose). If you have sold a package of Capped Data, vs Uncapped, you have a fixed quantity, why be surprised that I want to use what I payed for?



I chose capped bandwidth, and recommended it to others, for the simple reason that capped, unshaped is perfect for streaming. You have been well aware for over a year now that South Africans were using Hulu, Netflix and iTunes not to mention several other streaming services of a slightly more dubious nature. Even DSTV are streaming locally and your own AUP states that you will never shape streaming.International carriers and ISP's have been bleating for the past few years that streaming is the largest consumer of bandwidth and yet you say that streaming took you by surprise, it sounds more like another excuse to me.
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We saw demand from existing clients rise significantly across the board, that is Uncapped, Capped and Business, and this was not one service in favour of another, we saw P2P rise as well as streaming. We've definitely seen a steady increase in demand for YouTube HD bandwidth, but we're also seeing P2P traffic being sent out over many protocols as torrents find different ways to access network resources. I think AfriGenie was speaking generally in terms of global trends, but our reports show that P2P is still the biggest bandwidth consumer.
 
techead said:
This is interesting...

Are you really saying that the new trend of iptv is the culprit?

Coz that is what I'm reading...
Click to expand...

Remember that people can't schedule their streaming for after hours like you can with downloads. So usage times is shifting as well.
 
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