Article: E-tolling intended to help reduce congestion

Hamster said:
Do they honestly think we use these roads for the fun of it? The roads are congested because we use them for work, you stupid dumbass!
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Indeed. Someone explain to Motlante where the money in the tax piggy bank magically comes from every month.
 
If its only meant to reduce congestion, why were they originally planning to charge taxis?

Same applies to large delivery trucks?

Cost of transport going up in both these cases is detrimental to the economy. They're just changing their story now to get it aproved...
 
ambo said:
South Africa is one of the few countries in the world were everyone has this entitlement complex about driving their own car to work. People in most other countries use car pooling, busses and taxis. Once being a snob on our roads becomes too expensive then maybe people will start using those three options which already exist and in turn that will stimulate more public transport.

If you can't afford the tolls and you're thinking about alternative routes then you're doing it wrong. You should rather be looking at alternative methods of transport.
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:wtf: Really? Entitlement? If there was an efficient mass transport system, people would LOVE to use it to get to work. I've used them in Spain and Singapore, busses mixed with subways ( underground and over ) and it was a dream. Cars BECAME a hinderance.

Bus system - rundown and useless especially for those who work in the industrial areas away from city centers
Taxi system - risk life and limb every day
Train - no tracks to the area.

If you going to bitch about people using cars and the road, give them a reasonable and afforable alternative.
 
ambo said:
South Africa is one of the few countries in the world were everyone has this entitlement complex about driving their own car to work. People in most other countries use car pooling, busses and taxis. Once being a snob on our roads becomes too expensive then maybe people will start using those three options which already exist and in turn that will stimulate more public transport.

If you can't afford the tolls and you're thinking about alternative routes then you're doing it wrong. You should rather be looking at alternative methods of transport.
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Like what exactly? I would love to make use of a safe, reliable and viable alternative transport system.
Can you name one that will take me from Alberton to the Joburg CBD?
 
If this was true then why not only put up gantries where the current toll booths are? Keep the fee the same, or a minor increase probably will not hurt, but that would have made 100 times more sense than plastering a gantry every few kilometres.
 
ambo said:
South Africa is one of the few countries in the world were everyone has this entitlement complex about driving their own car to work. People in most other countries use car pooling, busses and taxis. Once being a snob on our roads becomes too expensive then maybe people will start using those three options which already exist and in turn that will stimulate more public transport.

If you can't afford the tolls and you're thinking about alternative routes then you're doing it wrong. You should rather be looking at alternative methods of transport.
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I'm curious, which would you recommend for a white South African: Getting mugged on a mini bus taxi or break the bank paying for normal taxis?
 
Hamster said:
I'm curious, which would you recommend for a white South African: Getting mugged on a mini bus taxi or break the bank paying for normal taxis?
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I'm curious though, he will an ordinary taxi not be stuck in transport?
 
ambo said:
Car pooling.
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So ca you recommend two car pools for me. One that drives from Edenvale to Houghton and one that drives from Edenvale to Lynwood in PTA. Only, i cant tell them which day i will use which one and they must be available on some weekends - they must be flexible.

Not sure what i am gonna do on weekends though. Wont be able to go the shops as i please and wont be able to visit my friends that often either.
 
Car pooling is quite outdated, now a lot of people today are still office bound,
 
Nicodeamus said:
well they did implement penalty travel fees during peak hours in London, it has some success, however the money generated from these penalties aren't suppose to go for the maintenance of the project itself (that is what any infrastructure textbook will tell you).
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http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/roadusers/congestioncharge/whereandwhen/

Just for clarity to other forumites, the London Congestion zone does not charge for After hours (6pm to 7am), public holidays or weekends. If you look at the Congestion map, its a very small area.
You also don't pay the charge if you drive a low emissions car (Hybrid or high efficiency diesel/petrol)
 
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ambo said:
South Africa is one of the few countries in the world were everyone has this entitlement complex about driving their own car to work. People in most other countries use car pooling, busses and taxis. Once being a snob on our roads becomes too expensive then maybe people will start using those three options which already exist and in turn that will stimulate more public transport.

If you can't afford the tolls and you're thinking about alternative routes then you're doing it wrong. You should rather be looking at alternative methods of transport.
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I think you'll find their isn't an entitlement complex, but more a necessity.

I live 35kms from the office (because I can't afford to live any closer, the house prices are mental nearer my office). I can't carpool because I have irregular hours, will often be at work till 6pm/7pm... I would absolutely ADORE having a safe reliable public transport service to get me to and from work.. would save me a bucket load and make my commute to work more enjoyable and actually productive.
 
Oh really? Funny how the stretch between Linksfield and Giloolys is still a fsckup every day. A 10 lane highway won't solve idiots making off ramps too close together
 
ambo said:
South Africa is one of the few countries in the world were everyone has this entitlement complex about driving their own car to work. People in most other countries use car pooling, busses and taxis. Once being a snob on our roads becomes too expensive then maybe people will start using those three options which already exist and in turn that will stimulate more public transport.
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South Africa has no decent public transport system. Period.
1. I tried carpooling for a few months and it worked out being big waste of time with hardly any savings in fuel (closest work collegue is 10km from my house). I need to stay late at work and he wants to go home. I need to get to work early and he doesn't.
2. There are no buses linking Pretoria East to Midrand where I work. The metro buses go to PTA CBD and the buses stop running at around 17:30 so how am I supposed to leave Midrand at 17:00 and catch the last bus in PTA CBD by 17:30? What if I work until 18:30 like I often do or need to do a late night shift until 23:00?
3. The taxis are too dangerous to use and requires walking in the dark with computer equipment through dangerous areas to and from the pickup points.

If you can't afford the tolls and you're thinking about alternative routes then you're doing it wrong. You should rather be looking at alternative methods of transport.
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Like what?
The government and municiplaties refuse to create an integrated bus system because they're too scared of the taxi mob.
Using a private vehicle is far safer and quicker than any transport system the government has come up with so far.

The fact that people are forced to use private transport is a failure on the government's part. I would love to get rid of my vehicle and save R5K+ per month in repayments, insurance, fuel and repairs.
 
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The more you read about this, the more you realise how utterly flawed the planning was.

- The financial implications of tolling will go beyond just paying extra to use a road. Consumer goods will increase in price too. People are already being hammered in the pockets, now you pay more to use the roads and you will pay more for the goods you buy at the shops due to increased freight costs. Did they think about that one? And if they wanted to give anybody free usage of the roads, they should have grown a spine and given it to freighters and not the taxis, seeing as freighters paying for road usage will result in a double-whammy of costs.
- E-tolling will ease congestion? On the highways, yes. But what do you think is going to happen on the backroads? Congestion. Gridlock. Guaranteed. Most people who are tight financially would rather sit in traffic and save that money. This will also increase wear-and-tear on backroads.

This was a half-backed, cocked up idea from the get-go. Should have been using our fuel levy for it's intended purpose from day one. Or, if they had planned this properly and not tried to get their brothers, sisters, cousins, nephews, friends, aunts, unlces and who knows else in on this money-making racket, they could have dones this waaaaaay cheaper.
 
And I wish they could show as the SAFE, viable public transport. It's about time they grow a pair and tell the taxi bosses to get effed. How they let these guys hold this country ransom every time they are upset is beyond me. Easy way to beat them is to approach the drivers. Promise them salaries, training (on how to drive a bus and conduct themselves as if there are other people on the roads) and benefits to drive buses and they will join you.

The guys that work with me hate using taxis but they have no choice. None of them ever have anything good to say about them but they have no alternative as buses run infrequently and do not cover enough areas.
 
thestaggy said:
And I wish they could show as the SAFE, viable public transport. It's about time they grow a pair and tell the taxi bosses to get effed. How they let these guys hold this country ransom every time they are upset is beyond me. Easy way to beat them is to approach the drivers. Promise them salaries, training (on how to drive a bus and conduct themselves as if there are other people on the roads) and benefits to drive buses and they will join you.

The guys that work with me hate using taxis but they have no choice. None of them ever have anything good to say about them but they have no alternative as buses run infrequently and do not cover enough areas.
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It isn't just taxi bosses (and drivers) that need sorting out - it is the whole public transport industry. Part of the reason why the system doesn't work is because there is no consequence to shoddy service. A bus driver that doesn't pitch for his shift isn't going to be fired and any attempt at a disciplinary is going to have the rest of the drivers out on strike.

Even that 'marvellous' gautrain is held ransom by its bus drivers.
 
Albereth said:
It isn't just taxi bosses (and drivers) that need sorting out - it is the whole public transport industry. Part of the reason why the system doesn't work is because there is no consequence to shoddy service. A bus driver that doesn't pitch for his shift isn't going to be fired and any attempt at a disciplinary is going to have the rest of the drivers out on strike.

Even that 'marvellous' gautrain is held ransom by its bus drivers.
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That is true, I have heard a few stories about the late bus driver that tells you off.

It's just really a case of the folks at the top growing a pair with regards to everybody. It's amazing that the good guy in the street does something wrong and he's ripped in to (pay one of your accounts late for the first time and see the lashing you get) but when it comes to public services, there's no accountability. Privatisation is the way I'm affraid. The minute there's a businessperson involved and profits and targets are at stake, you'll see a difference. Right now the public sector has this ''I'm doing you a favour'' mentality. No, you're providing a service that I am paying for.
 
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