Bank report hackers face jail

[LazyLion]

What else do you expect mybb to do if they receive a legally obtained court order to disclose the IP address? Ignore it? You signed the terms and conditions when registering.

But they have an uphill battle thereafter, because the forum merely requires an email address - not full contact details. They then need a court order to obtain the necessary details from your ISP. Which in itself could prove problematic if you've used a proxy. It's not just a case of asking for the details - I know for a fact (based on personal experience) that rpm will do his utmost to protect forumites in this situation purely based on principle. It isn't merely a case of ask and ye shall receive. That would set an atrocious precedent...

Ja, you guys are worrying about nothing. rpm has gone on record here to say he would do everything in his power first before he released any info on a forum member. Please give him the benefit of the doubt.

Besides, the CC's case here is a long uphill battle which could literally take years. They would be better off, just shoring up the hole and being more careful on future releases.

As someone else said... the flaw was not with the "hackers", the flaw was with the document. If that person did not open it someone else would have.

 

[Pitbull]

What else do you expect mybb to do if they receive a legally obtained court order to disclose the IP address? Ignore it? You signed the terms and conditions when registering.

But they have an uphill battle thereafter, because the forum merely requires an email address - not full contact details. They then need a court order to obtain the necessary details from your ISP. Which in itself could prove problematic if you've used a proxy. It's not just a case of asking for the details - I know for a fact (based on personal experience) that rpm will do his utmost to protect forumites in this situation purely based on principle. It isn't merely a case of ask and ye shall receive. That would set an atrocious precedent...

So much for posting in confidence

Exactly my point. If this was a person who manufactures Child porn or confessed to killing Stevey Wonder, yes I agree fully. But if I read that part correctly it means if I want your details for making a case against you for what ever reason I just need a Lawyer to draft a letter. This letter should just contain proof of my claim

If they have a case

Let's say it's slander.....

What now? I have a case and I will win a slander case if I have proof you psted it.

That means rpm would just give it to them Not even a slight power surge that wiped the data or corrpt disc data, anything, just a "sure here you go"

 

[DJ...]

So much for posting in confidence

Exactly my point. If this was a person who manufactures Child porn or confessed to killing Stevey Wonder, yes I agree fully. But if I read that part correctly it means if I want your details for making a case against you for what ever reason I just need a Lawyer to draft a letter. This letter should just contain proof of my claim Let's say it's slander.....

What now? I have a case and I will win a slander case if I have proof you psted it.

That means rpm would just give it to them Not even a slight power surge that wiped the data or corrpt disc data, anything, just a "sure here you go"

No, not at all. It's not just a lawyer's letter they need. Please re-read - they need a court order! You're making a mountain out of a mole-hill here. You really need to sharpen up on those comprehension skills and lay off the roids.

It must be legally obtained. That doesn't just mean that a lawyer's letter will suffice. It has to go via the courts, who determine whether or not there is a legal case, and thereafter, if it falls within the law, the judge will determine whether or not the details must be disclosed by rpm.

Consider one thing: have you ever heard of this site disclosing your personal information to anyone? rpm has been vocal about protecting the anonymity of forumites, and has proven it with his actions. I was on the receiving end of this not so long ago with karkadvice and his company's lawyers. rpm told them to go get stuffed (in a more eloquent fashion) when they threatened legal action to obtain my details.

And if it were as simple as you think, Telkom would have had this site's members down to a mere handful years ago already...

 

[LazyLion]

So much for posting in confidence

Exactly my point. If this was a person who manufactures Child porn or confessed to killing Stevey Wonder, yes I agree fully. But if I read that part correctly it means if I want your details for making a case against you for what ever reason I just need a Lawyer to draft a letter. This letter should just contain proof of my claim Let's say it's slander.....

What now? I have a case and I will win a slander case if I have proof you psted it.

That means rpm would just give it to them Not even a slight power surge that wiped the data or corrpt disc data, anything, just a "sure here you go"

You signed away your rights when you registered here! Go and read the terms and conditions. You would rather have rpm go to jail for someone else's actions? How is that fair?

This is standard procedure all over the world. By handing over any IP info it is not a guilty verdict, just an intention to investigate further.

If you don't like the arrangement, you can either disconnect yourself from the internet or take steps to anonymize yourself even further using a proxy.

 

[Pitbull]

Yes, you guys are right. I just feel this to be very very leniant.

Maybe I'm understanding that part wrong or I'm just being stupid. I feel there should at least be a degree of protection from stupid arse people who will do anything to get personal details of certain members. So I swear you, you get a court order via the attorneys and bam, not to long from now you can stalk me and my family ahrrase my wife and so forth.

But nvm, I think I'm reading it wrong

 

[ld13]

Not cool.

Not cool. Not cool to follow a court order? They'll have no choice but to follow it to the letter Sackboy.

 

[DJ...]

Yes, you guys are right. I just feel this to be very very leniant.

Maybe I'm understanding that part wrong or I'm just being stupid. I feel there should at least be a degree of protection from stupid arse people who will do anything to get personal details of certain members. So I swear you, you get a court order via the attorneys and bam, not to long from now you can stalk me and my family ahrrase my wife and so forth.

But nvm, I think I'm reading it wrong

You are misunderstanding it. A court order is not just handed over because someone requested it. There must be a legal case and precedent (of which I am not aware of any local ones) for handing over the information.

You could have your personal details revealed by your license plate in the same fashion. But there must be a legal reason for doing so...

 

[LazyLion]

Yes, you guys are right. I just feel this to be very very leniant.

Maybe I'm understanding that part wrong or I'm just being stupid. I feel there should at least be a degree of protection from stupid arse people who will do anything to get personal details of certain members. So I swear you, you get a court order via the attorneys and bam, not to long from now you can stalk me and my family ahrrase my wife and so forth.

But nvm, I think I'm reading it wrong

DJK is right, they would need some kind of warrant (if they know the identity of the person involved), or a court order if they don't. It would have to specify exactly what they are looking for, as they can't just demand that all IP addresses of all the posters be handed over. That would be an invasion of privacy... and might backfire on them by being thrown out of court.

so the CC has to go through this procedure...

1) Hire private investigators or computer forensics experts to trace the person.
2) Get a court order compelling MyBB to reveal the "hackers" IP.

To do that they have to convince the court that it is in the public interest to do this / or that a crime has in fact been committed.

once they have his IP / IF they get his IP, then they have to go through the same process with his ISP for them to hand over the logs.

If he used a proxy, he is probably safe.... if they can link a person to the IP, they will have to prove that he did in fact "hack" the document... which is going to be hard, because as we know.. .there was nothing to hack... it was already vulnerable.

Then they would have to link the same person who "hacked" the document to the person who uploaded it to Wikileaks.

and finally they would have to prove malicious intent, intention to deny access or enrichment... none of which apply in this case.

To put it simply, they have snowball's chance in Hell.

 

[Pitbull]

You are misunderstanding it. A court order is not just handed over because someone requested it. There must be a legal case and precedent (of which I am not aware of any local ones) for handing over the information.

You could have your personal details revealed by your license plate in the same fashion. But there must be a legal reason for doing so...

You would be very surprized

But I get it guys I just got a little upset about a stone in the ocean

 

[rwenzori]

Consider one thing: have you ever heard of this site disclosing your personal information to anyone? rpm has been vocal about protecting the anonymity of forumites, and has proven it with his actions. I was on the receiving end of this not so long ago with karkadvice and his company's lawyers. rpm told them to go get stuffed (in a more eloquent fashion) when they threatened legal action to obtain my details.

I must echo DJK - rpm was VERY protective and helpful over that incident; I was one of those that karkadvice got upset about. He (rpm) was really excellent.

 

[Peon]

Echoing Apogeeza's comments: The banks need to be investigated by an institution that has balls. What I cant understand is if the banks are dirty and using dodgy tricks, why didnt the CC fine them?

I mean how far away are the banks from committing illegal acts. What classifies illegal acts? This hacker crap is done and dusted and will come to naught. They know it, we know it and the police knows it. Whats next?

So everyone can read now that the banks are creaming us and nothing happens? Whose job is it to say, "Hey, stop what you doing".

 

[daveza]

The hacker crap will indeed come to naught - but the public at large will view MBB and its members as evil hackers/thieves until as much publicity is given to the false accusations as was given to the initial accusations against this forum.

 

[apogeeza]

Well whoever it was that released or "hacked" this report I support him or her. It is high time that we start fighting for our rights and take action against corrupt institutions like the banks.

+1
The disturbing trend about these CC/Banking threads is the infighting amongst ourselves. That's just sad. Come on people, we are the victims here, why are we running around scared and fussing about IP addresses and identities and FUD from other message boards. You are making yourselves paranoid for nothing (self-fulfilling prophesies etc.)

As I have put my money into action with Telecoms Action Group, and others in the past, I am willing to put money into this thing and fight a class action against the banks. Who's with me??

 

[Slaine73]

So much for posting in confidence

Exactly my point. If this was a person who manufactures Child porn or confessed to killing Stevey Wonder, yes I agree fully.

Man what is this with you and Stevey Wonder?

 

[Peon]

...I am willing to put money into this thing and fight a class action against the banks. Who's with me??

How much would be needed?

 

[daveza]

How much would be needed?

To fight the banks ? A lot more than is in the kitty.

 

[Peon]

So its a case of we will come and remove your kidney when you are sleeping and then leave. When you wake up you will notice its gone and do nothing, just carry on as if nothing happened.

 

[LazyLion]

To fight the banks ? A lot more than is in the kitty.

Actually, it would probably only take (at most) a couple of hundred rand from every bank customer in South Africa. And if successful, would mean money in damages back to us... or at least much reduced rates.

 

[Dolby]

I haven't read or followed this closely ... do we know the alias of the person in question?

 

[Vrotappel]

Get over yourself. They have done more then you will ever do.

They have fined Tiger Brands R98,7-million for participating in bread and milling cartels late in 2007, funny thing though is that the price of bread did not change.

They tried to fine Telkom R3,7bn back in 2003(?) for anti competitive behaviour but Telkom gave them the middle finger. So IMO the jury is still out on this organisation. They are most probably trying but are seriously lacking in skills.