Brakpan FTTH - 123Net

[jackshiels]

I said they do but they don't offer it. Everywhere they provide a proposal they have to work out an attractive pricing rather than having standard pricing. If you simply go with DFA they will provide it to you if they have a node nearby but at business rates because they don't have a FTTH offering.

I looked at the other providers throughout and they aren't better. At 50 Mbps you are going to go through that 400GB cap in no time once you discover Youtube 4k or get IPTV. 123net is already future proof for all of that. Their 50 Mbps is R1499 but includes 1000Mbps local. Again show me which other provider offers 1000 Mbps local and what they charge for it. Without the local it would probably be ~R900 for a 50 Mbps symmetric uncapped connection.

Explain how Vox are offering FTTH over DFA right now?

400GB is for now. 4k is currently not a reality for most consumers as there is no content. Besides, it is still a huge amount of data. Vox will increase caps as time goes on. With 1080p IPTV and downloads I use about 250GB/month

123Net have full control over pricing long term. Just remember that another provider is not going to be so keen to come in if fibre is already laid. At least with Telkom you can change ISP's - 123Net lock you into their services. Gigabit local is nice, but being limited to 10Mb international is archaic. Having to pay R1.5k a month just to download at a modern speed internationally is not a viable solution - even the folks in Bishops Court in CT are balking at FTTH prices higher than a grand a month.

Rather provide an RFP like we did - get multiple offers and go for the best one financially, time-wise and service wise.

 

[Swa]

Explain how Vox are offering FTTH over DFA right now?

400GB is for now. 4k is currently not a reality for most consumers as there is no content. Besides, it is still a huge amount of data. Vox will increase caps as time goes on. With 1080p IPTV and downloads I use about 250GB/month

123Net have full control over pricing long term. Just remember that another provider is not going to be so keen to come in if fibre is already laid. At least with Telkom you can change ISP's - 123Net lock you into their services. Gigabit local is nice, but being limited to 10Mb international is archaic. Having to pay R1.5k a month just to download at a modern speed internationally is not a viable solution - even the folks in Bishops Court in CT are balking at FTTH prices higher than a grand a month.

Rather provide an RFP like we did - get multiple offers and go for the best one financially, time-wise and service wise.

I don't know where you and Alkine get your info from. You keep saying 123Net isn't a good proposition but when I bring the facts they are shown to be. R1.5k for the modern international speed you refer to includes the local portion. You keep comparing apples to pears here and forget that if you don't take the local you pay a lot less. The 10 Mbps for R449 was an example to compare to Alkine's Greencom pricing of R684. So it's cheaper and I don't know where you are getting the term archaic from as others are charging more for a 10 Mbps connection. If you want higher than that you can have it for under a grand.

Even if we did an RFP for which we don't have the capacity I don't doubt 123Net will still have the best proposal. Don't see why we should go with capped solutions. Sure you are happy with 400GB but similarly someone else wouldn't be and where someone may be happy with 100GB you won't be. Caps just confuse things and it's time we move away from them.

123Net is also the only one willing to combine areas to make up the 300 interested signups. Most other provider are looking for 500 people to actually take the service in a single suburb before they will consider it. That's half the people in my area. Not going to happen.

 

[jackshiels]

I don't know where you and Alkine get your info from. You keep saying 123Net isn't a good proposition but when I bring the facts they are shown to be. R1.5k for the modern international speed you refer to includes the local portion. You keep comparing apples to pears here and forget that if you don't take the local you pay a lot less. The 10 Mbps for R449 was an example to compare to Alkine's Greencom pricing of R684. So it's cheaper and I don't know where you are getting the term archaic from as others are charging more for a 10 Mbps connection. If you want higher than that you can have it for under a grand.

Even if we did an RFP for which we don't have the capacity I don't doubt 123Net will still have the best proposal. Don't see why we should go with capped solutions. Sure you are happy with 400GB but similarly someone else wouldn't be and where someone may be happy with 100GB you won't be. Caps just confuse things and it's time we move away from them.

123Net is also the only one willing to combine areas to make up the 300 interested signups. Most other provider are looking for 500 people to actually take the service in a single suburb before they will consider it. That's half the people in my area. Not going to happen.

If they are the only provider that will come then that's ok. However my problems with them are:

1. Closed access
2. Expensive international data
3. Little to no prospect of competition from a level 1 infrastructure side.

They need to open up to other ISP's on their network before they become a viable competitor.

 

[Johnatan56]

If they are the only provider that will come then that's ok. However my problems with them are:

1. Closed access
2. Expensive international data
3. Little to no prospect of competition from a level 1 infrastructure side.

They need to open up to other ISP's on their network before they become a viable competitor.

1. No, they are open access. I have asked. They just prefer if you use them for internet as well and at that price point it's a good offer.
2. No, quite cheap actually. R450 for 10Mbps. You are again forgetting to reference the ~R400 for the 1Gbps [-]international[/-] national uncapped/unshaped data.
3. That problem would be with any fiber provider.

Also, the 1Gbps local will also be for all locally cached content. Most of your YouTube videos are cached locally, all of steam is cached locally.

 

[jackshiels]

1. No, they are open access. I have asked. They just prefer if you use them for internet as well and at that price point it's a good offer.
2. No, quite cheap actually. R450 for 10Mbps. You are again forgetting to reference the ~R400 for the 1Gbps international uncapped/unshaped data.
3. That problem would be with any fiber provider.

Also, the 1Gbps local will also be for all locally cached content. Most of your YouTube videos are cached locally, all of steam is cached locally.

1. Have not seen any of this.
2. There is no R400/m for 1Gbps international unchaped data.
3. Not all areas. We have both Telkom and Frogfoot rolling out. In smaller areas yes, which is why you must choose carefully.

 

[Johnatan56]

1. Have not seen any of this.
2. There is no R400/m for 1Gbps international unchaped data.
3. Not all areas. We have both Telkom and Frogfoot rolling out. In smaller areas yes, which is why you must choose carefully.

Sorry, typo. Meant to write national.

 

[Swa]

Well they want my contact info to discuss. Was out today so will see tomorrow.

 

[Slaught3r]

Well they want my contact info to discuss. Was out today so will see tomorrow.

They being 123? Please PM me if you have any news - very keen to get this going.

 

[Swa]

They being 123? Please PM me if you have any news - very keen to get this going.

No the newspaper.

 

[Swa]

@Alkine: I don't know which flyers it is you distributed but if the Lynnwood facebook page is an indication it's no wonder you wasted money.

 

[Swa]

I would like to know where these R200 Vumatel packages are. The cheapest is R424 for 4/1 Mbps 20GB.

 

[Alkine]

@Alkine: I don't know which flyers it is you distributed but if the Lynnwood facebook page is an indication it's no wonder you wasted money.

Wow really? Thank you for your inputs that I can do absolutely nothing with. Care to let me know why you think it is so horrible? What can I do to improve it in your view?

Also let me know why you think the facebook page has any relevance to the effectiveness of flyers. Have you distributed flyers and it worked great for you? Do you attribute this to your facebook page?

You yourself complained that the flyers you distributed were not effective, that must mean by your logic that your facebook page is not that good either???

I would like to know where these R200 Vumatel packages are. The cheapest is R424 for 4/1 Mbps 20GB.

I visited the page (I saw them on Vumatel Protal) and the packages have changed (like they do all the time in this fast paced business). You are correct, the R200 p/m 4 Mbps 20 GB package is now priced at R424, R75 cheaper than the uncapped package, R224 more expensive than I had indicated. The R350 p/m 4 Mbps 200 GB package has also disappeared. This would make sense as the indication I got from the fibre providers was that it costs R200 - R300 to provide the port to an ISP before they deliver services on it. Things change all the time, when I did my research at the end of August it was R200 p/m 4 Mbps 20 GB, and R350 p/m 4 Mbps 200 GB. My guess is this was part of their business strategy at the time to offer these packages to increase the uptake in their areas.

Since we are following an open RFP process we get to choose the providers that give us the best prices (amongst many other things). To date we have just shy of 400 shows of interest in Lynnwood, and we are expecting at least 8 different proposals to be submitted by open access fibre providers. I will post an update next week Saturday when all the proposals are in.

I'm sorry that I got into an argument with you, I tried to help by warning you about potential pitfalls or problems that you could experience with your project (based on the experience of my project) and things got out of hand.

 

[Swa]

Wow really? Thank you for your inputs that I can do absolutely nothing with. Care to let me know why you think it is so horrible? What can I do to improve it in your view?

Also let me know why you think the facebook page has any relevance to the effectiveness of flyers. Have you distributed flyers and it worked great for you? Do you attribute this to your facebook page?

You yourself complained that the flyers you distributed were not effective, that must mean by your logic that your facebook page is not that good either???

I didn't mean it's horrible. Sorry if you misunderstood, I should have been more clear. If anything it's good for people like us but not for the general populace. I don't have a good copy of the flyer so I'm going by what I can see. It looks like your leaflets have 3 times more information that my flyers have. Wrong strategy. People are generally not capable of nor interested in reading and comprehending so much. 90% of people will stop reading after the first paragraph. If you didn't convince them in the first few sentences they need fibre you've lost them.

The tips I got was to use catchphrases with the strong points. Like "Did you know you can have super fast internet?" or "Are you pulling out your hair in frustration over not being able to connect?" or like in our case "Did you know you can have free internet now guaranteed for 2 years?" Then follow it up with phrases like "Register now for free and with no obligation."

People respond to emotion and small factoids. A large informational leaflet will get thrown away by some the moment they take it out of the postbox. You have to convince people to register right when they start reading it. More information for those interested should be placed well away from it.

I also found out that most people don't use facebook for things like this. They open it in their leisure time liking pages and joining groups but if they have to complete a registration process they don't do it and just close the page.

I visited the page (I saw them on Vumatel Protal) and the packages have changed (like they do all the time in this fast paced business). You are correct, the R200 p/m 4 Mbps 20 GB package is now priced at R424, R75 cheaper than the uncapped package, R224 more expensive than I had indicated. The R350 p/m 4 Mbps 200 GB package has also disappeared. This would make sense as the indication I got from the fibre providers was that it costs R200 - R300 to provide the port to an ISP before they deliver services on it. Things change all the time, when I did my research at the end of August it was R200 p/m 4 Mbps 20 GB, and R350 p/m 4 Mbps 200 GB. My guess is this was part of their business strategy at the time to offer these packages to increase the uptake in their areas.

Since we are following an open RFP process we get to choose the providers that give us the best prices (amongst many other things). To date we have just shy of 400 shows of interest in Lynnwood, and we are expecting at least 8 different proposals to be submitted by open access fibre providers. I will post an update next week Saturday when all the proposals are in.

I'm sorry that I got into an argument with you, I tried to help by warning you about potential pitfalls or problems that you could experience with your project (based on the experience of my project) and things got out of hand.

Nah it's ok. It's just that I've gone through 123Net's options and they keep getting better. I hope you find the provider you're looking for. Just don't exclude 123Net and ask them for a detailed proposal as well. You can always have them sign a legal document to provide things like open access and the packages you want but from what I've seen so far their uncapped packages beat most capped ones.

 

[Swa]

I would suggest anyone interested in doing something like this contact an organisation in their area with a good marketing department. They know how to market something and also have more authoritative clout.

 

[Alkine]

I would like to know where these R200 Vumatel packages are. The cheapest is R424 for 4/1 Mbps 20GB.

I see those packages are still on the Web Africa Website for Vumatel fibre. https://www.webafrica.co.za/fibre/

Not sure why they vanished from the Vumatel Website.

 

[Swa]

Here's the problem, at R199 plus installation for 20GB I might as well stay on mobile. And that's the reasoning for most people. These providers including Vumatel still has a long way to go in learning how to make fibre worthwhile.

 

[SilverNodashi]

Here's the problem, at R199 plus installation for 20GB I might as well stay on mobile. And that's the reasoning for most people. These providers including Vumatel still has a long way to go in learning how to make fibre worthwhile.

You can't really compare 3G to Fibre. It's like comparing a Ferrari to a Beem. Of cause you could just as well drive a beem and say Ferrari have a long way in learning to make cars worth while. Unless you've driven a Ferrari, you simply won't understand the difference.

 

[Swa]

You can't really compare 3G to Fibre. It's like comparing a Ferrari to a Beem. Of cause you could just as well drive a beem and say Ferrari have a long way in learning to make cars worth while. Unless you've driven a Ferrari, you simply won't understand the difference.

Well using your analogy is would be like Ferrari telling you you can only drive 1km a month.

 

[SilverNodashi]

Well using your analogy is would be like Ferrari telling you you can only drive 1km a month.

Nope, that's your wallet telling you you can only drive 1Km per month
Or the goverment
Or SARS.
The fact that the faster car consumed petrol quicker has little todo with why you want it. But I think we both understand the point.
For some, it's acceptable to pay R299 for slow 3G, with overloaded towers and regular downtime. For other's, it's not and a faster line with better uptime is preferred.

 

[Swa]

Nope, that's your wallet telling you you can only drive 1Km per month
Or the goverment
Or SARS.
The fact that the faster car consumed petrol quicker has little todo with why you want it. But I think we both understand the point.
For some, it's acceptable to pay R299 for slow 3G, with overloaded towers and regular downtime. For other's, it's not and a faster line with better uptime is preferred.

That's exactly the problem. They're selling a Ferrari but giving you a BMW instead. There's no reason to pay the inflated price when a Ford will do for most.