CapeXit 2

[Jer1cho]

Sounds like Collectivism, to me.

That's fine lol. What that guy in the video sounds like is this.

 

[vigras rojara]

So in terms of historical precedent, has any territory actually gone through with a secession after a referendum?

A few of the southern US states in the 1800s, I think.

That worked out all nice and peacefully for them. Great success.

 

[lexity]

What is the most recent "AREA" for the Independent Cape?

Is it as simple as the entire Western Cape Province, or is it overlapping into parts of NC and EC Provinces?

It's not as important a question as one might think.

For that reason I don't anticipate there'll be much contention within the CIM over area.

Currently the loudest, most coherent voices call for either the WC as its borders currently exist, or the entire historic Cape (see capeindependenceparty map at their website).

Crucially, tho', if the WC's border is agreed, then this is not suddenly the end of anyone's right to secede (or even to ascede) again.

The more this penny drops for people, the more they will begin to appreciate the effect it has on the criminally-minded in their midst.

The strongest social force for cohesion is actually the threat of separation.

An historical example is the threat of separation issued by the Plebians to the Patricians, after suffering under a 2nd-class citizen, inequality before the law scenario.

Many bad actors with power can be brought to heel this way.... as long as you don't issue milk-toast, idle threats. You have to mean it. And those actors are nothing if not expert as sniffing out a milk-toast threat to secede.

 

[Cray]

I think I asked this question about two years ago

I did search and came up with nothing. @lexity likes to cite independance from Colonial rule as evidence that this kind of thing has happened a lot but cannot find any actual examples of something like this ever ocurring.

 

[vigras rojara]

I did search and came up with nothing. @lexity likes to site independance from Colonial rule as evidence that this kind of thing has happened a lot but cannot find any actaul examples of something like this ever ocurring.

Bear in mind that the Referendum Party themselves only cite a failed example (Venetia) on their website.

If their greatest success story is a failure, you know they have nothing.

 

[lexity]

chtGPT Summary​

So, at least 10 notable territories have held a referendum prior to or as part of their secession attempts. The exact number can vary depending on how one classifies a referendum (e.g., binding vs. non-binding, legal vs. illegal), but these are among the most prominent examples. Many other secessionist movements also hold or plan referenda, but the legal and political complexities often make them more controversial.

You three are not even trying to do your own research.

chatGPT is such a low bar for you, and still..... nah, too difficult.... should not be up to individuals to do their own research.

 

[vigras rojara]

You three are not even trying to do your own research.

chatGPT is such a low bar for you, and still..... nah, too difficult.... should not be up to individuals to do their own research.

The question was around successes, not attempts.

Carry on...

 

[quovadis]

Ftfy.

Spoken like the abusive husband, who only wants the very best for his wife..

If I follow your edits, then the person being ‘spoken like’ is you. I’d suggest perhaps resorting to direct engagement with the points raised rather than narrative analogies for performative effect.

 

[lexity]

That's fine lol. What that guy in the video sounds like is this.

View attachment 1864839

The support is mostly Afrikaans-speaking.

The English-speakers are mostly on the liberal side.

Craig is a hybrid, being a Brit, originally, and now married to an Afrikaans women, and having three Afrikaans-speaking kids.

His only real weakness, imo, is that he doesn't see who it is that maintains the faux borders as they exist, in SA. He's under the impression as are many, that the grass roots chooses it's political reality rather than the astro-turf.

 

[Cray]

You three are not even trying to do your own research.

chatGPT is such a low bar for you, and still..... nah, too difficult.... should not be up to individuals to do their own research.

So, at least 10 notable territories have held a referendum prior to or as part of their secession attempts.

Successful secessions Lexie.

 

[wingnut771]

By the time this happens the demographic of ct will be 80% black so it will never happen.

 

[lexity]

Successful secessions Lexie.

All seceded territories were successful.

Perhaps you want a list of failed secession attempts i.e. groups that campaign but who efforts came to nothing and were forced to remain part of the motherland.

 

[Jer1cho]

The support is mostly Afrikaans-speaking.

The English-speakers are mostly on the liberal side.

Craig is a hybrid, being a Brit, originally, and now married to an Afrikaans women, and having three Afrikaans-speaking kids.

His only real weakness, imo, is that he doesn't see who it is that maintains the faux borders as they exist, in SA. He's under the impression as are many, that the grass roots chooses it's political reality rather than the astro-turf.

My father is also a British immigrant, who came in the 80's. Also married an afrikaans woman, and I was schooled in both languages, and am fluent in both. My dad would never have that kind of entitlement though. He still sees himself as a guest here.

 

[Splinter]

All seceded territories were successful.

Perhaps you want a list of failed secession attempts i.e. groups that campaign but who efforts came to nothing and were forced to remain part of the motherland.

So why do you refuse to list all these successes? Surely not the "do your own research" deflection, when you providing actual examples would really support your position?

 

[lexity]

By the time this happens the demographic of ct will be 80% black so it will never happen.

Reminder: The vast majority of black citizens in SA are Conservative in political leaning.

Were it not for Anglo-American, corporate control/influence over leaders of the RET parties, they would already have abandoned them, politically.

The Anglos of the Rhodes mentality, have given bozo leaders an air of respectability to the unsuspecting black voters..

 

[vigras rojara]

All seceded territories were successful.

Perhaps you want a list of failed secession attempts i.e. groups that campaign but who efforts came to nothing and were forced to remain part of the motherland.

Do these seceded territories have names?

 

[wingnut771]

Reminder: The vast majority of black citizens in SA are Conservative in political leaning.

Were it not for Anglo-American, corporate control/influence over leaders of the RET parties, they would already have abandoned them, politically.

The Anglos of the Rhodes mentality, have given bozo leaders an air of respectability to the unsuspecting black voters..

but have no concept of country.

 

[lexity]

My father is also a British immigrant, who came in the 80's. Also married an afrikaans woman, and I was schooled in both languages, and am fluent in both. My dad would never have that kind of entitlement though. He still sees himself as a guest here.

Reminds me of the question asked during one of the polls conducted by the CIAG/Victory Research.

If I recall, a staggeringly high number of black interviewees cited race as pre-eminent as a factor in deciding which SAns should behave as guests in SA.

 

[lexity]

Do these seceded territories have names?

United States of America.

Perhaps not the result of a formal referendum(although I haven't yet done any research on that), but as far as successful secessions go, surely the most obvious example.

p.s. I hasten to add that this de facto success only extends to the first 80 years of USA history. At which point it can be argued that an effective reversal of the secession took place.

 

[Jer1cho]

Reminds me of the question asked during one of the polls conducted by the CIAG/Victory Research.

If I recall, a staggeringly high number of black interviewees cited race as pre-eminent as a factor in deciding which SAns should behave as guests in SA.

Entitlement comes in all colors in SA i'm afraid. I don't like it when people use race as a validation towards being gatekeepers for land, no matter who it is.