Capitec - Stolen Money

[|tera|]

I had a thread about this same issue with Standard Bank a few years ago. Same issue, weeks later my gf's and my account would get charged for transactions we forgot about already. Standard Bank blamed the merchants and Mastercard, never got a resolution for it. I'm now with FNB and never experienced this yet.

 

[MagicDude4Eva]

sounds to me more a case where customers spend money over xmas, never checked their statements and now got the surprise as transactions went off. managing one's money better seems to be the solution - or?

 

[3WA]

I've only ever had one credit card, with Standard Bank, and having transactions go through weeks later has been standard. I've always had to keep independent records of what I spent, not knowing when the bank would put transactions through. Now it seems this is bad practice????

 

[Kosmik]

I've only ever had one credit card, with Standard Bank, and having transactions go through weeks later has been standard. I've always had to keep independent records of what I spent, not knowing when the bank would put transactions through. Now it seems this is bad practice????

In a modern age with sms confirmation on transactions and activity on accounts, yes. But for transactions under a certain amount, the machine does not need to communicate with the main banks and some shop holders synch in batches, so late billing is not the banks fault.

 

[Bismuth]

I had something similar happen when I was with FNB, got an SMS when the amount was "reserved", and another one later when the merchant banked their machine. I almost sh@t myself, but checking my statements showed that the amount was deducted only once.

I have been with Capitec for awhile now, and am quite happy with their service. I don't think a delay in a transaction is necessarily the bank's fault, provided it was only deducted once, even if that only happened two weeks later. I mean, it's money you spent, that is no longer yours.

B

 

[Ockie]

I have been with Capitec for awhile now, and am quite happy with their service.

I am also very happy with them. I have had no problems. I am just getting very worried. People saying they gonna close their accounts...ATMS have run out of money and people apparently telling others to clean out their accounts. This scared the crap out of me and I have impulsively transferred my little nest egg and remaining balance on my main account to my Virgin Money card. I am really worried that people really start to panic...then everyone starts scrambling to withdraw all their money and then the bank gets plunged into a crisis. I really hope this does not happen though...but I just cannot afford for that to happen to the money that I have saved up.

I hope this blows over very very quickly so I can put my money back. :-(

 

[KalMaverick]

People don't mind when the bank doesn't take the money off their accounts hoping they scored, and get a huge shock when they are actually charged later.

Twits

When they made the purchases they got a SMS confirming the purchase as well as the balance reflecting the amount, this is not a case of thinking you scored.

The fact is weeks later the transaction no longer is being processed so the money is back into your account, however there is no item on your bank statement saying "Money for transaction X reversed" or a SMS, just a higher balance.

You expect that if you received the SMS the money is paid over it will stay 'reserved' and not magically appear as available again.

I've only ever had one credit card, with Standard Bank, and having transactions go through weeks later has been standard.

A credit card is not a debit card, or is it? I always thought a debit card the transaction is supposed to be instant. Going into a negative shouldn't even be possible.

I have been with Capitec for awhile now, and am quite happy with their service. I don't think a delay in a transaction is necessarily the bank's fault, provided it was only deducted once, even if that only happened two weeks later. I mean, it's money you spent, that is no longer yours.

According to Capitec it was the Merchant's that didn't 'bank' their POS machines. How is it though that Woolworths, Pick n Pay, Spar, Checkers, Ster Kinekor all decided they would do it this morning at 4am, even though every subsequent transaction has gone through as normal?

 

[Captain Beer]

Both my gf and her mom's money was taken off at 4 this morning.

@rodga
Yes they did.

Same. R199.99 was taken off. Got SMS notification at 4:30 or so.
A bit worried about all the rumors, this account has about R950,000 in it.

 

[KalMaverick]

Was it a double transaction?

I'm reading a lot of conflicting information some saying they have checked their statements and there are double transactions and others saying it was just double SMS notifications but one transaction on their statement.

 

[Bismuth]

I am also very happy with them. I have had no problems. I am just getting very worried. People saying they gonna close their accounts...ATMS have run out of money and people apparently telling others to clean out their accounts. This scared the crap out of me and I have impulsively transferred my little nest egg and remaining balance on my main account to my Virgin Money card. I am really worried that people really start to panic...then everyone starts scrambling to withdraw all their money and then the bank gets plunged into a crisis. I really hope this does not happen though...but I just cannot afford for that to happen to the money that I have saved up.

I hope this blows over very very quickly so I can put my money back. :-(

I drew my daily limit from a Capitec ATM today (Mall@Reds), now I rarely draw cash and certainly not my daily limit, but I was helping out a friend, so yeah. That ATM didn't seem to have a problem dispensing the cash (at least not the amount I withdrew). Funnily enough, didn't even KNOW about the Capitec issue until this thread on MyBB. So makes me wonder if they think I am cleaning out my account, heh, I hope people don't make a run on Capitec and force them to close, as I really don't want to change to any of the other banks.

B

 

[Bismuth]

Was it a double transaction?

I'm reading a lot of conflicting information some saying they have checked their statements and there are double transactions and others saying it was just double SMS notifications but one transaction on their statement.

From what I've been reading, it's actually just double SMS notifications, not double transactions, although some people claim to have had double transactions occur. I think if this is indeed the case, and can be proven, then the bank will reverse one of the transactions.

From what else I've read, what has happened is that the funds were "reserved" at the time of purchase, but apparently that reservation only lasts 10 days, after which, if not claimed by the merchant, it falls away and the funds are available again. However, the merchant has 6 months to process/claim that transaction, at which point the money is actually deducted. Now this I was not aware of, so I think implementing a system that SMS's you when a reservation expires, would be a good idea, then you would know that the money hasn't been deducted yet, but could be at any time (doubt any merchant would take anywhere 6 months, though, more like the month or so like in this case), and that you know not to spend or budget it.

Been interesting learning this, as I didn't know about half of it.

B

 

[Tinuva]

A credit card is not a debit card, or is it? I always thought a debit card the transaction is supposed to be instant. Going into a negative shouldn't even be possible.

Don't know about Capitec, but on FNB my cheque account on which my debit card is, can most definitely go into negative, but then again, I have an overdraw facility on it, which costs nothing, only when it goes active. So generally speak, I stay far away from it, it is there just in case of emergency.

According to Capitec it was the Merchant's that didn't 'bank' their POS machines. How is it though that Woolworths, Pick n Pay, Spar, Checkers, Ster Kinekor all decided they would do it this morning at 4am, even though every subsequent transaction has gone through as normal?

Many of them could be using the same merchant's POS machine. Also not all pick n pay's necessarily use the same merchant's POS machine, depends on the specific branch.

Would be interesting to see which merchant this was actually, and even if it was one. Perhaps this merchant had a problem getting the money from Capitec only, which is why only Capitec was affected, so rather look like they did the run late, because there was some other problem with Capitec which they are obviously mum about.

 

[KalMaverick]

Don't know about Capitec, but on FNB my cheque account on which my debit card is, can most definitely go into negative, but then again, I have an overdraw facility on it, which costs nothing, only when it goes active. So generally speak, I stay far away from it, it is there just in case of emergency.

Well it is a cheque account with a overdraft facility, however a savings accounting with no overdraft facility? Does not make sense to be honest. This is in line with what the people at the bank told me as well when opening the account, no transaction can be processed unless there is money in the account (ie no overdraft).

From what else I've read, what has happened is that the funds were "reserved" at the time of purchase, but apparently that reservation only lasts 10 days, after which, if not claimed by the merchant, it falls away and the funds are available again. However, the merchant has 6 months to process/claim that transaction, at which point the money is actually deducted.

That's my concern... Why does the money get reversed after 10 days? It seems like a silly system (from the little information I know about it) and just opens up opportunity for issues.

Would be interesting to see which merchant this was actually, and even if it was one. Perhaps this merchant had a problem getting the money from Capitec only, which is why only Capitec was affected, so rather look like they did the run late, because there was some other problem with Capitec which they are obviously mum about.

Admittedly I haven't looked at the other banks to see if this is happening there but I'm guessing it's just Capitec. You would think they would be aware of such an issue and send SMSs out to everyone in order to point this out.

We must keep in mind the target market of Capitec and the fact the majority of customers are going to be 'bank' illiterate, heck most might not even have access to internet banking, relying solely on SMS. Capitec's response has also been quite poor.

 

[Flowerhat]

oops i just saw an sms from capitec that read:

We apologise for late transaction updates on purchases made between 13 - 18 december 2012 and any duplicate SMS messages you received. Info 0860102043

 

[Other Pineapple Smurf]

I had a thread about this same issue with Standard Bank a few years ago. Same issue, weeks later my gf's and my account would get charged for transactions we forgot about already. Standard Bank blamed the merchants and Mastercard, never got a resolution for it. I'm now with FNB and never experienced this yet.

Same, reason why I closed my SB cheque account.

In a modern age with sms confirmation on transactions and activity on accounts, yes. But for transactions under a certain amount, the machine does not need to communicate with the main banks and some shop holders synch in batches, so late billing is not the banks fault.

Don't buy it at all. My charge was for R289 at Woolies 16-Dec. Floor limits have been removed by default on all new machines to cut down on CNP fraud and consumers going over the limit.

I've had this crap with Standard Bank but never 3 weeks after the purchase

 

[Kosmik]

Don't buy it at all. My charge was for R289 at Woolies 16-Dec. Floor limits have been removed by default on all new machines to cut down on CNP fraud and consumers going over the limit.

I've had this crap with Standard Bank but never 3 weeks after the purchase

I've still seen transactions come through late, a week or even two , especially with fast food outlets. Last time I tested that limit, it was R300 but that was early 2000's so could have been lowered but late synching certainly happens these days still.

 

[Cool E]

I really dont understand why people are complaining. The bank deducted money based on the transaction that client made. The delay of sms notifications means nothing. Anyway , we all know its January.

 

[rodga]

I really dont understand why people are complaining. The bank deducted money based on the transaction that client made. The delay of sms notifications means nothing. Anyway , we all know its January.

It wasn't the notifications that were delayed. It was the actual transaction, so the cash was only taken on the 6th of Jan instead of 18th Dec.

I had 2 that were delayed but under R100 so I didn't get any notification.

 

[KalMaverick]

Please accept our sincerest apology for the late deduction of purchases made at Point of Sale machines earlier in December. We are investigating why these deductions were only presented for processing over this past week-end. We accept that this issue will inconvenience our clients and we request clients to verify on their statements that these amounts did not go off twice from their accounts. Please be assured that we are fully aware of the frustration to those clients affected and we are liaising closely with the other bank who represents the bulk of these late merchant transactions. Once we have full clarity we will communicate with those affected, individually.

A bit of a better response than the "It's the merchant's fault" they had earlier.

We can confirm that all these transactions debited late on our clients’ accounts were done at ABSA-supported card machines during the period 13 to 18 December 2012. In particular the majority of these transactions occurred at retailers supported by ABSA and who have the card machine integrated into their own till systems.
This late submission of transactions by ABSA is unusual but not outside the interbank card system rules. It is still uncertain how many of other banks’ clients were also affected.
We do need to reiterate that no Capitec Bank client had a double deduction of the same amount on their account. We understand the extend of the frustration of this experience to some of our clients who transacted on these days at those particular card machines. We will communicate directly with those individuals affected.

Quite interesting after reading how many people can 'prove' they have double debits on their statements.

 

[akescpt]

standard bank usually sends through the sms and "reserves" the funds. the statement will have "outstanding" in the line item iirc. depending on the retailer this "outstanding" stamp is removed during the course of 1 or 2 weeks.

the issue is the double sms by the looks of it. and with the monday being a holiday as well could have caused a delay also.