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Question of the Day: What is the ultimate French toast topping?
Do we need a harder lockdown?
- Thread starter bwana
- Start date
lionroars
Active Member
If we had a grown up, considerate population, we wouldn't have a incompetent, corrupt government!
Bismuth
Expert Member
End the lockdown. If lockdowns work, why are we having another one? If they don't, why are we having another one? 21-days to "flatten the curve" was how long ago now, 9 months? Heck, babies are being born now that were conceived at the start of all this hysteria.
Regarding face diapers, social distancing and all that, let businesses make their own decisions to allow or require them, or not. That is the reason people are resisting, that are not being given a choice. Give people a choice here, and you will find that a remarkable amount of them will do the right thing, compared to now. Force people to do something, and while some will comply, most will resist. It's human nature.
This virus, as with many others, isn't going anywhere, regardless of what restrictions are put in place, vaccines or anything like that.
Regarding face diapers, social distancing and all that, let businesses make their own decisions to allow or require them, or not. That is the reason people are resisting, that are not being given a choice. Give people a choice here, and you will find that a remarkable amount of them will do the right thing, compared to now. Force people to do something, and while some will comply, most will resist. It's human nature.
This virus, as with many others, isn't going anywhere, regardless of what restrictions are put in place, vaccines or anything like that.
utopianblaster
Active Member
all countries that have locked down still all have 2nd, 3rd waves.. many of the hardest locked down states in the US exhibit the highest number of deaths. There is no data to show they have been effective. And still numbnuts say things like "imagine how bad it would have been if we hadnt locked down" has any cost/benefit analysis ever been done on lock downs by any government? If so please someone direct me to it.
If govt really believed, right from the very beginning that the lockdowns were meant for our health, to prepare hospitals for influx of infections , and whatever other reasons they said it was meant for, then why did they proceed to "mismanage' over half a trillion of the funds which were dedicated for our "protection" ?
LCBXX
Honorary Master
Question: without the state of emergency and lockdown, would the ANC be able to still enforce the regulations, such as alcohol sales/beach closures/etc?
utopianblaster
Active Member
utopianblaster
Active Member
Portuguese courts have judged it unreliable, the person who developed it as a lab tool stated clearly it was never meant as a diagnostic tool. PCR test is a big part of the problem.
Pineapple Smurf
Pineapple Beer Connoisseur
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No
Tired of this kak now
Please go home and sanitize
Stop going to the beaches
I will report you to Cele
And no more ordering 'pot of tea' at the restaurants for you and all your friends, we all know it is a Shiraz/Pinotage
Tired of this kak now
Please go home and sanitize
Stop going to the beaches
I will report you to Cele
And no more ordering 'pot of tea' at the restaurants for you and all your friends, we all know it is a Shiraz/Pinotage
Tabac
Honorary Master
Jou Poesman. What's your nearest Postnet so i can send you a turd ?
Kola_CT
Expert Member
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Well said.
Sworaxe
Expert Member
Weird how my home looks like my work. Also why are there so many people in my home too. Weird.
After some years, having laws that can't be enforced results in citizens ignoring more laws - in other words, a chaotic society. Government in general should carefully consider the need for a law before just adding one more to the statute books.
I am not in support of full lockdown as I know a few people who eventually lost their jobs after first lockdown. The problem is the uneducated which makes up the bigger population who doesn't take wearing a mask and keeping distance seriously.
I am in support of no social gatherings and forcing employers to have people working from home that can. Too many managers in South Africa that still believes in micro management and who believes people are working when they can see them sitting on a seat looking at a monitor.
The government unfortunately has no problem solving skills and wants to mitigate the problem instead of addressing the core issues.
I am in support of no social gatherings and forcing employers to have people working from home that can. Too many managers in South Africa that still believes in micro management and who believes people are working when they can see them sitting on a seat looking at a monitor.
The government unfortunately has no problem solving skills and wants to mitigate the problem instead of addressing the core issues.
Bluebird2fly
New Member
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I think give level 3 a change. It is not easy to send your staff home telling them there is no business due to the covid lockdown 4. The tourism industry was struck hard and so all of it employees, most companies spent all their savings and UIF during the first hard lockdown. How will so many people give food to their kids and a roof over their heads with another hard lockdown? As I am sure the government will not be able to support funding people who will loose income again. If they don't even have the funds for the vaccine.
In principle I agree. The trouble is that with disease transmission, it is usually not the person ignoring a rule but the others around them whom they infect.
Without a successful and lasting vaccine, ultimately COVID-19 incidence in the population will become like common 'flu where pretty well everyone has had it and catches a new one that comes around. We will all have had it or have natural immunity.
Sadly I think we do
there are too many irresponsible people out there who don’t care about anyone but themselves
as long as this sense of entitlement persist this virus is not going to go away
with the holiday season over people are coming back and exposing the rest of us to the virus because they couldn’t care how much they social distanced or wore masks
the alcohol industry is not interested in the employees welfare
all they interested in is how much money they can make
they not interested in the after effects of what alcohol does to people out there
just how much money they can make
they not interested in how to get people to drink responsibly
all they interested in is how much more alcohol they can sell and put even more in their pockets
the banning of cigarettes was wrong because even though cigarettes do cause pain and suffering it does not overload the hospitals as much as Alcohol
cigarettes kill people but alcohol does far worse
it kills people
it maims people
it destroys families
it overloads the hospitals and trauma units
it causes woman and child abuse
lit causes financial hardships
it breaks up families
it causes accidents
it causes paraplegics
drunken driving is far deadlier than cigarettes
it causes far more damage than any cigarette can
i feel even the advertisements for alcohol are false
they show a wonderful life but not the harsh reality of what alcohol does to people
it’s all well for them to state in the ads drink responsibly but there are people out there that those words mean nothing
they don’t care
they don’t care about others
all alcohol advertisements on TV radio, bill boards, screen and paper should be banned just like the cigarettes ads
it’s sad when people put money before people’s health
Cyril is stuck between the devil and the deep sea
which is more important?
the economy or people’s health and lives
ether way there’s a drastic cost
you look after the people - the economy suffers
you look after the economy - people the people suffer
is money more important than people’s lives?
very tough decision
if people are culled off then there will be no one to boost the economy
if people would act and behave more responsibly by wearing masks, social distancing, not abusing alcohol and acting irresponsibly then all these restrictions would not have to be imposed
im not saying people should not drink - they entitled to it but if they do drink then they should do it responsibly so no one gets hurt
i know that people will take offence by my comments but those that do are the exact ones who are abusing everything and are feeling they are ”entitled privilege” few
one final note
there should not be a double standard when it comes to the elite and the rest of the population
cele must do his job properly
there should be not favorites
Matache sons wedding is a prime case of privileged favouritism
if anyone else did what happened at the wedding drinking smoking no social distancing no masks they would be thrown head first into jail
but because it was the high anc erchlon nothing has been done about it
favouritism
malems is allowed to show Cyril the fingered and walk around without a mask or social distance
he is supposed to be a leader and encourage people to behave yet he does exactly the opposite
but where is Cele
hiding in the cracks avoiding the issue because malema is part of the elite core and must not be touched
as long as this situation is allowed this country will sadly go down
people will die enmass because the government won’t take the offenders to task for their actions
no, the constitution clearly states that no-one shall be permitted from barring your movement within our borders, or stop you from leaving.
The SANDF going into a rural area and beating on people is profoundly worrisome and should enrage us all - New years, we all saw the vids of the people standing in their own yards, being yeld at by police to go inside. The one lady was just chilling on her doorstep, 10m from her gate, in her PJs and the police yelled at her. Then the lighter, stupidity of people being pulled out the water for surfing, chased down like thugs.
Everyone has inherent dignity and the right to have their dignity respected.
It also states that we may not be stopped from trading and earning a legal wage.
It also states that we have autonomy of our bodies, freedom of choice how to manage our own health and that we will not be subjected to medical experiments.
Under the disaster act, our constitution, in the eyes of the ncccc does not exist. Regardless if I agree or disagree about the restrictions and levels. The fact about lawfulness is that almost every single restriction is a clear violation of our bill of rights/constitutional rights. Heck, even their meetings fall short on the tests.
Everyone has the right of access to any information held by the state, and any information that is held by another person and that is required for the exercise or protection of any rights.
Therefore, the court cases, that are being dismissed, on whatever grounds, need to be heard by our constitutional court judges, they are there to interpret the LAW AS IT IS WRITTEN. Those judges are the ones that have studied the constitution and have the scope and knowledge to rule on cases pertaining to the supposed infringements of such rights. None of the lower courts can override the most important law of our land. Not one person is above it, including the NCCC. Currently, the NCCC has no oversight.
As to the rational for any more lockdowns
It's an established principle, then, that rights can be limited. The challenge, though, is to allow them to be limited only under strict conditions. If the Bill of Rights simply allowed any kind of restriction, its very purpose would be undermined.
As a result, section 36 of the Constitution, known as the limitation clause, lays down a test that any limitation must meet. The two central concepts in this test are reasonableness and proportionality. Any restriction on a right must be reasonable and must be proportional in that the impact or extent of the restriction must match the importance of the aim served by the limitation of the right.
It is my opinion that the NCCC is using section 36 as a sledgehammer with no end in sight. Sure, lockdown for 30 days, then we see-saw into lower numbers, open up, then lockdown again? Where is the line? When is the line? I don't know, I don't have any answers. I am just observing. Right now, I see the main argument is, if you do not support lockdowns and restrictions (not talking about sanitise and mask), then you are a COLD HEARTED SELFISH ******* who wants everyone to die. The other extreme is, if you do support all this, then surely you have given in to a nanny state and do not care about economics nor do you understand them.
I think the truth is somewhere in between. Many of us, feel a hybrid of emotions. Today, I am scared. I am scared that our economy will collapse and we will be run to the borders like zim ran to us. But when my dad was lying in icu with covid, I was scared of the virus. Two things may be true at the same time. Two things may be false, even if contradictory, at the same time.
EDIT/ easy to digest read about the bill of rights linky
The_MAC
Honorary Master
How do you separate the economy from peoples lives?