Drivers locked up

Syndyre said:
IANAL but I think its a criminal offence but you get different levels of criminal offences, you won't get a criminal record for running a red light. Not totally sure though.
Click to expand...

Non of us here are sure, thats why we need a lawyer.

I would like to know what each traffic offense is considered in terms of the law and what the applicable punishments are.
 
icyrus said:
Now, lets get the obvious out of the way: metro cops are the scum of the earth.
Click to expand...

Why are those enforcing laws often described as "scum of the earth" (or similar)? And then we are all concerned about our safety in SA ...
 
Trafeye said:
Why are those enforcing laws often described as "scum of the earth" (or similar)? And then we are all concerned about our safety in SA ...
Click to expand...

Because metro cops are not interested in enforcing the laws to keep us safe- they are only interested in enforcing the laws that will generate lots of revenue.
 
Trafeye said:
Why are those enforcing laws often described as "scum of the earth" (or similar)? And then we are all concerned about our safety in SA ...
Click to expand...

Because of how the laws are enforced, often very selectively.
 
icyrus said:
Because metro cops are not interested in enforcing the laws to keep us safe- they are only interested in enforcing the laws that will generate lots of revenue.
Click to expand...
Wow, thats quite a statement to make. Any evidence other than your feeling of resentment at being fined?
 
icyrus said:
Because metro cops are not interested in enforcing the laws to keep us safe- they are only interested in enforcing the laws that will generate lots of revenue.
Click to expand...

Did the people who were arrested break the law or did'nt they?

If they broke the law then they must pay the fine.

Zero tolerance is the only way South African drivers in general are gonna become more civilized when behind the steering wheel.

The argument that it's a revenue generation exercise is moot because of the fact that the people were locked up to scare the hell out of other law breakers.
 
GougedEye said:
Wow, thats quite a statement to make. Any evidence other than your feeling of resentment at being fined?
Click to expand...

One only has to take note of how speed traps are set up. You have an orifice hiding in the bushes / behind a wall who takes your picture as you speed past. A month later (OK maybe months, depending on the mood of the post office) your fine arrives in the post.
How did the taking of your picture stop you from continuing down the freeway at 100-and-plenty?
Add to this the fact that traffic fines are a line item on the Income-Expendure sheets of municipalities and traffic fines become a means of generating income rather than a way of enforcing traffic laws

[edit: I'm all for the zero tolerance plan... it definitely works, evidence of this being when Metro arrested drivers in the emergency lane along the M1/Ben Schoeman for a week. The problem arrises when it is not applied consistently]
 
Last edited:
The argument that it's a revenue generation exercise is moot because of the fact that the people were locked up to scare the hell out of other law breakers.
Click to expand...

How do you justify that then?
 
icyrus said:
Non of us here are sure, thats why we need a lawyer.
Click to expand...

Section 38 of the Criminal Procedure Act lists 4 ways in which the police may secure the attendance of an accused at court for trial. There is no rule which requires them to use a milder form (Tsose v Minister of Justice). It has been recognised that where other methods exist, it may be more desirable (but not required) to use them (S v More).They may however, not arrest someone as a punishment (MacDonald v Khumalo).

So the answer is that they can arrest you for breaking the law provided that it is order to secure your attendance at trial.

Lawyerish enough for you?
 
neio said:
Zero tolerance is the only way South African drivers in general are gonna become more civilized when behind the steering wheel..
Click to expand...

First you have to start with crime and get the real criminals caught but again there in NO BONUSES and REVENUE in that! Fsucking imbeciles these cops and anyone supporting their cause!
 
GougedEye said:
Wow, thats quite a statement to make. Any evidence other than your feeling of resentment at being fined?
Click to expand...

Open your eyes.

If speeding fines are about safety and not money why do they hide under bushes, in trees, under bridges? Why are the locations of the camera's not published. Why aren't there permanent camera's that are painted bright yellow with red stripes on highways at regular intervals?

If its not about revenue why don't metro cops pull over all the cars/buses/trucks/taxis that are clearly not roadworth and impound or crush them?

Personally, I have never got a traffic fine - except for an expired parking meter many years ago - but I am not blind to how these guys operate.

neio said:
Did the people who were arrested break the law or did'nt they?

If they broke the law then they must pay the fine.

Zero tolerance is the only way South African drivers in general are gonna become more civilized when behind the steering wheel.

The argument that it's a revenue generation exercise is moot because of the fact that the people were locked up to scare the hell out of other law breakers.
Click to expand...

I have no problems with traffic fines as long as they are done in a fair and above-board way, but locking people up for a single traffic violation that didn't cause causalities is way in excess. This is pure abuse of power - power I am not convinced they legally have.

McSack said:
One only has to take note of how speed traps are set up. You have an orifice hiding in the bushes / behind a wall who takes your picture as you speed past. A month later (OK maybe months, depending on the mood of the post office) your fine arrives in the post.
How did the taking of your picture stop you from continuing down the freeway at 100-and-plenty?
Add to this the fact that traffic fines are a line item on the Income-Expendure sheets of municipalities and traffic fines become a means of generating income rather than a way of enforcing traffic laws
Click to expand...

Exactly.
 
Getafix said:
We aren't talking about summonses, we are talking committing a criminal act and being arrested on the spot. Hell of a difference
Click to expand...
The swim did help. All apologies where due. I'm obviously confusing the different shades of illegal & their legal procedure.

I was wrong about the warrant for outstanding fines. They don't need written warrants anymore. Electronic will do.:(link
The Criminal Procedure Act allows for a telegraphic or similarly written or printed communication from a magistrate or peace officer stating that a warrant has been issued.
Click to expand...

chiskop said:
Havoc, let go of your conflicting traffic markings.
Click to expand...
God save the dude that arrests me for running over one of those dodgy stop signs. But yes, I should let it go. :)

All of the previous rubbish I said aside, do I get arrested immediately for running a stop sign or do I get a fine & time to pay?
 
NoADSLyet said:
First you have to start with crime and get the real criminals caught but again there in NO BONUSES and REVENUE in that! Fsucking imbeciles these cops and anyone supporting their cause!
Click to expand...

You start with everything...especially the small stuff. Laws are laws. Check out how this worked in NY under Julianni (sic?)
 
GougedEye said:
Section 38 of the Criminal Procedure Act lists 4 ways in which the police may secure the attendance of an accused at court for trial. There is no rule which requires them to use a milder form (Tsose v Minister of Justice). It has been recognised that where other methods exist, it may be more desirable (but not required) to use them (S v More).They may however, not arrest someone as a punishment (MacDonald v Khumalo).

So the answer is that they can arrest you for breaking the law provided that it is order to secure your attendance at trial.

Lawyerish enough for you?
Click to expand...

But this is not what they were doing.
 
McSack said:
You start with everything...especially the small stuff. Laws are laws. Check out how this worked in NY under Julianni (sic?)
Click to expand...

That old chestnut. I suggest you do some further reading on that specific case.

BTW its giuliani
 
McSack said:
One only has to take note of how speed traps are set up. You have an orifice hiding in the bushes / behind a wall who takes your picture as you speed past. A month later (OK maybe months, depending on the mood of the post office) your fine arrives in the post.
How did the taking of your picture stop you from continuing down the freeway at 100-and-plenty?
Add to this the fact that traffic fines are a line item on the Income-Expendure sheets of municipalities and traffic fines become a means of generating income rather than a way of enforcing traffic laws
Click to expand...

Excuse me, but flying down the highway at 100-and plenty is illegal because it is dangerous. Camera's are the most efficient method of policing this and are used world wide for this purpose. If the Camera / Officer was not hidden in some way then people would simply slow down briefly as they passed the bright orange camera and then speed up again. Fines are used, because it's more desirable than simply giving jail sentances for every traffic offence and provides a way to lighten the burdern on the courts by providing a way for admission of guilt. Fines have the added bonus of generating revenue to pay for the enforcement of these same laws. And hey, if there is money left over afterwards for other things, good luck to them.

If you don't like the idea of giving the authorities this money, I have a novel suggestion for you. Don't break the traffic laws. I know that this is a completely radical and outlandish concept thats difficult for you to grasp, but think about it for a bit. It's entirely in your own hands wether they generate any revenue off of you.

Calling police scum because they fine you for breaking the law doesn't reflect particularly well on your morals or maturity. I guess rapist also call the police scum because they arrest them.
 
Last edited:
icyrus said:
That old chestnut. I suggest you do some further reading on that specific case.
Click to expand...

don't need to...

I spent a year in NY during the "bad old days". Then went back on a 6 month contract towards the end of Gulianni's (still sic?) tenure.
Different place... no old chestnut I can promise you.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top
Sign up to the MyBroadband newsletter
X