Emigration....... Are people serious

Pavan said:
Yeah I also prefer working with ratio's to determine what's comparatively expensive and cheap. A good example of this would be a Nando's quarter chicken. Let's use the example of an SA salary of R30k net. A Nando's quarter chicken in SA is R32.50. That's 0.11% of net SA salary. In London, a Nando's quarter chicken is GBP 4.35. That means, for the ratio to hold true (so that a quarter chicken in London = 0.11% of your net salary), you would need to earn GBP 3955 per month.
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See that makes a lot more sense to me when working it in reverse like that and saying what you should be earning to have the same cost.

Doing it with a figure in hand and then saying it's cheaper or more expensive doesn't really help when the salaries and lifestyles are so different.

Although when it comes to property/rent it's a whole different story where it doesn't work out.
 
Pavan said:
@loc - I managed to open a natwest offshore bank account before moving over to London, with the help of the company I work for. I do agree with your though, from a retail banking perspective, SA is miles ahead! I lol @ these card readers we have to use (similar to digitags) to make payments to new recipients - they haven't reached the OTP security milestone yet :)
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How do interest rates compare?

biometrics said:
On the plus side, the more skilled people leave the more we can charge in SA. I wouldn't take a job for less than R70-R80k in SA.
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Now you are on the flipside again living outside the reality of most South Africans and if you are earning that in SA then chances are the opportunity isn't that amazing outside of it.

I think the big opportunity is for the guys like loc that can make mure more in Junior to Mid-level positions in the 15-30k (ZAR) bracket and get much more over there for the same work experience.

You also can't assume someone was being ripped off at 15k level. Chances are he is a young guy with a smaller skillset still and hasn't hit that threshold where the ball starts rolling. But like I said in the UK he can get much more for the same work experience/skill.
 
biometrics said:
Sounds like you were ripped off by your employers in SA.
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For a 25 year old in Durban it's actually a decent salary. Many of my friends earn less

SauRoNZA said:
Okay so you were using the ZAR/ZAR pricing against the GBP/GBP pricing which is really just what I wanted to be sure of.

I think (depending on model I guess) that your Nespresso price in SA is way off though. They are not R6000 in general, but maybe we should get model specific to be absolutely sure.

But if I was in your position earning R15k and therefore presumably quite young still I would be more keen to see the world.

Actually let me rephrase, I'm not at all against seeing the world as a motivation. My problem is with "escaping" from problems.

If an opportunity presents itself to me I would seriously consider it, but having a family and a pretty solid position locally I'm not about to go looking for it if that makes sense.

I have spent a bit of time in the Netherlands, UK and also Kenya for some perspective as well, so it's not like I am clueless either.
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Ya, as I mentioned I'm mid twenties, so travelling was a big appeal to me. If you are interested the machine is a Delonghi EN660. That particular one seems to be discontinued and similar ones seem anything from R4000-R6000 so I may have overestimated
 
loc said:
That particular one seems to be discontinued and similar ones seem anything from R4000-R6000 so I may have overestimated
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If you want to compare getting your figures right is rather important.
 
SauRoNZA said:
Now you are on the flipside again living outside the reality of most South Africans and if you are earning that in SA then chances are the opportunity isn't that amazing outside of it.

I think the big opportunity is for the guys like loc that can make mure more in Junior to Mid-level positions in the 15-30k (ZAR) bracket and get much more over there for the same work experience.
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I disagree, it really depends on the demand for the particular skill set from one country to another, and seniors are generally better positioned. It is quite possible to earn much much more (far more than the typical junior/mid-SA to junior/mid-UK ratio) as a senior dev due to having specialist skills and experience.
 
cguy said:
I disagree, it really depends on the demand for the particular skill set from one country to another, and seniors are generally better positioned. It is quite possible to earn much much more (far more than the typical junior/mid-SA to junior/mid-UK ratio) as a senior dev due to having specialist skills and experience.
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Yeah I guess if we go looking purely at IT or more specifically development work.

But I'm not so sure the same can be said for all other industries.

And particular skillset are particular by their very nature, so hardly fall in the scope of the general emigrating public.
 
Another thing people need to remember is that UK =/= London. There are hundreds of towns all over the place that are much cheaper. Yes, living in London can be very expensive. But even that's relative to which part of the city you live in, work and shop at. You could save a ton on rent by living in Brixton, but blow it all by shopping in Oxford Street. I've lived in London and it was great, but it's a tourist hot spot, and I reckon there are more foreigners than locals in a lot of the areas. So when I go back in a couple of months it'll just be for a short while before moving out of the city and settling in one of the counties.
 
SauRoNZA said:
Actually let me rephrase, I'm not at all against seeing the world as a motivation. My problem is with "escaping" from problems.
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What's wrong with escaping from problems, if problems are real and causing you to suffer? People just want to offer the best life that they can for themselves and their families. My brother in law just found out that his farm near Brackenfell is going to be seized by the government on a very flimsy pretext. That's a real problem for him.
 
Lets face it, everything revolves around rent in the UK, everything else is pretty cheap in relation to your salary.
 
cerebus said:
My brother in law just found out that his farm near Brackenfell is going to be seized by the government on a very flimsy pretext.
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You'll need to post more info than that to be taken seriously.
 
Yeah rent is about 35% of my net salary. In JHB, for a cluster in Bryanston, my bond repayment was around 38% of my net salary. However, you cannot compare my London apartment to my Bryanston cluster. In Bryanston I could probably get my London size apartment for around 20-25% of my (then) JHB net salary.

Oh, there's also council tax here. Not that far off from the rates I paid in Bryanston IIRC.
 
biometrics said:
You'll need to post more info than that to be taken seriously.
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Why? It's a true statement, I don't know a whole ton more detail, and I certainly don't feel obligated to share it publicly. Take it how you want but I'm not one to make up stories.
 
cerebus said:
Why? It's a true statement, I don't know a whole ton more detail, and I certainly don't feel obligated to share it publicly. Take it how you want but I'm not one to make up stories.
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Great. No info. We'll take your word for it then. Government seizing land on flimsy pretext in the Western Cape.

So is that National, Provincial or Local government? Can you tell us that?
 
OrbitalDawn said:
One thing I'm wondering about is how to go about savings/investments/retirement planning abroad. Locally I'm pretty much sorted, but not quite sure what to do in other markets.
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It depends. The rand is depreciating against international currencies at a worrying rate. However, the yield on your investments locally could far outperform the currency depreciation. However, for more secure low-risk investments, rather move these funds across while they're still worth something. Keep high-risk high-return investments in SA, at your own peril of course :D
 
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