Emigration....... Are people serious

SauRoNZA said:
Actually I'm not making any decision. Think about it.

Africans are the happiest most easy to please people I've found amongst all the other nations I've dealt with.

I might retire somewhere like Thailand though.
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I prefer to deal with people that have higher standards and expectations of myself and their fellow man.
 
SoulTax said:
I prefer to deal with people that have higher standards and expectations of myself and their fellow man.
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It's a fair point and I agree somewhat.

But at what point is the humanity lost because the most important thing is chasing our fortunes?

When does personal happiness stop being all about money and good fortune and instead being about the simple things in life?

I've met Africans with nothing that are happier than people who own Porsche 918's.

It's a fine balance and at this point I'm still quite happy with mine.
 
I am taking a new job in a Gulf State where I will be earing the 4x the SA salary. This salary I will only earn in SA may be 20years later. The main reason to look beyond the borders is the economic instability & insecurity. We are living in very tough times. One must look beyond the borders to address this issue. Mind you it took me almost a year to get something which made me to move.
 
SauRoNZA said:
being about the simple things in life?
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Those you should enjoy regardless of where you are. :)

biometrics said:
How much you are worth makes all the difference.
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Does it? You need crazy levels of wealth to insulate yourself from some of the less desirable aspects of SA - way more than most could hope to accumulate in a lifetime imo.
 
SauRoNZA said:
It could also never happen.

The rand could recover, power problems could be resolved in a year or three etc.

We just don't know either way which is the right and which is the wrong.

Those who stay could find themselves with their arses in the butter if things take an uptrend, while those who go could struggle to "make" it.

Had a friend try Australia for almost two years and came back recently believe it or not, because the racism was so rampant there that when he got a new option back on this side he packed all his stuff up again to come back to SA.

You also never answered my question earlier. Are you from Jo'burg? Because it's a very different place.
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Terrible reasoning, as cguy pointed out. These things aren't flip-a-coin probabilities.

Naturally you're quite right on the 2nd point, there's no guarantee that the grass will be greener, but there are objective ways of approaching these issues.

And I did answer your question - go look. I said I'm not in JHB. I'm in PTA.

Have spent boatloads of time in the WC over the last 20+ years, though. I do like it more than Gauteng.

SauRoNZA said:
It's a fair point and I agree somewhat.

But at what point is the humanity lost because the most important thing is chasing our fortunes?

When does personal happiness stop being all about money and good fortune and instead being about the simple things in life?

I've met Africans with nothing that are happier than people who own Porsche 918's.

It's a fine balance and at this point I'm still quite happy with mine.
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You'll need to be more specific - you seem to think the whole first world is like London or New York, for some reason.

Do you think this is nonsense?

These Are the Happiest Countries in the World

-1x-1.jpg
 
Those who stay could find themselves with their arses in the butter if things take an uptrend, while those who go could struggle to "make" it.
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Been hearing this since high school mate... Unfortunately the moment you get successful at business other problems creep in such as levies, and having to deal with BEE.

I have also hit a ceiling with what I can earn in SA.. in my line of work. And the prices of stuff keep increasing and the salary doesn't... So what choice do I have?
 
Is the fact that your sons aged 19 and 17 are unlikely to get employment considered a "potential" problem?
 
Im in the boat. Still young (21) but my goal is get out of here by the time Im 25 or so . In the IT industry have quite a few Internationally recognised certificates in the field that Im working in (Juniper , Cisco ) etc


Im not sure how Im going to go about getting out though.
 
Oh well, company overseas is pretty serious, guess I better make a decision soon and get packing..
 
Compton_effect said:
I just spoke to a Emigration Consultant for Canada. Baby steps - this is not going to be a easy descision to make.
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Took my wife and I 2 years to prepare and get into a position where we could leave.

One thing I'd recommend though, is to go get your home affairs documents in order. Get unabridged everything, birth, marriage etc. Do it early so thats not even an issue when you're applying.
 
OrbitalDawn said:
And I did answer your question - go look. I said I'm not in JHB. I'm in PTA.

Have spent boatloads of time in the WC over the last 20+ years, though. I do like it more than Gauteng.
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My apologies, I missed that.

You'll need to be more specific - you seem to think the whole first world is like London or New York, for some reason.

Do you think this is nonsense?

These Are the Happiest Countries in the World

View attachment 242282
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I don't think it's nonsense, but this late in the game it's not possible for most of us, from an adaptability mindset perspective.

Reason being that somewhere like Denmark for instance is nanny-stated to death and the people are almost assimilated to that mindset and therefore they are very happy with less. They are told how to live their lives and it's simple and therefore they are happy. Less is more and all that, the less they need to think about it the better.

However as someone who grew up in the free world I suspect I'll have a very hard time adapting to that...and contrary to what you might think many people in Denmark are struggling as well.

It's funny really because whoever said earlier that they would rather live somewhere that expects a higher quality of them and people themselves, because Denmark has this mindset/doctrine which I now sadly can't remember the word for which basically says DON'T BE EXCEPTIONAL and if you try to do anything out of the norm you get ridiculed and shut down.

****

I remembered now it's called Jante.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_Jante

The ten rules state:

You're not to think you are anything special.
You're not to think you are as good as we are.
You're not to think you are smarter than we are.
You're not to convince yourself that you are better than we are.
You're not to think you know more than we do.
You're not to think you are more important than we are.
You're not to think you are good at anything.
You're not to laugh at us.
You're not to think anyone cares about you.
You're not to think you can teach us anything.

I WILL NOT be able to live with a populous that has that mindset.

*****

There are other great reasons to live in some of those countries though, such as the 2 years of maternity/paternity leave that you get to share when having a baby and is fully paid for.


Interesting to note countries like Mexico and Brazil on that list which are very similar to our own and very third world...yet happy. Bringing me back to the point that 1st World doesn't automatically conclude happiness.


The Netherlands are also high on that list. I've been there and although it's okay for a holiday I wouldn't want to live in a country that is completely unnatural and fabricated. Also the people really aren't very friendly at all to outsiders.

I've worked with people from pretty much every one of those countries except Iceland, Belguim and Luxembourg and it again bring me back to the feeling that Africans (and other third world countries) are nicer, happier people to deal with and preferably live with.


As an African I think I would have a very very hard time adapting to Scandinavian countries for both the doctrine, language and cold.

On the list of happiest places I would be interested in most New Zealand, Costa Rica, Mexico, Brazil and possibly maybe Australia.
 
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Sonic2k said:
Been hearing this since high school mate... Unfortunately the moment you get successful at business other problems creep in such as levies, and having to deal with BEE.

I have also hit a ceiling with what I can earn in SA.. in my line of work. And the prices of stuff keep increasing and the salary doesn't... So what choice do I have?
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I've also heard since High school how the country is going to hell and all the whites will be murdered.

Yet year after year my life in SA has been better and more fortunate than the previous one.

*****

Note that I'm not saying I'll never leave and rather die here than go. But at this point in time I've never felt the "push" and it's never seemed more lucrative for me personally.

Like I said previously if someone were to come after me and offer me a package deal or I got an internal company transfer with all expenses paid it would be a very different story.

But I'm not escaping from anything...because I don't have anything to escape from.
 
SauRoNZA said:
The Netherlands are also high on that list. I've been there and although it's okay for a holiday I wouldn't want to live in a country that is completely unnatural and fabricated. Also the people really aren't very friendly at all to outsiders.
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That is simply your perception. The people of a specific country aren't all the same. We have friendly and unfriendly people in South Africa, as in every other country in the world. I interact with people from France, UK, Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark, Sweden and USA on an almost weekly basis. From my perspective (and it's nothing more than perception based on a few people who I work with), the Dutch are the friendliest people I have ever met.
 
Just a question:
How many of you who have left or considered leaving are non-white?
 
SauRoNZA said:
Reason being that somewhere like Denmark for instance is nanny-stated to death and the people are almost assimilated to that mindset and therefore they are very happy with less. They are told how to live their lives and it's simple and therefore they are happy. Less is more and all that, the less they need to think about it the better.
Click to expand...

SauRoNZA said:
But at what point is the humanity lost because the most important thing is chasing our fortunes?

When does personal happiness stop being all about money and good fortune and instead being about the simple things in life?
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Crazy idea...

SauRoNZA said:
Interesting to note countries like Mexico and Brazil on that list which are very similar to our own and very third world...yet happy. Bringing me back to the point that 1st World doesn't automatically conclude happiness.
Australia.
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BTW, SA is 113th, just after Iraq. At least it's 2 ahead of Zimbabwe though!
 
Okay... So I'm a little late to the party but I'll emigrate in a heartbeat.

I'm currently looking into a position at one of the Big 4 in Rotterdam. I was not offered this position but was informed of it by a friend. I am a qualified CA but even then I am finding it difficult to find work. I have completed my articles some time ago but not at the Big 4. If I went to the Big 4 it would've been a complete cakewalk to get a position at any branch.

If I get the position I will be taking a huge step back in terms of job position title, yet I'll be earning approximately 20% more.

I'm not leaving because of load shedding. I'm leaving because this country has only gotten worse in the last ten years, and I would rather make the move now where I can easily adapt (I'm a 30 year old single male), than in ten years time when I have to take a whole family over, or just be "set in my ways".

I'll be selling everything I own and cashing out all my investments. I do not however, own any property for the very specific reason that I was looking to emigrate. Thankfully the firm will pay all my visa costs but I will need a fair sum to get myself on track.

Yes I will be leaving my friends and my family behind, but to make an omelette, you have to break some eggs.
 
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