Feeling a bit duped

[AstroTurf]

As it should be. These low dose formulations are typically available fairly readily, but we should be making higher dosages more easily obtainable. Tough luck for people who can't control themselves.


If it's S3 or lower they don't have to ask for a prescription. For S3 they can, but it is up to their discretion. Furthermore people should stop whining about doctors and pharmacists, since they're not the ones who fail to read medication inserts or ask questions or keep escalating the dose. Look at what is in your medication and if you don't know what it is then ask.

Years ago one of my chemist cocktail suppliers was a Chemist,I could get any drug on the market from him. He was addicted to welcanol.
It was cheaper and easier than going to a local Nigerian and of course if you buy it in a shop as opposed to on a street corner you can justify your addiction as socially acceptable.

I know how the whole S3 etc thing works.
I can still quite easily go to my current chemist and easily purchase just about anything up to schedule 5 pretty much over the counter but I don't (except in case of emergency) because a dealer is a dealer is a dealer and I do not like supporting the hypocrisy.

As an ex addict I am fully aware of the danger and always read the pamphlet (usually with google by my side in case I do not understand something).

Most housewives/adults do not do this as the doctor gave it to them and therefore it must be safe.


Personally I think there should be no illegal drugs, simply because the only difference I see is that certain dealers are certified to sell while others are not. Also because banning something removes all quality control and in effect makes it more dangerous.

 

[Hosehead]

Wellconal, well, well, well, what a dinosaur, I haven't heard that name in dogs years.
It's Phenadoxone which is one of the many synthetic opiates that came out of the US and Germany immediately following world War 2 (Most of the good stuff was invented in the 40's and early 50's) and there wasn't really a use for it although it was a potent painkiller along the lines of morphine and I believe most abused hard core drug in the 1980's and early 1990's during the embargo on South Africa. It's as dead as the dodo in this country now since theres a smorgsmaboard of decent pharmaceuticals for heavy duty pain. What is interesting is that Phenadoxone, according to WIKI is used in Denmark and Eastern Europe and experiencing a resurgence of sorts as the main opiate in the famous
Brompton Cocktail. Happy Hour Bring it on :wtf:

 

[RiaX]

Yep, no way you should be held responsible for your part in getting people addicted to opiates

nope im not. I dont decide what medication they need to use and if you know how people are its futile to tell them its bad because if you dont issue it then they just go to someone who will even after you warn them. Besides Im not a retail pharmacist I dont get paid per script or sale so ... your logic is flawed in real world terms.

It's like telling a heroine addict to shoot up once a day. Better still, stop doing drugs.
Addicts don't care what the pharmacist says or what's on the box.

Well for heroin yes you are right. Codeine not so much, you really have to take ALOT to get a response out of codeine. Its almost impossible to get addicted to OTC levels of codeine over the counter when used correctly. The problem is people take them everyday or they think "oh if 2 tablets did this 4 will work way better" and then they trap themselves and its their own fault.

Ive taken 60mg pure codeine phosphate 4 times a day for 7 days straight and I had no dependency what so ever, didnt even get goofed lol (anecdotal i know). Now if you take the OTC they have 10mg codeine and you take 2 tabs 4 times a day (generally) so thats 80mg in a day and you not suppose to use these drugs religiously but rather when necessary so when used correctly there should be no problem also you not supposed to use them for 10 successive days.

Codeine IMO is useless when you buy it OTC and if you going to use an opioid at high dose you rather use a lower dose morphine its safer and has better activity. Of course codeine is dangerous when abused but you need to ask yourself whose fault is that ?

Just because its an opiate that does not mean it deserves to be considered equal. A kitten is not a lion even though both are cats

they waste 5 minutes or more depending on the level of literacy data capturing when if it's the law, why the remaining 99.9% of pharmacies don't bother.

No it is law, clicks are just retarded on how they work. No one really follows the details or checks up on it but because they a franchise their legalities have to be in order.

 

[RiaX]

the main opiate in the famous
Brompton Cocktail. Happy Hour Bring it on :wtf:

Brompton cocktail lol I saw a formulation sheet from a long time ago they used morphine and cocaine as the main ingredients

 

[Hosehead]

Brompton cocktail lol I saw a formulation sheet from a long time ago they used morphine and cocaine as the main ingredients

Yep, coke stays but Morphine might go now for some reason now wiki says

Like its drug subcategory prototype methadone, phenadoxone can be used as the opioid analgesic in Brompton Mixture, aka Brompton cocktail.

so I guess there's still life for them old wellconals yet lol

 

[F4bio]

Pls stop comparing codeine to herion. It is really a walk in the park to come off even the pure 30 mg tabs and from what i've read herion withdrawal is not. Pls look at what I said earlier in the post pls pls!

 

[F4bio]

I avoid clicks when I can possibly help it because while they don't ask for a prescription for schedule 2 they make a bloody nuisance of themselves and harp on about how its the law that they must have your name and address when all you require is a box of headache/tootache/period/backache/ painkillers and without exception they waste 5 minutes or more depending on the level of literacy data capturing when if it's the law, why the remaining 99.9% of pharmacies don't bother. I suspect the marketing of clicks club cards has more to do with this capturing of information.




Absolutely spot on there. I mentioned in an earlier thread now buried that the level of effective pain control training the doctors get in this country is pretty appalling, but not nearly as bad as the US and the UK where the GP is more worried about losing his license for overprescription than pallative care. Some pharmacists are pretty knowledgable though, but they are few and far between. Most do what a cheap chinese robotic arm could do at a quarter the price.

+1 on Dr's being way behind on pain control. I have a family member that's now being hassled and has stigma attached to taking high dose OxyContin whilst having aggressive cancer just cos it's calmed down a tad. it pisses me off. let people take what works!

 

[Jhbgirl]

Does one's level of depence matters how long you've been taking adcodols and things? I've used 2 or 4 a day for years but only escalated to the high usage in the last month.

 

[AstroTurf]

Wellconal, well, well, well, what a dinosaur, I haven't heard that name in dogs years.
It's Phenadoxone which is one of the many synthetic opiates that came out of the US and Germany immediately following world War 2 (Most of the good stuff was invented in the 40's and early 50's) and there wasn't really a use for it although it was a potent painkiller along the lines of morphine and I believe most abused hard core drug in the 1980's and early 1990's during the embargo on South Africa. It's as dead as the dodo in this country now since theres a smorgsmaboard of decent pharmaceuticals for heavy duty pain. What is interesting is that Phenadoxone, according to WIKI is used in Denmark and Eastern Europe and experiencing a resurgence of sorts as the main opiate in the famous
Brompton Cocktail. Happy Hour Bring it on :wtf:

Was years ago.

He spiked it. Overdose a few months after his wife.

 

[AstroTurf]

nope im not. I dont decide what medication they need to use and if you know how people are its futile to tell them its bad because if you dont issue it then they just go to someone who will even after you warn them. Besides Im not a retail pharmacist I dont get paid per script or sale so ... your logic is flawed in real world terms.



Well for heroin yes you are right. Codeine not so much, you really have to take ALOT to get a response out of codeine. Its almost impossible to get addicted to OTC levels of codeine over the counter when used correctly. The problem is people take them everyday or they think "oh if 2 tablets did this 4 will work way better" and then they trap themselves and its their own fault.

Ive taken 60mg pure codeine phosphate 4 times a day for 7 days straight and I had no dependency what so ever, didnt even get goofed lol (anecdotal i know). Now if you take the OTC they have 10mg codeine and you take 2 tabs 4 times a day (generally) so thats 80mg in a day and you not suppose to use these drugs religiously but rather when necessary so when used correctly there should be no problem also you not supposed to use them for 10 successive days.

Codeine IMO is useless when you buy it OTC and if you going to use an opioid at high dose you rather use a lower dose morphine its safer and has better activity. Of course codeine is dangerous when abused but you need to ask yourself whose fault is that ?

Just because its an opiate that does not mean it deserves to be considered equal. A kitten is not a lion even though both are cats



No it is law, clicks are just retarded on how they work. No one really follows the details or checks up on it but because they a franchise their legalities have to be in order.

Please do me a favour, go to elim clinic and speak with some of the matrons about codeine.
Check out drugs inc codeine episode.
Do something that does not simply involve reading books and pamphlets created by suppliers.

You have obviously only been fed nonsense by an institution that is pretty much making drugs that get people addicted then profit off the addiction.

Yet again, the most abused chemist drug on the planet.
Let me repeat that.
most abused chemist drug on the planet.

Go do some research into the matter.
Even if it only makes you think twice next time you hand the stuff out.


Something Elim will tell you from their years of fixing the people that get ruined by this stuff you sell is that it is more addictive than heroin and that the withdrawals are worse and more dangerous than heroin withdrawal.
They even get the same amount and sometimes more Methdone than the heroin addicts.

re the kitten is not a lion statement.
A snoutie is not a king cobra but both will kill you (even though they are both snakes).

 

[AstroTurf]

Does one's level of depence matters how long you've been taking adcodols and things? I've used 2 or 4 a day for years but only escalated to the high usage in the last month.

Your level of resistance to the drug will increase and you will take more to get the same level of comfort.

 

[Hosehead]

Your level of resistance to the drug will increase and you will take more to get the same level of comfort.

You mean your level of tolerence to the drug increases thus...
Quite.

 

[Hosehead]

+1 on Dr's being way behind on pain control. I have a family member that's now being hassled and has stigma attached to taking high dose OxyContin whilst having aggressive cancer just cos it's calmed down a tad. it pisses me off. let people take what works!

I hope that family member ditches that ignorant dick of Dr and gets the appropriate pallative care including allowances for Breakthrough pain. Nobody should have to suffer in this day and age.

 

[killadoob]

I see pink sinutabs have been pulled from the market, people abusing them and it was easy to get the codeine out. Awesome tablets for sinus and headaches. The purple one is also decent no codeine though.

 

[RiaX]

Does one's level of depence matters how long you've been taking adcodols and things? I've used 2 or 4 a day for years but only escalated to the high usage in the last month.

depends what you refering to. Dependence and addiction are two different things and define what high usage is

Please do me a favour, go to elim clinic and speak with some of the matrons about codeine.
Check out drugs inc codeine episode.
Do something that does not simply involve reading books and pamphlets created by suppliers

LOL. Yes I totally havent seen addicts in my psych ward rounds nor have I never been called out to the hospital to supply opioid antidotes and the rehab clinics under my wing havent never had their doctors consult me .... btw im being sarcastic. Im not a clicks jockey lol

Yet again, the most abused chemist drug on the planet.
Let me repeat that.
most abused chemist drug on the planet.

because its easily available at pharmaceutical quality ? imagine if you could get pharmaceutical grade heroin OTC? there was a point in time that was happening morphine and heroin were available to purchase freely .... it crippled an entire country hence it was banned.

Something Elim will tell you from their years of fixing the people that get ruined by this stuff you sell is that it is more addictive than heroin and that the withdrawals are worse and more dangerous than heroin withdrawal.
They even get the same amount and sometimes more Methdone than the heroin addicts.

Nope. Codeine is no where near the addictive potential of heroin. Firstly you need to understand what is happening when a person becomes addicted/tolerant/dependent on a drug. They 'hijack' pleasure reward centers in the brain and they stay bound to their receptors longer. You do know there is no difference between heroin and morphine in potency right ? the reason heroin is sad to be "2x to 4x more potent" than morphine is a dumbed down version so people can understand. Heroin is diacetylmorphine its actually inactive like that it undergoes a chemical reaction realeasing its active form which is plain old morphine (when you take morphine only 15% of that dose reaches the brain heroin provides a mean to boost that). The reasons are complex but its got to do with the blood-brain-barrier and drug delivery. Heroin can catch you with a single dose codeine cannot and that little science explaination will tell you why. You be surprised how this knowledge conforms to the actual field work

and those people you are telling me to talk to used to talk to me first so yeah I have the necessary field experience lol.

BTW whats a snoutie ?

EDIT:

you cant run the addiction story in reverse. If you get a full blown addiction from codeine you in trouble yes but you must understand that does not equate codeine to heroin. The amount of codeine you would have to use would be A LOT and for a period of time. If you read my earlier post if I took heroin for 7 days I would've been caught in addiction at maximum doses but with codeine nothing happened

 

[Swa]

Jhbgirl, don't just accept a label of addict. Few people that have tried even hardcore drugs actually get addicted. Addiction and dependence are also two different things. These substances cause changes so there's going to be an effect when going off them but it's not in itself an addiction.

Also this attitude of the health care industry can do no wrong must stop. People do make their own decisions but pharmaceuticals fail them and there's not an acknowledgement of this. Then the blame falls on the patient. Comparing it to cigarettes is just crazy. Pharmaceutical companies actually make claims of what their products are for and try to get them listed for the widest range of conditions possible. If cigarette companies acted in a similar matter they would be held accountable.

I see pink sinutabs have been pulled from the market, people abusing them and it was easy to get the codeine out. Awesome tablets for sinus and headaches. The purple one is also decent no codeine though.

J&J issued a statement that they discontinued it to bring their range in line with the international one. What's perplexing is that Adco-Sinal is also unavailable at most pharmacies. Just because you're making a generic it doesn't mean you should stop your product when the original is no longer available. Where to now? The other Sinutabs are more than twice the price.

 

[killadoob]

No it was the codeine content. Codeine is being scheduled i think. Those pink sinutabs it was easy to separate the codeine. At least that is what i think. Could be wrong.

 

[RiaX]

No it was the codeine content. Codeine is being scheduled i think. Those pink sinutabs it was easy to separate the codeine. At least that is what i think. Could be wrong.

thats pseudoephedrine that they were using to make methamphetamines, most of those combo preps have fallen away. Bloody druggies now I cant get coldclear >.<

People do make their own decisions but pharmaceuticals fail them and there's not an acknowledgement of this. Then the blame falls on the patient

err the patient is to blame ? she been using it on her own accord for years how is this the companies fault ? it says on the box do not use for more than 10 consecutive days. You sir are a moron

Comparing it to cigarettes is just crazy. Pharmaceutical companies actually make claims of what their products are for and try to get them listed for the widest range of conditions possible. If cigarette companies acted in a similar matter they would be held accountable.

Yes they also say its addictive in BOLD PRINT so what exactly are they suppose to be accountable for ? your inability to read and follow instructions isnt their problem. The same reason that my box of cigarettes says "Smoking will kill you" but I dont care lol

 

[Jhbgirl]

Just an update
I have been feeling like I've been hit by a truck, sore muscles, runny nose, feeling like I have flu with a headache that comes and goes of varying intensity and sore neck but I haven't touched a codeine tablet since Sun. I had 2 panados on tues, 2 anadins yesterday and 2 this morning. Hopefully I feel somewhat better soon.

 

[AstroTurf]

depends what you refering to. Dependence and addiction are two different things and define what high usage is



LOL. Yes I totally havent seen addicts in my psych ward rounds nor have I never been called out to the hospital to supply opioid antidotes and the rehab clinics under my wing havent never had their doctors consult me .... btw im being sarcastic. Im not a clicks jockey lol



because its easily available at pharmaceutical quality ? imagine if you could get pharmaceutical grade heroin OTC? there was a point in time that was happening morphine and heroin were available to purchase freely .... it crippled an entire country hence it was banned.



Nope. Codeine is no where near the addictive potential of heroin. Firstly you need to understand what is happening when a person becomes addicted/tolerant/dependent on a drug. They 'hijack' pleasure reward centers in the brain and they stay bound to their receptors longer. You do know there is no difference between heroin and morphine in potency right ? the reason heroin is sad to be "2x to 4x more potent" than morphine is a dumbed down version so people can understand. Heroin is diacetylmorphine its actually inactive like that it undergoes a chemical reaction realeasing its active form which is plain old morphine (when you take morphine only 15% of that dose reaches the brain heroin provides a mean to boost that). The reasons are complex but its got to do with the blood-brain-barrier and drug delivery. Heroin can catch you with a single dose codeine cannot and that little science explaination will tell you why. You be surprised how this knowledge conforms to the actual field work

and those people you are telling me to talk to used to talk to me first so yeah I have the necessary field experience lol.

BTW whats a snoutie ?

EDIT:

you cant run the addiction story in reverse. If you get a full blown addiction from codeine you in trouble yes but you must understand that does not equate codeine to heroin. The amount of codeine you would have to use would be A LOT and for a period of time. If you read my earlier post if I took heroin for 7 days I would've been caught in addiction at maximum doses but with codeine nothing happened

The evidence is in your face and at your fingertips, Not my problem, drug dealers always have excuses.

A snoutie is a snouted cobra.
I would have said Mfezi but thought snoutie would be easier for you to understand...