George Floyd death

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Emjay said:
Is that really your takeaway from that image? This is not just about George Floyd anymore. Keep up.
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What’s the relevance? Is it a contest to see who kills more or less? It’s just an odd thing to post.

Emjay gets killed by a shark. People start going on about how humans kill way more sharks every year than sharks kill people. Help me keep up?
 
Emjay said:
www.cbsnews.com

A white bar owner in Omaha shot and killed a black protester. He won't face charges.

In response to outrage on social media, the county attorney said there was no "racial tone" to conversations between the shooter and the victim.
www.cbsnews.com www.cbsnews.com
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www.kios.org

Old Market Shooter Evicted; Bars Will Not Reopen

The Omaha bar owner involved in a deadly shooting during protests is being evicted. The "Omaha World Herald" reports that the property owner of The Hive…
www.kios.org www.kios.org

Old Market Shooter Evicted; Bars Will Not Reopen
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The Omaha bar owner involved in a deadly shooting during protests is being evicted. The "Omaha World Herald" reports that the property owner of The Hive and The Gatsby in the Old Market says the businesses will not be allowed to reopen and bar owner Jacob Gardner has been evicted. Gardner shot and killed 22-year-old James Scurlock on Saturday near 12th and Harney Streets. The Douglas County Attorney's Office announced this week that Gardner will not be charged at this time, and the shooting was ruled to be in self-defense.
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Further reading stated that the building owner ruled that the lease was violated. I wonder what the terms were in this regard because the building owner was allegedly threatened by the community.
 
Vorastra said:
What was the negligence though? Failing to recognise that he was in distress even before being put on the floor?
It's just so grey. I want to put the policemen in jail for ignoring the signs of distress, but at the same time...the act of arresting triggered a weak heart which wouldn't have been an issue for a normal human being.

Can you want someone to go to jail but also not, at the same time?
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More than just neglect after reviewing the video again.

Floyd is supposedly drunk or high(they assume drunk. They push him into the police car on one side.
The the cop kneeling on his neck pull him out again on the other side for no apparent reason.
This was over the top heavy handedness.
Then he knees on the guy for 8 minutes just to proof he is the man or something? Pinning down a guy so drunk that he can hardly walk.
Then they fail to request medical assistance.

At first I thought it was murder.
Then I moved to Manslaughter after the autopsy came out.
But now I'm sure it's murder again.
 
konfab said:
At least it indicates that it is normal people buying guns. Not the Fudds and their 1911s.
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Nah I disagree. Glocks are decently popular enough to be bought by anyone looking for a first handgun. It's practically the opposite, they aren't being bought for sport at the moment.
 
rietrot said:
More than just neglect after reviewing the video again.

Floyd is supposedly drunk or high(they assume drunk. They push him into the police car on one side.
The the cop kneeling on his neck pull him out again on the other side for no apparent reason.
This was over the top heavy handedness.
Then he knees on the guy for 8 minutes just to proof he is the man or something? Pinning down a guy so drunk that he can hardly walk.
Then they fail to request medical assistance.
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Not to mention, the man says he can't breathe, then dies after a full grown man knelt on his neck for an insanely long amount of time. Somehow, for some people these two things are not related at all.

This is after the officers tell him to get into the car while the main f*cktard is still on his neck.
 
Vorastra said:
OK I get that, but we know the knee didn't actually do anything. At worst he should be fired for mishandling an arrest, right?

If we remove the knee from all this, as the autopsy has done. What did the policeman himself actually do wrong?

For sake of argument, as I'd like to know your response, he arrested this man properly.
This policeman does his job. Arrests a man who is a criminal and was perceived to be resisting, that man dies from a physical defect triggered by the act of being arrested which the policeman has to do. Is the policeman to blame? Is he really to blame for doing the thing he had to do?

This video shows everything leading up.
You can already see that Floyd is having his heart issues, when they remove him from his car, brought on by mental stress of possibly having to go to jail again. The issue is that, from a policeman's point of view this is just a man resisting attempts to get in the police car. Eventually they put him in the police car, and then is pulled out again by Chauvin. Why do 3 policemen get on him? Are they just doing it for fun? We're coming from the premise that they are just doing it to be toolbags and not to legitimately stop someone who they think is resisting putting him in the car. You could put this down to cops who are so jaded by "acting" and lying from arrests throughout their career, that they don't acknowledge the stress he shows early on as being real.
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Thanks for the video. These cops will get of scot-free. There is no murder there.

All of this outrage over this. What a sad state of affairs.
 
rietrot said:
More than just neglect after reviewing the video again.

Floyd is supposedly drunk or high(they assume drunk. They push him into the police car on one side.
The the cop kneeling on his neck pull him out again on the other side for no apparent reason.
This was over the top heavy handedness.
Then he knees on the guy for 8 minutes just to proof he is the man or something? Pinning down a guy so drunk that he can hardly walk.
Then they fail to request medical assistance.
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Negligence at most but murder?
 
Vrotappel said:
Negligence at most but murder?
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Definitely. Floyd is clearly drunk/high out of his mind. The police struggle to get him in the car and because of that the one macho man decides he is going to drag him out the other side again to teach him a lesson and basically purposely try and hurt him.
 
Randhir said:
Nah I disagree. Glocks are decently popular enough to be bought by anyone looking for a first handgun. It's practically the opposite, they aren't being bought for sport at the moment.
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Hence it is mostly normal people looking to defend themselves.

If there was a 1911 shortage, I would start getting worried.
 
Randhir said:
We have different definition of FUDDs, I think.

View attachment 852597
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Fudds are people who would buy a 1911 because they think .45 a more effective round than 9mm. Even when there is almost no difference in lethality.

Elmer Fudd was the arch nemesis of Bugs Bunny, the star of the now historic Looney Tunes series of cartoons. Fudd is a slow witted hunter who is often foiled by simple tricks. First appearing in 1937, he has now become the de facto term of derision for Baby Boomer hunters and marksmen, clinging to outdated technology. This term of derision is also a contentious slur in the Gun Control debate, where hunters who side with Gun Control advocates are viewed as soft brained pacifists, undercutting their own hobby through an alliance with big city activists.
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https://medium.com/the-sword-and-shield/the-1911-is-for-fudds-352e572a7fda
 
Vorastra said:
Of course it was ruled a homicide. It's the use of language. It wasn't a natural introduction of external mental stress. If a person walked into a room, and got surprised by people jumping from behind a cupboard, and then had a heart attack, that would be ruled a homicide...

A better example: If a policeman arrests you and you get worked up about it and then trigger your heart condition. That's a homicide and yet not the fault of the policeman though.


Yes, the line is literally saying that the act of arresting him, killed him. You know, the thing policemen have to do with a criminal. Those things added mental strain. The autopsy specifically clears up that the physical act of the knee on the neck did not contribute to his death physically.
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The act of arresting him with undue force is what killed him. After he literally told the guy on his neck that he can't breathe. You know, that very thing that keeps you alive? He told that cop that he can't do it, due to what the cop is doing to him, in the way that the cop is doing it to him.

While there were 3 other cops on him as well.
While he wasn't struggling.

This guy, right here:

Who is easily controlled by a single police officer. Yes, that guy needs 4 cops on him, with one on his neck:

He obviously would have overpowered them all if the one on his neck just shifted his weight a bit and moved his knee off his neck.

What would you say if an SA cop does that do your dad and he has a stroke? Or a heart attack? Would you take the stance?

Edit: One of the two autopsies cleared him. His death is still ruled a homocide.
It is pretty easy choke someone in a way that would not leave any physical damage.

"your" report
"cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint, and neck compression."
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Still sounds to me like if they handled it differently, that he would have lived.
 
Don't these police vehicles in the states all have internal cameras?
 
Barbarian Conan said:
The act of arresting him with undue force is what killed him. After he literally told the guy on his neck that he can't breathe. You know, that very thing that keeps you alive? He told that cop that he can't do it, due to what the cop is doing to him, in the way that the cop is doing it to him.
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So, I'm assuming the full autopsy with toxicology that came out last night just flew by you then, right?
The autopsy report showed that the knee did not contribute physically in any way to Floyd dying.

Continue to read the autopsy. It states those things as it added to his MENTAL state which got him worked up which triggered his heart condition. There's literally an entire section of the autopsy dedicated to explaining how the neck didn't contribute PHYSICALLY to his death.
 
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