George Floyd death

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Vorastra said:
So guys, why are we not talking about the autopsy report that shows the knee to the back of the neck caused no injuries to the strap muscles of the neck. Did not affect the throat/wind pipe. The brain showed no signs of hypoxia. It was concluded that there were no physical injuries that attributed to Floyd's death. Stress from the act of being arrested coupled with his heart condition as well as meth and fentanyl caused his death.

He believed he couldn't breathe because he was having a heart attack due to drugs and a weak heart.
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Still ruled as a homicide....

https://www.npr.org/2020/06/04/8692...eorge-floyd-had-positive-test-for-coronavirus

Floyd's death has been ruled a homicide.

The autopsy report concludes the cause of death was "cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint, and neck compression." That conclusion, death due to heart failure, differs from the one reached by an independent examiner hired by the Floyd family, which listed the cause of death as "asphyxiation from sustained pressure."
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STS said:
I mean the 3percenters recently lost a "member" who was shot by SWAT because they said he was reaching for his rifle(which he wasn't even allowed town due to a previous crime) and found a stash of guns in his house.

You think people like that, no matter how stupid and snot-nosed they are, owning a gun is safe?
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I'm all for removing guns from society. But in America they need it - might go to war with each other any second!
 
Cray said:
Still ruled as a homicide....

https://www.npr.org/2020/06/04/8692...eorge-floyd-had-positive-test-for-coronavirus
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Of course it was ruled a homicide. It's the use of language. It wasn't a natural introduction of external mental stress. If a person walked into a room, and got surprised by people jumping from behind a cupboard, and then had a heart attack, that would be ruled a homicide...

A better example: If a policeman arrests you and you get worked up about it and then trigger your heart condition. That's a homicide and yet not the fault of the policeman though.

cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint, and neck compression
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Yes, the line is literally saying that the act of arresting him, killed him. You know, the thing policemen have to do with a criminal. Those things added mental strain. The autopsy specifically clears up that the physical act of the knee on the neck did not contribute to his death physically.
 
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Vorastra said:
A better example: If a policeman arrests you and you get worked up about it and then trigger your heart condition. That's a homicide and yet not the fault of the policeman though.
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So what's your take...? The policeman in question did nothing wrong and should not be charged?
 
Cray said:
So what's your take...? The policeman in question did nothing wrong and should not be charged?
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Honestly? With this autopsy? No. It's an unfortunate accident. How can you arrest someone that indirectly caused someone else to die from their own physical defect?
Without this autopsy, and with the video we had? Yes, they should be.

Yes, the video looks bad with the knee, but with this autopsy, that knee did not contribute to his physical issue.

A policeman is meant to arrest someone. If they resist and then die from that stress, who can you blame...? No one really.
 
Chris_the_Brit said:
www.dailywire.com

LEGO Requests Affiliates Pull Marketing For Police, Fire Play Sets Following George Floyd’s Death, Report Says

Children’s toymaker LEGO has reportedly requested its affiliate retailers pull marketing for a number of playsets depicting law enforcement and emergency responders, as well as “crooks,” and even the White House, following the death of George Floyd at the hands of Minneapolis police and the...
www.dailywire.com www.dailywire.com

Stunning and brave from Lego, hey @ghoti .
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Strange that they include rescue services. Down with The White House.

LEGO_ProductRemovals.jpg


UPDATE: A SPOKESPERSON FOR THE LEGO GROUP RESPONDED TO OUR REQUEST FOR COMMENT WITH THE FOLLOWING STATEMENT:
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“We requested that our affiliate partners refrain from posting promotional LEGO content as part of our decision to respect #BlackOutTuesday and pause posting content on our social media channels in response to the tragic events in the US. We regret any misunderstanding and will ensure that we are clearer about our intentions in the future.”
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Not quite the same as stated in their request.
 
Vorastra said:
Honestly? With this autopsy? No. It's an unfortunate accident. How can you arrest someone that indirectly caused someone else to die from their own physical defect?
Without this autopsy, and with the video we had? Yes, they should be.

Yes, the video looks bad with the knee, but with this autopsy, that knee did not contribute to his physical issue.

A policeman is meant to arrest someone. If they resist and then die from that stress, who can you blame...? No one really.
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True to a point, problematic fact is he abused his authority and other I assume junior officers attempted to get him to remove his knee but he refused.... the dude is screwed and headed for accidental manslaughter probably.
 
rambo919 said:
True to a point, problematic fact is he abused his authority and other I assume junior officers attempted to get him to remove his knee but he refused.... the dude is screwed and headed for accidental manslaughter probably.
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OK I get that, but we know the knee didn't actually do anything. At worst he should be fired for mishandling an arrest, right?

If we remove the knee from all this, as the autopsy has done. What did the policeman himself actually do wrong?

For sake of argument, as I'd like to know your response, he arrested this man properly.
This policeman does his job. Arrests a man who is a criminal and was perceived to be resisting, that man dies from a physical defect triggered by the act of being arrested which the policeman has to do. Is the policeman to blame? Is he really to blame for doing the thing he had to do?

This video shows everything leading up.
You can already see that Floyd is having his heart issues, when they remove him from his car, brought on by mental stress of possibly having to go to jail again. The issue is that, from a policeman's point of view this is just a man resisting attempts to get in the police car. Eventually they put him in the police car, and then is pulled out again by Chauvin. Why do 3 policemen get on him? Are they just doing it for fun? We're coming from the premise that they are just doing it to be toolbags and not to legitimately stop someone who they think is resisting putting him in the car. You could put this down to cops who are so jaded by "acting" and lying from arrests throughout their career, that they don't acknowledge the stress he shows early on as being real.
 
konfab said:
The Amish are a fringe group in society, yet don't really cause anyone any problems. So being in a fringe group isn't necessarily a good reason to deny someone from owning a gun.

You would have a lot more success in simply requiring both practical and legal competence for ownership, as the most dangerous people with guns are usually the most incompetent with them. Requiring someone to be able to hit a target at a suitable range, clean the thing safely, and know when the legal system allows you to use a gun or not would seriously decrease the amount of gun deaths.

A large proportion of the problem in the US are boomers who don't understand basic gun safety.

You don't need to be clued up on guns to know that pointing a loaded firearm at your face is a bad idea.
https://twitter.com/x/status/1257727450429210625
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That video made me physically flinch in my chair. *insert cringe emoji here*
 
Vorastra said:
So guys, why are we not talking about the autopsy report that shows the knee to the back of the neck caused no injuries to the strap muscles of the neck. Did not affect the throat/wind pipe. The brain showed no signs of hypoxia. It was concluded that there were no physical injuries that attributed to Floyd's death. Stress from the act of being arrested coupled with his heart condition as well as meth and fentanyl caused his death.

He believed he couldn't breathe because he was having a heart attack due to drugs and a weak heart.
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Still negligent of the police.
 
rietrot said:
Still negligent of the police.
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What was the negligence though? Failing to recognise that he was in distress even before being put on the floor?
It's just so grey. I want to put the policemen in jail for ignoring the signs of distress, but at the same time...the act of arresting triggered a weak heart which wouldn't have been an issue for a normal human being.

Can you want someone to go to jail but also not, at the same time?
 
Vorastra said:
OK I get that, but we know the knee didn't actually do anything. At worst he should be fired for mishandling an arrest, right?

If we remove the knee from all this, as the autopsy has done. What did the policeman himself actually do wrong?

For sake of argument, as I'd like to know your response, he arrested this man properly.
This policeman does his job. Arrests a man who is a criminal and was perceived to be resisting, that man dies from a physical defect triggered by the act of being arrested which the policeman has to do. Is the policeman to blame? Is he really to blame for doing the thing he had to do?

This video shows everything leading up.
You can already see that Floyd is having his heart issues, when they remove him from his car, brought on by mental stress of possibly having to go to jail again. The issue is that, from a policeman's point of view this is just a man resisting attempts to get in the police car. Eventually they put him in the police car, and then is pulled out again by Chauvin. Why do 3 policemen get on him? Are they just doing it for fun? We're coming from the premise that they are just doing it to be toolbags and not to legitimately stop someone who they think is resisting putting him in the car. You could put this down to cops who are so jaded by "acting" and lying from arrests throughout their career, that they don't acknowledge the stress he shows early on as being real.
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What was he convicted of?
 
Vorastra said:
snip
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The sheer negligence of assuming nothing is wrong even though he is forcing someone into a restrained position and other officers are becoming alarmed is enough to get him sentenced unless he's lucky.

EDIT: the problem with that kind of authority is you cannot afford to go asleep at the wheel
 
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