Interdict brought by Dotco: Telkom sets the record straight

[Slip]

Its unbelievable, this makes me sick....do they think we are all stupid...bunch of monkeys

 

[snoopy_inc]

That makes no sense to me.

You mean to tell me that if DOTCO wins the court case telkom is going to reimburse the whole country!!
TELKOM is full of ****.

If Dotco wins the case im going to setup a court case myself to get my money back.
What the hell is wrong with them. cant they just accept the fact that they didnt have proof to contridict the case in the first place and opted for the extension to makeup some evidence.

They just piss me off.
My heresay is this: " Lets Treat Telkom how they treat us"

 

[dominic]

ayce - i would advise you to withhold any comment at this stage

you just never know who might be reading

 

[BobTheUglgBunny]

How much bandwidth do you use? Are you one of the people who uses below 3GB?

Even if you are, it doesn't matter how the 30GB was attained. Telkom let it happen.

Even if we disregard that Telkom let it slide, you should be pissed because you're paying more for your crappy 3GB HARD CAP on your 512k/1024k line than people in the UK are paying for their UNCAPPED 2MB lines!

You can't lay the blame at the feet of the ISPs. In this, nobody is to blame but Telkom. They post colossal profits and then moan about expenditure. They raise telecoms prices so that only the very, very few can afford even a basic land line. They publically compare themselves to internationaly companies and then say "agh we're not able to do it like they do".

/end rant.

Telkom didnt LET it happen...they introduced hard capping, it just took them a few months to get there!!!! Something that never would have happend if some ISP's werent ripping off the system!!!

I'm not saying its a great product by any means, but what did people expect to happen if they started "abusing the ADSL" system. And my point still stands...for most people the price is going DOWN

 

[arni1954]

The whole thing sound strange . If Tekom thought that some ISP are stealing bandwidth I don't think that they had a problem to stop it the same day. After all they are controling the bandwidth. I think that the rest of the ISP who sold 30 gig are afraid what Telkom will do to them if they will open their mouth.
ANTHER PROOF THAT THE NEW TELKOM CEO IS NOT DIFFRENT FORM THE OLD ONE.

 

[pupa]

Dotco brought an urgent application in the High Court in Cape Town against Telkom on 25 October 2005 to stop Telkom from implementing usage-based billing for its ADSL service.

Shame on the other ISP's not involved in litigation against TELKOM

Telkom will continue to implement usage based billing as of 1November 2005. All ISPs except Dotco will be billed according to the new proposed fee structure and billing method.
...............All other ISPs will comply with the usage based billing method from 1 November.............................


Typical TELKOM response


ADSL pricing

Media Reports

Media reports regarding the pricing of ADSL have also been largely inaccurate, with the media reporting that bit capping will result in Telkom’s ADSL service undergoing huge price increases.

The Facts

.......... To reiterate: broadband capping does not equate to a price increase..............

Typical TELKOM lies and misleading of consumers and the uninformed public....

Telkom has to regulate ADSL usage because certain ISPs purchase 3 gigabyte accounts from Telkom and then resell it as 30 gigabyte accounts, leading customers to believe that they purchased 30 gigabyte accounts. This practice is an abuse of the ADSL service.

This was done with TELKOM knowledge and approval to be used as a smokescreen to lull the consumer and Icasa with false expectations, while they concoct the new billing system to contort more revenue from the consumer. Now they can blame the ISP's as the "INCUMBENTS" and the consumers as "ABUSERS" to justify as reason why they have to do it , but the real truth is it was planned long ago already.
The true fact as the ISP bought a large wholesale chunk of data bandwidth and sold it as 30 gig caps with the explicit knowledge that not all the consumers on percentage basis will use this full cap, like free minutes on cell phone. This allowed the ISP to allocate the "free" unused bandwidth by transferring this capacity onto the higher bandwidth users, that means effectively instead of TELKOM benefiting from this unused bandwidth the ISP did. This was done in full cooperation and knowledge with TELKOM that allowed it to happen while they concocted a system that will ensure that unused bandwidth will go into the TELKOM coffers from 1 November

It should be noted that broadband capping is an international norm. Both the British Telecommunication 512k services have a 15-gigabyte a month cap, while its 1 megabyte service has a 30 gigabyte limit. Other telecommunications companies that employ a similar practice include Australia’s Telstra, Belgium’s Belgacom and New Zealand Telecom.

They fail to state why theirs is then only 3 gig against international norms and that these company's loose consumers to the opposition who do no capping or shaping. TELKOM is a monopoly, which do not have competition (YET).
They also do not mention the fact that they shape and kill any viable Internet service at the same time as the capping and per gig billing system that could endanger all the other moneymaking schemes TELKOM want to offer. Examples. VoIP. P2P, video streaming, downloading files even from MSDN etc.

It is a question of annulling international markets and implements all the schemes that will enrich TELKOM and screw the consumer out of hard earned revenue. This would not be possible if TELKOM had real competition.
.

Hard capping and the introduction of usage-based billing

On 1 November, Telkom will introduce two options:

1) hard capped. This means South Africans will pay international rates for local bandwidth and services. After a few days Internet use, or result in huge TELKOM bills, you will not be able to use the Internet, as it will be cut off.

2) Non Telkom ISP's will pay at huge penalties any allowance they want to give their customers, while in the meantime there is no word what TELKOM will do with their own internet services that is in opposition to the ISP's. What a flagrant abuse of monopoly power and at the same time government approved.

Telkom trusts that the media will rectify these inaccurate reports and that the information provided will reporting in future.

But TELKOM do not facilitate accurate, responsible advertisements which border on mass brainwash and false information given that do not clearly state the cost of broadband in South Africa and the gross human rights abuse of defrauding South Africans of a cost viable internet broadband service and making sure that the average South African consumer cannot own internet services.

Why have millions of consumers with low cost Internet bandwidth if you can make the same profit out of a small population group, which can afford it if they want to. The former would mean more jobs, more salaries, and more responsibilities for TELKOM for the same profit as having a small consumer base of higher income consumers that will pay any price to have broadband Internet. Telkom's way of stating public ally, stuff the consumer, stuff the poorer SA citizens, stuff the government, stuff my own charter of providing telecom's to the poor

TELKOM WILL STEAL ALL THE REVENUE THEY CAN AT THE EXPENSE OF ANYONE, < EVEN SOUTH AFRICA PROSPERITY> For the sake of shareholding profits UNTILL A ALTERNATE COMPETITION BECOMES VIABLE, which at current rate is not to be soon at all.

 

[BobTheUglgBunny]

That makes no sense to me.

You mean to tell me that if DOTCO wins the court case telkom is going to reimburse the whole country!!
TELKOM is full of ****.

If Dotco wins the case im going to setup a court case myself to get my money back.
What the hell is wrong with them. cant they just accept the fact that they didnt have proof to contridict the case in the first place and opted for the extension to makeup some evidence.

They just piss me off.
My heresay is this: " Lets Treat Telkom how they treat us"

NO, the other ISP's dont have the same/any contract with telkom. SO its only dotco that has a chance. So telkom wont have to reiburse the whole country.

 

[Pox]

The fact of the matter is that broadband capping does not result in a price increase.

hahahahahahaha....
...hang on...strictly speaking that's true....
The capping isn't the problem (well it's part of the problem) It's the fact that the per-gig billing system means the costs for ACTUAL broadband usage have become ridiculous. 1GB of data in SA costs more than most accounts you can get overseas.

 

[snoopy_inc]

if the isp's had been buying 3gig and selling it as 3gig instead of 30 the pricing would actually be going down.

If you are a normal (the large majority of adsl users) who use less than 3gig this whole thing is good cause it will be cheaper for them.

There is NO price increase!!!! They never offered 30gig at R300...it was stolen (stolen cars are always cheaper)
If the isp's hadnt been stealing gigs none of this would have happened

ppl like yourself are in a little hole looking out at the world and only seeing what u can. To scared to pop out and actually have a good look around at what is REALLY going on.

It digusts me that u would even mention something like this!!!!

If you have no insight and dont understand what is happening then open up your eyes and ask im more than willing to enlighten u on what can happen and how the 3 GB is killing this country. (check Sig for contact information)

Its cause of ppl that say, " oo im happy cause i dont use 3 GB and im getting it cheaper." that this telkom thing will actually happen and things will go south.

Common PPL wake up and smell the bladdy roses ro ill smuther u in a rose bed!!!!!!

 

[Faffy]

Even if we disregard that Telkom let it slide, you should be pissed because you're paying more for your crappy 3GB HARD CAP on your 512k/1024k line than people in the UK are paying for their UNCAPPED 2MB lines!

so sad and true, but it can get even worse, someone i spoke to has 10mb adsl uncapped unshaped for 35 pounds :/

 

[pupa]

Telkom didnt LET it happen...they introduced hard capping, it just took them a few months to get there!!!! Something that never would have happend if some ISP's werent ripping off the system!!!

I'm not saying its a great product by any means, but what did people expect to happen if they started "abusing the ADSL" system. And my point still stands...for most people the price is going DOWN

Bob, Why do you defend TELKOM so avidly. Read the posts on this forum, Talk to the ISP's and TELKOM reps and find out the truth. Take the lemon peels of your eyes and wake up buddy, go read some e-mails or something, You are obviously out of your league here.

 

[armitage]

Don't know bout that one arni1954. He has kept mum until now while learning the telkom way. He has shown an interest to improve customer services.
Though customer relations is one aspect of the whole telkom saga.

If in some blind moment of coincidence ICASA stepped in it would be amazing to see what they say. ....... prbly thank you sir. Your ref#: 66610219
well get back to you.

Quite amazing that the sp's listed there are the in most circumstances the worst providers of dsl in their respective countries. Hasn't bt been slated for a long time to also employ the same monopolistic behaviours that telkom does?
Just a quick search at adslguide.co.uk shows that the bt offering is full of **** and you can get much better for even less.

Telkom compares their products also with other countries caps that are 15g at least and 4 times faster. funny how their international norm is so skewed.

 

[VQuest]

It should be noted that broadband capping is an international norm. Both the British Telecommunication 512k services have a 15 gigabyte a month cap, while its 1 megabyte service has a 30 gigabyte limit. Other telecommunications companies that employ a similar practice include Australia’s Telstra, Belgium’s Belgacom and New Zealand Telecom.

Wow, this really p1ssed me off.

They keep on and on about those few companies who offer a cap, they never mention the fact that the majority of companies offer unlimited or a very high soft cap.

How the heck can they compare 3GB for R800 to 15GB for R300?

This really makes my blood boil - how stupid do they think (hope) we are??

There are some rather important factual errors in this press release from Telkom.

IMO the whole press release is a bunch of bull, but can you fill us in which facts you're talking about?

 

[bwana]

Dont forget that the price you pay in UK for the BT 20gb package (£26.99 or r310.00) - and all the other packages there - also include the line rental.

So even BT's smallest 2gb package running at 2mb for £17.99 (R215.00) is a third of what we pay JUST for the 1mb line here with no bandwidth. Telkoms 1mb line rental alone is 200% more than BTs 2mb 20gb inclusive package.

BTW - BT doesnt currently offer a 15gb package as far as I can tell to they might want to research their facts

Why on earth would telkom want to start publicly comparing themselves with BT?? Just to further illustrate how shafted we are?

Shame on the other ISP's not involved in litigation against TELKOM

- have a look at some other threads - but if I remember correctly Dotco apparently has a different contract than the other ISPs which is why they went the legal route leaving the others to go via ICASA.

 

[snoopy_inc]

Bob, Why do you defend TELKOM so avidly. Read the posts on this forum, Talk to the ISP's and TELKOM reps and find out the truth. Take the lemon peels of your eyes and wake up buddy, go read some e-mails or something, You are obviously out of your league here.

My point exactly.....
Check previous post on the thread

 

[MFour]

OMW ROFL LOL LMAO!!!!!

I'm so glad that Telkom does not regulate or cap SA DSL users, imagine what a drag that would have been

Are we not the luckiest nation in the world to have such a caring telecoms company like Telkom to look out for their customers ---- NOT!!!!!

Thanks Telkom, I think most of us actually do know how the bit cap thing works, and where it comes from. Thanks anyway for absolutely nothing!

 

[Hellboy]

if the isp's had been buying 3gig and selling it as 3gig instead of 30 the pricing would actually be going down.

If you are a normal (the large majority of adsl users) who use less than 3gig this whole thing is good cause it will be cheaper for them.

There is NO price increase!!!! They never offered 30gig at R300...it was stolen (stolen cars are always cheaper)
If the isp's hadnt been stealing gigs none of this would have happened

You consider 3GB as normal usage for Broadband service? Let's see I purchase 50 albums online at 60MB per album @ a price of R120.00 per album. I reach my new (November1) hardcap in 2 days and for the next 28 days no commerce will occur. How did I abuse the system and who is loosing out here me or the economy?

Now you can look at purchasing movies online and yes its becomeing a reality to buy more and more digital media online 2 Movies will cap me, once again where was the abuse?

 

[RoosTa]

Not to forget even before the 30gig accounts, you could get two accounts and use one for local downloads and gaming, and the other for browsing internationally (and getting my email). Now its pointless having more than 1 account.

 

[kolakidd]

I really hope DOTCO has their ducks in a row with this case, it is an awesome opportunity to halt this action.

At the end of the day, the thing I find most depressing is that we as Telkom subscribers are inadvertently paying the very legal fees that will screw us over. This is the central issue, all this stuff makes us lose sight of the fact that we need an alternative, a way to turn our backs on a company that treats us like dirt.

Imagine if there was a way to boycott Telkom, for now though they're laughing all the way to their legal department.

btw. they failed to mention the costs of those capped accounts from international service providers, they are much, much cheaper

 

[ignacio]

Dont forget that the price you pay in UK for the BT 20gb package (£26.99 or r310.00) - and all the other packages there - also include the line rental.

So even BT's smallest 2gb package running at 2mb for £17.99 (R215.00) is a third of what we pay JUST for the 1mb line here with no bandwidth. Telkoms 1mb line rental alone is 200% more than BTs 2mb 20gb inclusive package.

Since Telkom has willingly opened themselves up to international comparisons, I think an urgent myadsl press release is in order (are Cara's articles web news only, or actual press releases?). We need an apples-to-apples price comparison of Telkom's offerings with the offerings they mention in their press release. As bwana says, add in the line rental and make the bandwidth UNSHAPED, and then we will see how Telkom fares against international norms.

Simply unbelievable.