K53 No longer relevant for sa drivers - RTMC

[noxibox]

Add a speedlimiter of 140km/h on every vehicle and a 24 month jail sentence for people tampering with it.

To what end? At most that will get you a very tiny reduction in road deaths.

Besides what you and me as reasonably logical people do in a parking lot isn’t the case for many.

I just feel there should be a better way to prove basic competence than a simple theoretical test.

You won’t see any heavy machinery industry let anyone use a machine in real world context after a simple paper test, why on earth is it allowed for a car?

Even with dangerous machinery in a factory you have to practice on the actual machinery with supervision. That's how it was when I worked in a factory.

The theoretical test is to determine if you know the basics you'd need to know to start doing the practical training. The disturbing thing is the number of people who have to take those tests over and over and over. I could understand perhaps falling down once, but if you fail a second time you simply should be barred from writing it again.

I've never seen a learner driver almost crash into anyone. Worst case scenario is getting stuck behind one as they do their checks at an intersection.

I've not heard of this being an issue either.

 

[absynth]

I think the point of the K53 is to teach new drivers how to observe properly and be aware of whats happening around them.Not to drive like that for the rest of their lives.

 

[Lucas Buck]

The problem is BEHAVIOURAL, not related to driver education.
The problem is the whole attitude some have towards driving and traffic.
A lot of this is a consequence of poor policing and allowing the taxi mafia to get away with it for decades.

Agreed, this also looks like another money making scheme to me.

 

[Jet-Fighter7700]

so nobody believes they can pull it off?

I mean if the laws are changed to require retesting after 5 years,
and all the rest of it,

according to you guys, its a pipe dream?

Yes I agree, corruption is the biggest issue, but also the carnage every holiday season is something that needs to be seen to be believed.
so maybe the fact that so many die every holiday season, will make the changes happen?

 

[EADC]

so nobody believes they can pull it off?

I mean if the laws are changed to require retesting after 5 years,
and all the rest of it,

according to you guys, its a pipe dream?

Yes I agree, corruption is the biggest issue, but also the carnage every holiday season is something that needs to be seen to be believed.
so maybe the fact that so many die every holiday season, will make the changes happen?

Our driving doesn't need to change its the attitude on the roads that need to change.

 

[Lucas Buck]

I think the point of the K53 is to teach new drivers how to observe properly and be aware of whats happening around them.Not to drive like that for the rest of their lives.

The most useful thing that I've learned and that I do every single time before turning or changing lanes is checking my blindspot. Most of k53 really depends on the situation .e.g when I get to a robot or stop sign at night I'll do the full observation more for personal safety than anything else.

 

[Jet-Fighter7700]

Our driving doesn't need to change its the attitude on the roads that need to change.

so how would that need to be changed? police every 50 meters?
or just impossible to enforce attitude changes?

 

[EADC]

so how would that need to be changed? police every 50 meters?
or just impossible to enforce attitude changes?

Unfortunately you are correct it's not like the guy doesn't know he shouldn't speed in a residential area he just doesn't give a **** or jump a red light.

We would need a huge attitude shift of people obeying the law without having to be policed.

 

[Jet-Fighter7700]

We would need a huge attitude shift of people obeying the law without having to be policed.

is there any chance of that even happening?

 

[SauRoNZA]

Even with dangerous machinery in a factory you have to practice on the actual machinery with supervision. That's how it was when I worked in a factory.

But you didn’t go right out into the live environment from the word go when you set foot in it did you?

Like someone said earlier most of us learnt in a parking lot. I think that part of it should just be made mandatory and tested in a minor capacity to make sure you can at least operate the machinery.

Then you get your learners to go do it in the real world.

Then you get your license.

Call it basic practical competency.

 

[EADC]

is there any chance of that even happening?

Maybe who knows but re testing people to not be assholes? Pointless.

 

[Lucas Buck]

so how would that need to be changed? police every 50 meters?
or just impossible to enforce attitude changes?

I drive regularly through an area where there's a taxi rank and a traffic department a few streets away. The cars and taxis in that area regularly get away with breaking the rules of the road. Proper policing would solve that problem. It would make more sense if those who regularly get fines for traffic offenses were punished rather than requiring everyone to retake their drivers. The problem isn't people not knowing the rules of the road, it's people ignoring them. How would retaking a test solve that problem?

 

[Swa]

The numerous Learners I have seen almost crash into me or others says otherwise.

Besides what you and me as reasonably logical people do in a parking lot isn’t the case for many.

I just feel there should be a better way to prove basic competence than a simple theoretical test.

You won’t see any heavy machinery industry let anyone use a machine in real world context after a simple paper test, why on earth is it allowed for a car?

Strange as ALL the learners I encountered have been overly cautious (or doing the K53 checks) causing others to almost have accidents. Now using machinery under supervision after a theoretic test... happens all the time. We call it experience and until we can plug into the matrix there's no other way to do it.

 

[Swa]

I think the point of the K53 is to teach new drivers how to observe properly and be aware of whats happening around them.Not to drive like that for the rest of their lives.

It's exactly like you're "supposed" to drive. I say that loosely because it doesn't actually show what you should be doing to be a real safe driver and there's a lot of redundant time wasting. Really who's going to overtake me over a pavement? That time checking my blind spot there's actually a really good chance I can hit a pedestrian. All of those redundant checks in directions where it's impossible to have an accident only causes frustration and congestion which are two major causes of accidents.

 

[supersunbird]

It's exactly like you're "supposed" to drive. I say that loosely because it doesn't actually show what you should be doing to be a real safe driver and there's a lot of redundant time wasting. Really who's going to overtake me over a pavement? That time checking my blind spot there's actually a really good chance I can hit a pedestrian. All of those redundant checks in directions where it's impossible to have an accident only causes frustration and congestion which are two major causes of accidents.

Hopefully you do check your blind spot when changing lanes.

 

[Gordon_R]

It's exactly like you're "supposed" to drive. I say that loosely because it doesn't actually show what you should be doing to be a real safe driver and there's a lot of redundant time wasting. Really who's going to overtake me over a pavement? That time checking my blind spot there's actually a really good chance I can hit a pedestrian. All of those redundant checks in directions where it's impossible to have an accident only causes frustration and congestion which are two major causes of accidents.

Its actually hilarious to come up behind a learner driver at an intersection (unless you are in a hurry). When the light changes to green, you can be reasonably sure that it will take 10-15 seconds for the learner to complete all the checks, before they can pull away...

Hopefully you do check your blind spot when changing lanes.

That's exactly the point: By worrying about irrelevant hypothetical scenarios, you might miss the one that kills you...

For the record, I had to redo my drivers test after 30 years (long story). Even the instructor admitted that nobody actually drives the K53 way. I passed the test, and went back to my normal (accident free) way of driving.

Common sense, and experience, are more relevant than rigid rules. Unfortunately for youngsters, both of those are lacking...

Edit: Defensive driving goes a long way too.

 

[ArtyLoop]

It's exactly like you're "supposed" to drive. I say that loosely because it doesn't actually show what you should be doing to be a real safe driver and there's a lot of redundant time wasting. Really who's going to overtake me over a pavement? That time checking my blind spot there's actually a really good chance I can hit a pedestrian. All of those redundant checks in directions where it's impossible to have an accident only causes frustration and congestion which are two major causes of accidents.

A taxi full of passengers being driven by an arrogant ***** that doesn't want to sit in traffic, as has happened to me

 

[ponder]

Its actually hilarious to come up behind a learner driver at an intersection (unless you are in a hurry). When the light changes to green, you can be reasonably sure that it will take 10-15 seconds for the learner to complete all the checks, before they can pull away...

That's if they don't stall it. Little schite in front of me yesterday stalled not once but twice and by that stage the light had turned red...

 

[Gordon_R]

A taxi full of passengers being driven by an arrogant ***** that doesn't want to sit in traffic, as has happened to me

That is quite plausible, but if a collision occurs in that scenario, it is the sole responsibility of the other vehicle. A prudent driver might check and be cautious, but traffic rules should not place a burden on the law abiding having to anticipate unreasonable and unlawful behaviour of others.

 

[newby_investor]

Motivation for K53: You need to be aware of your surroundings when you drive (situational awareness).

Implementation of K53: You move your head from side to side to satisfy examiners. Your face is pointed towards the blind spot but you aren't actually registering. When I did a couple of lessons for k53 with an instructor, I noticed afterwards that he never mentioned what sort of things I was checking for when I looked at my blind spot. No insight into the situation whatsoever.

In many ways I think the only way you're going to learn to drive is by driving, contrary to what @SauRoNZA asserts. That being said however - the Finnish model, where children in school are taught about car control and that kind of thing on dedicated tracks - there could be value in that. I recently had to teach someone to drive and the problem was that they were learning two things at once - car control, and situational awareness / how other idiots on the road behave. It can be traumatising for a young person to have to figure out why the car is stalling so easily on an uphill, while there are impatient drivers hooting and zooming past. So a 2-stage model, if you like, where people can learn the basics of car control, how not to stall, emergency braking, and yes - parking - away from normal traffic can have value. But you'd still need actual experience on the road to be able to drive properly around other drivers.

When I learned to drive, I had been on the roads for years already with my bicycle, so I had a solid idea of the road rules and how motorists behave in traffic. So I learned car control on deserted streets and parking areas, and didn't have much hassle adjusting to actual traffic. But recently, in Cape Town's Southern Suburbs, finding empty streets for my student to practise on was a severe challenge. Came right eventually, but it took months and many tears (and yes a few scratches on the car but fortunately it was a cheap one bought for the purpose. No one else's car was harmed, just the side of my garage...).