LIVE | Apartheid flag judgment

[Swa]

I think old toppies here should just chill as "This order is not a banning order against the old flag, says judge"

Order is specific against gratuitous display of flag. No one is coming after your bedsheets and check your cupboards and confiscate your joy and pride.

And what's gratuitous display? There's already talk now that if you have one in your home you better remove it when someone comes over so as not to offend. This is an empty ruling. The judge did refer to discussion but the only discussion now is around when and where the flag can be displayed and not around the actual flag. There was more discussion before this ruling. People were actually discussing what the flag meant to individuals. What does it mean to the guy with the old flag, new flag and other flags in his bar? What does it mean to ou Sarel who's father told him about how they flew it while raiding British camps?

These are the discussions we should be having rather than pandering to a few SJW wusses who only see things in their own light. Sadly banning it will stifle these discussions.

and yet we have 9 pages of people "fighting" about a piece of shitty cloth

Old one or new one?

If the banning of the old flag offends you, it is only because you let it offend you

It goes deeper than just a flag. That's what's offending.

What do you think keeping the old flag will achieve?

What will banning it achieve? And don't say nothing unless you're invested in it.

Time to design a flag that we can all relate to.....maybe just incorporate all the old flags colours...?

I wonder, will there be people who still fly the old-new flag then?

 

[zll]

I knew that silly little retort will come up again. So you can't prove it, but cry about it... Ok.

Bro. You literally cried about more people dying post-apartheid that during apartheid. "So you can't prove it, but cry about it... Ok."

 

[zll]

Yeah doesn't sound like it. Freedom of speech also means the right to be a dick. That is the only middle ground that doesn't lead you down the slippery slope. Believe it or not if this decision stands it's the final nail in the coffin and like in Zim you'll soon have no right to criticise the ruling government. Malema is already asking for removal of "Die Stem". You think he'll stop at that? If you agree with this you'll have no problem and be right at home in Germany.

Don't get me wrong. It was wrong to display the flag at the Black Monday protests just like the #allmenaretrash campaign was wrong. You don't antagonise the people you are speaking to. At the same time though people are choosing what to see. The only reason some see it as the "apartheid flag" is because of the new monstrosity. They didn't even put any artistic effort into it in their hurry to get rid of the old one. But face it not all countries get rid of their old flag after a revolution. For some reason people afterwards choose to see their old flag as a bad symbol or not. We never had the discussion then about what it is and what it means. That's the problem.

If you really believe that then try shouting the K word in public and see what happens when you respond to a bunch of angry people with "freedom of speech!". But you won't do that because you're not an idiot. And because, even when it comes to freedom of speech, CONTEXT MATTERS. People make the freedom of speech argument like they really walk around saying and exactly the way they feel. They don't. Most people temper their speech and actions based on who they're with and where they are. Rwanda banned the use of the term

Regarding Die Stem, I would argue that removing it from the current national anthem would be a mistake. The current national anthem is meant to represent all of South Africa's cultures. In regards to banning it being sung on it's own... *shrugs* I wouldn't miss it. And I laughed when Malema brought up the statue thing today. I argued yesterday that we should probably remove the statues and put them in a museum.

I'd be willing to put money on an overwhelming majority of the population seeing it as a symbol of their former oppressors.

 

[Swa]

If you really believe that then try shouting the K word in public and see what happens when you respond to a bunch of angry people with "freedom of speech!". But you won't do that because you're not an idiot. And because, even when it comes to freedom of speech, CONTEXT MATTERS. People make the freedom of speech argument like they really walk around saying and exactly the way they feel. They don't. Most people temper their speech and actions based on who they're with and where they are. Rwanda banned the use of the term

Regarding Die Stem, I would argue that removing it from the current national anthem would be a mistake. The current national anthem is meant to represent all of South Africa's cultures. In regards to banning it being sung on it's own... *shrugs* I wouldn't miss it. And I laughed when Malema brought up the statue thing today. I argued yesterday that we should probably remove the statues and put them in a museum.

Where have I said people should behave like idiots? I said the exact opposite. But that doesn't mean people should not have the right to behave like idiots if they choose. That there are consequences for doing so isn't the issue here but the state shouldn't interfere in their right to do so. If you don't understand the difference between the two you don't know what freedom of speech is and entails. It's how Zim ended up where it is with people not having the right to protest. I hope to god if this has any weight it gets appealed or else we are ALL in much deeper sh|t.

I'd be willing to put money on an overwhelming majority of the population seeing it as a symbol of their former oppressors.

Actually the majority of people are quite chill over these things. Don't confuse those shouting empty words over twitter as being representatives of the population.

 

[LD50]

pack the fukking flags away
get over yourselves, my fellow white verkrampte afrikaner brothers ans sisters from the north. Yes you, you know who you are. You make me sick

 

[LD50]

Actually the majority of people are quite chill over these things. Don't confuse those shouting empty words over twitter as being representatives of the population.

what, you have a handle on what the majority think?
You sound like the next springbok couch sitting in the pavilion. Were you on the receiving side during apartheid?
shut up man

 

[LD50]

#burytheflags

 

[Swa]

what, you have a handle on what the majority think?
You sound like the next springbok couch sitting in the pavilion. Were you on the receiving side during apartheid?
shut up man

You shut up. You have a handle on what the majority think? Lol you don't. Go look at the surveys where people are asked. The majority are more worried about where their next meal will come from. You want to drink the kool aid then be my guest. But claiming those who shout the loudest are speaking for the majority is the same as claiming the one or two who may have flown the flag at the protests speak for all Afrikaners.

 

[Swa]

Isn't this case related to the "black Monday" protest about farm murders?
So, the only thing to come of that protest is the banning the old South African flag?

Glad to see South Africa has its priorities straight.

The sad thing is that it's all based on fake news. No verified image of anyone flying an old flag at the protest has ever surfaced. The images that were verifiable turned out to be from other dates or even countries and were few and far between. One even shows the unmissable "Oklahoma" in the background and couldn't possibly have been taken at the claimed time.

The media as usual jumped on the racism bandwagon without any critical thought. When it was pointed out dozens of publications fraudulently replaced the images with stock photos of the flag. There wasn't any retraction or examination of the facts afterwards and instead they continued with the assumption of the mass flying of the flag.

It appears like it was again hijacked by a few opportunists, one of them being Fikile Mbalula, trying to distract from the facts which I find really disgusting. This angle never got media attention and such the protests were unfairly tainted all for political gain. This was never considered during this farce of a trial and simply accepted as gospel truth.

 

[Pitbull]

Bro. You literally cried about more people dying post-apartheid that during apartheid. "So you can't prove it, but cry about it... Ok."

What you on about? Ofc I can prove it. Don't be farking daft...

"Factually" was a clue

 

[dualmeister]

Yet the current flag is OK under the current apartheid regime.

 

[Tabac]

Friday funny / facts

 

[ForceFate]

"Fun with Flags"

 

[borro]

 

[ponder]

Bro. You literally cried about more people dying post-apartheid that during apartheid. "So you can't prove it, but cry about it... Ok."

Look at the TRC statistics & DoJ database (held by saha).

I suspect the govs aids policy alone killed more people, nevermind the rest.

 

[Sideshow Bob]

When the cops start rounding white people up, beating them for not having their ID books, or putting them in their vans and them never returning home, then I'll join you on the bandwagon. Until then, sadly the two are not the same.

There are hardly any people left to round up as they are all genocided already. Do you really think before you post?

 

[Ponderer]

If you really believe that then try shouting the K word in public and see what happens when you respond to a bunch of angry people with "freedom of speech!". But you won't do that because you're not an idiot. And because, even when it comes to freedom of speech, CONTEXT MATTERS. People make the freedom of speech argument like they really walk around saying and exactly the way they feel. They don't. Most people temper their speech and actions based on who they're with and where they are. Rwanda banned the use of the term

Regarding Die Stem, I would argue that removing it from the current national anthem would be a mistake. The current national anthem is meant to represent all of South Africa's cultures. In regards to banning it being sung on it's own... *shrugs* I wouldn't miss it. And I laughed when Malema brought up the statue thing today. I argued yesterday that we should probably remove the statues and put them in a museum.

I'd be willing to put money on an overwhelming majority of the population seeing it as a symbol of their former oppressors.

Is a/any white person a symbol of oppression?

 

[ForceFate]

Is a/any white person a symbol of oppression?

Is a white person a symbol?

 

[My_King]

Dear BLF, ANC, EFF and whatever other political parties that want White South African's to leave South Africa.

I will gladly with all my family leave this country if you could please do me the favor of paying for my tickets to go back home. You are welcomed to write to the Italian embassy on our behalf to ask the Italian government to set up facilities for people wanting to leave. The grass might not be greener on the other side but at least I don't have to deal with the constant threat of being killed on the basis of our skin color or economic stability. There's are a good portion of Italians that helped and still helping to Build South Africa but if our freedom and love to do so is being threatened then what's the point living here?


my 2 cents

Also to make the move over smooth, R10 mil would also help from the things they stole. Then I'm gone. R10 mil is not that much considering 25 years of theft.
Japan for me though. I like how people live there. Thats if they are willing to accept me.

 

[Kloofvreter]

Apartheid flag.
Convicted racist.