[May 2013..Dec 2013] The Gauteng E-tolling Thread

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Paul_S said:
Evidently the taxi associations register VLN's with SANRAL on behalf of the taxi owners.
The taxi's do not need to use e-tags for identification.
According to a thread on the AVCOM forums, taxi owners are also registering private vehicle, number plate numbers as taxi's in order to avoid paying toll fees.

No wonder there is so little noise from the taxi community!
Friends and family with private vehicles can travel for free.
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Taxis are only supposed to be exempt ' on their authorised routes '.

If their route does not touch the toll roads they are no different from the general commuter and are supposed to pay.
 
Garyvdh said:
Guys do you think we should make a new thread tonight?

I'm thinking it might get very busy very quickly and might be better to make a new start on the day they go live so that we can keep people's actual experiences all together in one place?
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Nah, stick to this one IMO.
 
FF Plus e-toll bid scrapped

The application by the Freedom Front Plus to stop the implementation of e-tolling has been scrapped from the court roll.


Source : Sapa /mar/hdw
Date : 02 Dec 2013 14:26 OrigID : LP958921
 
Jacaranda Newsteam ‏@Jacanews 7m

Application was struck off the roll for want of urgency. #etolls
 
daveza said:
Taxis are only supposed to be exempt ' on their authorised routes '.

If their route does not touch the toll roads they are no different from the general commuter and are supposed to pay.
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Who is going to police that?
1. SANRAL can't as they do not know what routes have been registered by the taxi associations and
2. The taxi associations won't bother because they're only interested in keeping their members happy by registering whatever VLN's are handed to them.
 
Originally Posted by Dawie Roodt
The ‘correct’ price of any good or service is of the utmost importance for the proper working of an economy. Economic agents (that’s all of us) will decide how and how much of a particular resource to allocate depending on its price.
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Some very valid points made....
 
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OzzieCapie said:
.....I do believe the SA govt is corrupt, like some other govts around world, and that the corruption should be resisted. The best way to do that is to actually focus on the real corruption rather than be disengenuous about it.....
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Not sure if you trolling or not - but, what part of the R500 000 000 p/km to resurface an existing road do you not see as 'highway robbery'?
 
OzzieCapie said:
Ok, as an outsider I have read as much as I can and still cannot see the issues other than a political opposition to create anarchy and blame the unworkability on the govt...or just blame the govt straight up and accuse them of corruption..
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We don't mind paying for the roads, but we mind paying for the roads three times. If they needed more money then they should have increased the fuel levy which is unavoidable and affects everybody equally. The collection cost of the fuel levy is 0c/rand. Instead they opted for a system which has ENORMOUS running costs, employs thousands of staff all over the country, requires offices in most malls, requires vehicles on the road, requires it's own police force, requires threats to the citizens etc, and costs at least 17c/rand to collect the fees.

So two systems, both bring in the money. One brings in 100% of the money and the other one only 83%. Which one would you have chosen?

Sinbad said:
Please don't forget that the capex for the etrolling mechanism equalled the capex for the roads, pretty much ...
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^ what he said. They spent billions to build these iron monstrosities over our highways with tons of cameras and tons of purple lights on them just to be able to collect at a 83% efficiency rate.

Garyvdh said:
Jacaranda Newsteam ‏@Jacanews 7m

Application was struck off the roll for want of urgency. #etolls
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So once again the courts have failed us.
 
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Wyzak said:
We don't mind paying for the roads, but we mind paying for the roads three times. If they needed more money then they should have increased the fuel levy which is unavoidable and affects everybody equally. The collection cost of the fuel levy is 0c/rand. Instead they opted for a system which has ENORMOUS running costs, employs thousands of staff all over the country, requires offices in most malls, requires vehicles on the road, requires it's own police force, requires threats to the citizens etc, and costs at least 17c/rand to collect the fees.

So two systems, both bring in the money. One brings in 100% of the money and the other one only 83%. Which one would you have chosen?
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Please don't forget that the capex for the etrolling mechanism equalled the capex for the roads, pretty much ...
 
Wyzak said:
.........So once again the courts have failed us.
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To be frank, I believe the FF were merely opportunistic with the application - maybe for some cheap publicity. At the end-of-the day, the voice of the poeple is the most poweful tool in any democracy - the time to be heard is fast approaching.
 
An application by the Freedom Front Plus to stop the implementation of e-tolls has been struck off the roll at the High Court in Pretoria.

"The matter is scrapped from the roll for a lack of urgency," said Judge Maria Jansen on Monday.

She said the applicant sought wide-reaching relief, and failed to make a proper case.

Jansen said the constitutional issues related to the case were complicated, and that it had implications for the separation of powers.


Source : Sapa /mar/hdw/jje/cls
Date : 02 Dec 2013 14:38
 
xeslaro said:
To be frank, I believe the FF were merely opportunistic with the application - maybe for some cheap publicity. At the end-of-the day, the voice of the poeple is the most poweful tool in any democracy - the time to be heard is fast approaching.
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The court has made a mistake. 13 days does not equal 14 days. The FF+ might have been able to apply for a court order a few days sooner but it wouldn't have made a big difference. I hope they appeal.
 
Wyzak said:
The court has made a mistake. 13 days does not equal 14 days. The FF+ might have been able to apply for a court order a few days sooner but it wouldn't have made a big difference. I hope they appeal.
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I agree. If the law says 14 days notice, then that's the law.

Funny how dates are no biggie when it suits government due to "urgency", but file your tax return after the deadline... try and tell them you had something "urgent" come up.
 
Wyzak said:
The court has made a mistake. 13 days does not equal 14 days. The FF+ might have been able to apply for a court order a few days sooner but it wouldn't have made a big difference. I hope they appeal.
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As much as I hear what you saying, the Judge is guided by many other considerations when deciding if 14 days requires strict or substantial compliance in order to nullify the ensuing conduct or not.
 
An application by the FF Plus to stop e-tolls on Gauteng highways was struck from the roll by the High Court in Pretoria on Monday.

"The matter is scrapped from the roll for lack of urgency," said Judge Maria Jansen.

She said the applicant sought wide-reaching relief, and failed to make a proper case.

Jansen said the constitutional issues related to the case were complicated, and it had implications for the separation of powers.

Afterwards, Freedom Front Plus spokesman Anton Alberts said the merits of the case had not been heard.

"We are very disappointed... The merits of the case were not heard today. The matter is not necessarily dead."

Alberts said the party would decide on a way forward. A likely option was to put the matter up for review, which could take a few months.

Alberts said the court ruling was not in the public interest.


Source : Sapa /mar/hdw/jje/cls/th
Date : 02 Dec 2013 15:00
 
Garyvdh said:
An application by the FF Plus to stop e-tolls on Gauteng highways was struck from the roll by the High Court in Pretoria on Monday.

"The matter is scrapped from the roll for lack of urgency," said Judge Maria Jansen.

She said the applicant sought wide-reaching relief, and failed to make a proper case.

Jansen said the constitutional issues related to the case were complicated, and it had implications for the separation of powers.

Afterwards, Freedom Front Plus spokesman Anton Alberts said the merits of the case had not been heard.

"We are very disappointed... The merits of the case were not heard today. The matter is not necessarily dead."

Alberts said the party would decide on a way forward. A likely option was to put the matter up for review, which could take a few months.

Alberts said the court ruling was not in the public interest.


Source : Sapa /mar/hdw/jje/cls/th
Date : 02 Dec 2013 15:00
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It seems that all the court rulings for e-tolls went against the public
 
Musiclover08 said:
It seems that all the court rulings for e-tolls went against the public
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The Government pension fund is heavily invested in the e-tolling system.
It is in their interests to make sure that e-tolling generates a lot of cash.
 
What's the point of making any law with clear cut criteria if a judge can just override it on such a flimsy basis?
 
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