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[May 2013..Dec 2013] The Gauteng E-tolling Thread
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OrbitalDawn
Ulysses Everett McGill
It sounds to me like she merely ruled on the urgency of the matter, not the whole 14 day notice thing.
daveza
Honorary Master
Curious - do they have the Toy Run on the toll roads ?
I would guess it's almost impossible for the cameras to pick up number plate details when the bikes are so close together.
Maybe the cars should ride close to each others backsides as well.
I would guess it's almost impossible for the cameras to pick up number plate details when the bikes are so close together.
Maybe the cars should ride close to each others backsides as well.
Yes, and it will continue to do so even up to the Constitutional Court where judges are more pro-ANC. Political parties are wasting time and money on court cases. This is not going to stop the e-toll system. The system is up and running and will come into effect tomorrow.
I, personally think that what the general public should do now is take some time and see where they can limit their expenses and absorb the new expenses as efficient as possible. What daily users do over the next 3-6 months may have a huge impact on their lives in terms of the e-toll system. Many will loose houses, cars and even families if they want to pay their debts and stay out of jail.
I think a lot has been done and tens of millions of Rands spent in trying to stop the e-tolls. Not government, nor courts agreed with this and I think the public is now limited as to what can be done.
dualmeister
Honorary Master
Isn't tomorrow the big day 
the toy run etc ... are a convoy under the RGA and when under the RGA you shouldn't be obliged to pay tolls - the changes in legislation make it an open question. But traditionally protesters and marathon runners and what not support vehicles don't pay tolls because the road stops being a road for vehicular traffic for them.
This is why I advocate having "marches" on the etoll roads from time to time - give the notice and have them fight about it
reactor_sa
Executive Member
In Australia the highways connect distant towns, just like the n3 and n1 here. Rather compare aussie tolls to those, not the short stretches of the Gauteng highways.
LazyLion
King of de Jungle
When it comes to abiding by the law, the ANC thinks they are just general guidelines.
But when it comes to you obeying the law, you better bladdy well comply!
yep - and I set out earlier (in this or another thread) why unfortunately most judges would go that way. I think it was not ideal for her to have failed to grant alternative relief in the circumstances though
MrGray
Honorary Master
So which department do you work for at scamral?
They are one and the same thing. It's not like FF+ could have known months ago that the government would ignore the law stating that they need to give 14 days notice. They only found out about that 13 days ago.
daveza
Honorary Master
Jail for debt, really ? :erm:
OrbitalDawn
Ulysses Everett McGill
I think that's one of the things that'll come up in the eventual court case. They criminalized not paying e-Tolls, i.e. it's not civil debt. But they're adamant it's not tax, evasion of which is a criminal offense... :erm:
1. Who will pay the taxes when the taxpayers are in jail?
2. Where will they find jail space in our already overcrowded jails?
daveza
Honorary Master
I can just see them locking up some little old lady for not paying her toll fees.
LazyLion
King of de Jungle
The application by the FF Plus to stop e-tolling on Gauteng's highways was struck from the roll by the High Court in Pretoria on Monday.
"The matter is scrapped from the roll for the lack of urgency," Judge Maria Jansen said.
She said the applicant sought wide-reaching relief, and failed to make a proper case.
Jansen said the constitutional issues related to the case were complicated, and it had implications for the separation of powers.
Roelof Du Plessis SC, for the Freedom Front Plus, submitted in court that the courts were mandated to ensure that all branches of government fulfilled their constitutional obligations.
"It is therefore not interference with separation of powers, but the right to apply the Constitution and the law, and to prevent violation... of the law," he said.
"The courts will generally not interfere in the normal operation of the legislative or the executive part of government, and the courts have no right to express any view on political choices and policy issues in the course of making legislation."
Du Plessis argued that the SA National Roads Agency Limited was not government, and that the implementation of e-tolls was an action "flowing from unlawful actions taken by government".
He said the urgency was that e-tolling would begin on Tuesday, and it would be an infringement on rights.
"What the respondents want is the money from e-tolls, and they are going to get it whether they comply with the Constitution or not."
Afterwards, FF Plus spokesman Anton Alberts said the merits of the matter were not heard.
"We are very disappointed... The merits of the case were not heard today. The matter is not necessarily dead."
Alberts said the party would decide on a way forward. A likely option was to put the matter up for review, which could take a few months. The decision was not in the public interest, he said.
The FF Plus was ordered to pay the costs of the application.
Source : Sapa /mar/hdw/th/jje
Date : 02 Dec 2013 15:23 OrigID : LP959508
"The matter is scrapped from the roll for the lack of urgency," Judge Maria Jansen said.
She said the applicant sought wide-reaching relief, and failed to make a proper case.
Jansen said the constitutional issues related to the case were complicated, and it had implications for the separation of powers.
Roelof Du Plessis SC, for the Freedom Front Plus, submitted in court that the courts were mandated to ensure that all branches of government fulfilled their constitutional obligations.
"It is therefore not interference with separation of powers, but the right to apply the Constitution and the law, and to prevent violation... of the law," he said.
"The courts will generally not interfere in the normal operation of the legislative or the executive part of government, and the courts have no right to express any view on political choices and policy issues in the course of making legislation."
Du Plessis argued that the SA National Roads Agency Limited was not government, and that the implementation of e-tolls was an action "flowing from unlawful actions taken by government".
He said the urgency was that e-tolling would begin on Tuesday, and it would be an infringement on rights.
"What the respondents want is the money from e-tolls, and they are going to get it whether they comply with the Constitution or not."
Afterwards, FF Plus spokesman Anton Alberts said the merits of the matter were not heard.
"We are very disappointed... The merits of the case were not heard today. The matter is not necessarily dead."
Alberts said the party would decide on a way forward. A likely option was to put the matter up for review, which could take a few months. The decision was not in the public interest, he said.
The FF Plus was ordered to pay the costs of the application.
Source : Sapa /mar/hdw/th/jje
Date : 02 Dec 2013 15:23 OrigID : LP959508
LazyLion
King of de Jungle
Eish, everytime SAPA updates this news item, they add one more line then re-publish the article.
http://mg.co.za/article/2013-12-01-zuma-appoints-new-judges
What a joke. Today was the judge's first day in office.
What a joke. Today was the judge's first day in office.
MrGray
Honorary Master
How very strategic of them. Clever.
Sonic2k
Executive Member
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Indeed... one needs to really be smarter than the cANCer and keep one step ahead of them. Unfortunately the FF does not strike me as such a group of individuals.
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