Microsoft kills Internet Explorer 8, 9, and 10

[Skerminkel]

I was one such and have since given up after being politely reminded on enquiry that the browser whose removal I was complaining about isn't approved for use on company PCs.

I know the feeling...

...Ah ha! Are you sure it is not more about members having to bash something everyday?

I am. "Bashing something everyday" is standard across all internet forums.

 

[letslogic.com]

Check out this link and then justify your statement about standards adherence.

Do you see the image on the top right of the page you wanted me to look at? Do you see the blue line going down and the green line going up? Why do you think that is?

You should also take into account that the only reason the blue line exists is because IE is bundled with the OS.

Can you show me one person that installs IE on purpose because it's their favourite means of browsing the internet?

 

[Mant1s]

why do corporations enforce using IE in the first place? what reason do they have behind this? security? lol

 

[gregmcc]

why do corporations enforce using IE in the first place? what reason do they have behind this? security? lol

It was easier to create apps for one browser version rather than have to test across multiple browsers. Its also all those old legacy apps which were written when only IE was around.

 

[Geoff.D]

You can't be a developer...

There is this concept called "standards" - something IE has never been good at following.

Have you not read the MyBB manual? IE bashing is a requirement for membership!

Do you see the image on the top right of the page you wanted me to look at? Do you see the blue line going down and the green line going up? Why do you think that is?

You should also take into account that the only reason the blue line exists is because IE is bundled with the OS.

Can you show me one person that installs IE on purpose because it's their favourite means of browsing the internet?

You made a statement about standards adherence. So look at the complete reference, not just at the graph.

One person, well Yes, ME! I deliberately installed IE on my PCs! I am not swayed by the masses. Indeed I get suspicious about everything when a claim is made "Everybody is using/doing/downloading it"!

 

[backstreetboy]

You made a statement about standards adherence. So look at the complete reference, not just at the graph.

One person, well Yes, ME! I deliberately installed IE on my PCs! I am not swayed by the masses. Indeed I get suspicious about everything when a claim is made "Everybody is using/doing/downloading it"!

Lol why punish yourself deliberately?

 

[Solitude]

You made a statement about standards adherence. So look at the complete reference, not just at the graph.

One person, well Yes, ME! I deliberately installed IE on my PCs! I am not swayed by the masses. Indeed I get suspicious about everything when a claim is made "Everybody is using/doing/downloading it"!

Have you ever tried any of the other browsers?

Lol why punish yourself deliberately?

He probably feels bad for IE. Good for him.

 

[Geoff.D]

You can't be a developer...

There is this concept called "standards" - something IE has never been good at following.

Have you not read the MyBB manual? IE bashing is a requirement for membership!

Have you ever tried any of the other browsers?



He probably feels bad for IE. Good for him.

I like IE, it suits my style of Internet browsing. I am comfortable that I have security under control and it works with the major sites I use all the time.

yes I have, FireFox, Opera, MS Edge and Chrome. I use each one for very specific browsing because each has its own set of strong points. There is no such thing as a perfect browser. At the moment I am using IE, Chrome and Edge.

My whole point is I detest criticism of something without justifying why ... The statement has been made about IE not adhering to standards. I am asking the person to justify that statement. If he fails to do so his comment has no value as far as I am concerned.

 

[Solitude]

I like IE, it suits my style of Internet browsing. I am comfortable that I have security under control and it works with the major sites I use all the time.

yes I have, FireFox, Opera, MS Edge and Chrome. I use each one for very specific browsing because each has its own set of strong points. There is no such thing as a perfect browser. At the moment I am using IE, Chrome and Edge.

My whole point is I detest criticism of something without justifying why ... The statement has been made about IE not adhering to standards. I am asking the person to justify that statement. If he fails to do so his comment has no value as far as I am concerned.

I can answer it for him. I'm a web developer.

http://html5test.com/results/desktop.html

 

[letslogic.com]

You made a statement about standards adherence. So look at the complete reference, not just at the graph.

One person, well Yes, ME! I deliberately installed IE on my PCs! I am not swayed by the masses. Indeed I get suspicious about everything when a claim is made "Everybody is using/doing/downloading it"!

You know, you arguing this point with me is like me arguing with you about cardio-thoracic surgery (assuming you're a cardio-thoracic surgeon (benefit of the doubt and all that))

I didn't bother commenting on the rest of the Wikipedia article as I don't think I'm smart enough to help you understand what you're looking at.

There is a reason that the following exists:

if ($.browser.msie) {}

<![if !IE]><![endif]>

 

[Solitude]

I think this developer said it well:
http://cheekymonkeymedia.ca/blog/drupal-planet/how-deal-ieinternet-explorer-11-render-issues

"IE is always a pain for web developer. Unless you are a superstar front end developer, you will always find something odd on IE rendered page."

For me the pain comes in supporting older IE versions. Unfortunately a lot of corporate clients still use IE8.

 

[Geoff.D]

Yes! I have been using that site to check my browsers whenever any updates happen. I am an amateur developer and do not claim to be an authority on what all the test results mean.

What I find very interesting is the variation in the scores one gets when asking for a specific browser to be evaluated , compared to Windows 10 and Edge.

MY Browser (IE 11) score is 318, yet IE 11 is 336? Is the difference the extensions and add-ons I currently have running?

Windows 10 says it is 401 yet the windows 10 browser is Edge and that comes in at 402?

 

[Geoff.D]

You can't be a developer...

There is this concept called "standards" - something IE has never been good at following.

Have you not read the MyBB manual? IE bashing is a requirement for membership!

You know, you arguing this point with me is like me arguing with you about cardio-thoracic surgery (assuming you're a cardio-thoracic surgeon (benefit of the doubt and all that))

I didn't bother commenting on the rest of the Wikipedia article as I don't think I'm smart enough to help you understand what you're looking at.

There is a reason that the following exists:

if ($.browser.msie) {}

<![if !IE]><![endif]>

So It becomes personal ! I did not try and challenge you on what you know or do not know and you have no right to insinuate anything about my level of knowledge or otherwise either.

All I asked you to do is justify your statement.

If you are a website developer, then it is your job to make sure the code you write is compatible with ALL browsers out there no exceptions! It has nothing to do with how difficult it is or what the problems are associated with achieving that goal.

And your code at the end is simply childish!

 

[letslogic.com]

So It becomes personal ! I did not try and challenge you on what you know or do not know and you have no right to insinuate anything about my level of knowledge or otherwise either.

All I asked you to do is justify your statement.

If you are a website developer, then it is your job to make sure the code you write is compatible with ALL browsers out there no exceptions! It has nothing to do with how difficult it is or what the problems are associated with achieving that goal.

And your code at the end is simply childish!

Firstly, breathe. Once you've caught your breath and stopped your nose bleed take the carrot out of your anal cavity.

How is you referring me to a Wikipedia article and demanding that I "justify my statements" not a challenge?

The fact is, you have little to no knowledge of why this is a major thing for web developers.

How can pasting a code snippet be childish!? Learn from it and move on. If you had known that code, you wouldn't have blindly argued the point in the first place or DEMANDED justification because Mr high and mighty despises it when blah blah blah...

Today is a big day for us developers that have been around for more than 5 minutes, if that's okay with you!?

 

[Geoff.D]

You can't be a developer...

There is this concept called "standards" - something IE has never been good at following.

Have you not read the MyBB manual? IE bashing is a requirement for membership!

Firstly, breath. Once you've caught your breath and stopped your nose bleed take the carrot out of your anal cavity.

How is you referring me to a Wikipedia article and demanding that I "justify my statements" not a challenge?

The fact is, you have little to no knowledge of why this is a major thing for web developers.

How can pasting a code snippet be childish!? Learn from it and move on. If you had known that code, you wouldn't have blindly argued the point in the first place or DEMANDED justification because Mr high and mighty despises it when blah blah blah...

Today is a big day for us developers that have been around for more than 5 minutes, if that's okay with you!?

I do not have to learn from it all. I am more than aware of what it means. As well as the completely in my opinion unacceptable attitude of developers in their bias against IE and for that matter other browsers.

My interest in this matter actually started when the now infamous WIN 10 upgrade took place, which "forced" an upgrade to IE11. Out of the blue some sites which work (and still do) when accessed via IE 9/10, now show up all sorts of problems.

Taking this up with that specific very large corporate got back the answer " IE does not adhere to standards, so we cannot guarantee that accessing our websites with IE will work. We suggest you use Browser xx" but IE 9/10 works not IE 11. Basically the answer back was that they will look into it and that is the last ever heard from them.

The second event started in May 2015, when another very large corporate undertook a major " re-write" of their websites ( still on going).
Then IE8/9/10 which used to work perfectly well, now started to generate dozens of errors. Again dealing with that company's web developers generated the same snide remarks "IE does not adhere to standards, therefore blah blah. We suggest you switch Chrome as our websites have been full tested to work with Chrome".

The third incident is even older. Quite a few Government websites have the cheek to post on their websites statements such as " This website has been fully tested with browser xx, and we cannot guarantee that accessing this site with any other browser will work".

The net result is I started running tests on the websites (W3C and HTML Working group HTML5 tests), which I then sent to those corporates. In the one case over 50 000 errors, violations and warnings were listed by the tests.

The answer that came back and I quote, "Some of these have merit to be fixed, especially the duplicate id’s. An updated html report can be found here {detail deleted}.

That said, browsers are incredibly forgiving and the validator very strict, and unless it is breaking something it’s probably not a high priority."

However one useful piece came out of the response which I took seriously, and that was to look backwards to see why some pages worked with browser X and not with browser IE 11. Hence why I got very interested in browser evaluations such as those to be found at http://html5test.com/

Every time MS does an update ( the last 2 were days apart, both affecting IE 11) various tiny things stop working on the two sites I have referred to before, and I have to chase them down and change settings to get those sites to work reasonably with IE 11. the same applies to the latest version of Chrome!

What does that tell me as a layman interested in the results not in becoming a developer about the developer profession in SA??

Well this is what my opinion is at the moment seriously reinforced by your attitude.

(1) They are arrogant
(2) They are not masters of the technology they claim to be.
(3) They are not interested in hunting down and fixing errors even when shown what the effect these errors are having on users out there.
(4) They are not prepared to accept criticism.
(5) They are unprofessional.

 

[letslogic.com]

I do not have to learn from it all. I am more than aware of what it means. As well as the completely in my opinion unacceptable attitude of developers in their bias against IE and for that matter other browsers.

My interest in this matter actually started when the now infamous WIN 10 upgrade took place, which "forced" an upgrade to IE11. Out of the blue some sites which work (and still do) when accessed via IE 9/10, now show up all sorts of problems.

Taking this up with that specific very large corporate got back the answer " IE does not adhere to standards, so we cannot guarantee that accessing our websites with IE will work. We suggest you use Browser xx" but IE 9/10 works not IE 11. Basically the answer back was that they will look into it and that is the last ever heard from them.

The second event started in May 2015, when another very large corporate undertook a major " re-write" of their websites ( still on going).
Then IE8/9/10 which used to work perfectly well, now started to generate dozens of errors. Again dealing with that company's web developers generated the same snide remarks "IE does not adhere to standards, therefore blah blah. We suggest you switch Chrome as our websites have been full tested to work with Chrome".

The third incident is even older. Quite a few Government websites have the cheek to post on their websites statements such as " This website has been fully tested with browser xx, and we cannot guarantee that accessing this site with any other browser will work".

The net result is I started running tests on the websites (W3C and HTML Working group HTML5 tests), which I then sent to those corporates. In the one case over 50 000 errors, violations and warnings were listed by the tests.

The answer that came back and I quote, "Some of these have merit to be fixed, especially the duplicate id’s. An updated html report can be found here {detail deleted}.

That said, browsers are incredibly forgiving and the validator very strict, and unless it is breaking something it’s probably not a high priority."

However one useful piece came out of the response which I took seriously, and that was to look backwards to see why some pages worked with browser X and not with browser IE 11. Hence why I got very interested in browser evaluations such as those to be found at http://html5test.com/

Every time MS does an update ( the last 2 were days apart, both affecting IE 11) various tiny things stop working on the two sites I have referred to before, and I have to chase them down and change settings to get those sites to work reasonably with IE 11. the same applies to the latest version of Chrome!

What does that tell me as a layman interested in the results not in becoming a developer about the developer profession in SA??

Well this is what my opinion is at the moment seriously reinforced by your attitude.

(1) They are arrogant
(2) They are not masters of the technology they claim to be.
(3) They are not interested in hunting down and fixing errors even when shown what the effect these errors are having on users out there.
(4) They are not prepared to accept criticism.
(5) They are unprofessional.

Don't sweat the small stuff. Have a great weekend

 

[j4ck455]

In summary, (a) Intranet Exploder versions 8, 9 and 10 have been abandoned and disowned by their creator (Microsoft) which has warned that continued use of these versions represents a major security risk for people that continue to use them; (b) along comes a lone voice on MyBB saying that there is nothing wrong with Intranet Exploder and we must all STFU about how bad Intranet Exploder is.

Each to their own.

 

[Thor]

There is nothing wrong with IE! It works!
So there is no logical and justifiable reason for anyone to attack it and those that use it.
Under windows 10, IF you want to stick with a MS product, then the choice at the moment is IE 11 (for use on websites that require the use of extensions and add ons) and MS Edge, which does not support extensions and add ons.

Each to his own, if you do not have a real contribution to make to this thread then refrain from commenting.

It's doesn't work.

 

[Geoff.D]

In summary, (a) Intranet Exploder versions 8, 9 and 10 have been abandoned and disowned by their creator (Microsoft) which has warned that continued use of these versions represents a major security risk for people that continue to use them; (b) along comes a lone voice on MyBB saying that there is nothing wrong with Intranet Exploder and we must all STFU about how bad Intranet Exploder is.

Each to their own.

IE has been a staple browser for many thousand of people the world over. MS have not abandoned IE below IE 11, they have simply stated support is no longer available. There are quite a few Corporates in SA that still insist on the use of IE 8/9/10 internally within those corporates, and at least 2 large corporates actively say that their website must be accessed with these versions.

If a user out there is actively involved with those corporates he has no choice then about what he has to use, until those corporates move on.

No where have I stated that IE has no issues. Indeed I have stated show me a perfect browser, and I have pointed out I use specific browsers for specific sites because those browsers work better on those sites.

 

[Geoff.D]

It's doesn't work.

And that is just outright rubbish! IE works with most websites IF those websites are written correctly. It is just lazy programmers that do not make their websites code work with IE or any other browser for that matter.

Take any website you like, run the W3C and HTML working group tests and see how many errors, violations and warnings are generated. Then access those websites and run debugging tools available on your browser and correlate the errors reported with what you find and almost always, you will see it is the code that is the problem, NOT the Browser per se.

But why am I telling developers how to do their work? I am just a layman that is fast learning everything there is to know about html5 code.

The argument is always, "does not comply with standards" But IE 11 is according to the evaluation site the most compliant version yet and better than many browsers out there.

I am accessing MYBB from IE 11 and I have NO issues with MyBB at all. So that shoots your blanket "It's (sic) doesn't work" down in flames.