Microsoft ... you just plain suck

[diabolus]

Just btw, there is alternatives to Microsoft Antispyware. I'm using Trend-Micro's Antispyware [not free, but can evaluate]. Does the same thing and since i have PC-Cillin as my Antivirus it works well together too.

Anyway:
http://www.trendmicro.com/en/products/desktop/as/evaluate/overview.htm

 

[Darth Garth]

Linux Operating Systems have everything that a Windows office machine requires - groupware (email, calendar, etc.), advanced word processing, web browsers, networking capabilities.

I care more about consistency and ease of use and desktop integration than the availability of such software areas where KDE and GNOME both lack.

 

[Skint]

Gah, good thing I chose to stay with GIANT when M$ bought them out.

 

[Clipse]

I care more about consistency and ease of use and desktop integration than the availability of such software areas where KDE and GNOME both lack.

consistent it is, no major advances is made just nicer graphics. Ease of use? We live in the 21st century, seriously you cant tell me that is the only reason you use something? It helps to not just pause at one stage and learn something new, to see really know the other options.

Its rare that you will find someone prefering unix above windows, that doesnt have prior windows experience/knowledge. But you seem to get alot of windows users, with no unix experience and judging it.

 

[mikkelz_za]

Just choose to remove it instead of ignore it?

 

[Darth Garth]

consistent it is

Gnome vs KDE ... I rest my case.

We live in the 21st century, seriously you cant tell me that is the only reason you use something?

It is computers for the masses and not the 3l33t.

 

[bb_matt]

KDE or Gnome are quite capable of being user friendly and in fact they are.

Unfortunately, geeks seem to think of it more in terms of themselves rather than your average user.

How many of you have been "system support" for a large or small office of people ?
I've done it for about 8 years, not as my job, but in my geek capacity - because I'm the guy who knows computers.

Let me tell how user friendly windows is for the average person - NOT AT ALL.

If one little thing happens out of the ordinary, such as a system crash, or a pop-up box asking the user to do something more advanced than pressing "Yes" or "No", people freeze - they don't know what to do.

They call the geek "Help, my computer won't print !"
"Help, my computer just popped up a box saying 'invalid wotzit on 000xDDDEAA'"
"Help, my Word just lost it's tools"

the list goes on - I know anyone who has been support will back me up on this.

My point is that it's a MYTH that windows is user friendly - it's just familiarity which fools people into thinking it is.

I challenge a windows user to try MacOSX for the first time - it's going to take you a while to figure out all the small little nigglies in the OS that you need to get used to, right from "how do I eject the CD ?" to "Where's the network neighbourhood gone ?"

People love to whine rather than to embrace and understand, I guess it's just a lot easier to diss something and forget about it ...

 

[Clipse]

Amen bb_matt, I call them lazy.

Gnome vs KDE ... I rest my case.

It is computers for the masses and not the 3l33t.

Sorry, I never knew that you had to be 31337 to learn something proper. Brain dead comments tibby.dude.

 

[Darth Garth]

Let me tell how user friendly windows is for the average person - NOT AT ALL.

As compared to Linux ... recompiling a kernel to make you LAN card work ???.
How very amusing bb_matt.

 

[bb_matt]

Yes, amusing isn't it tibby. Here you go again with your snide little remarks.
Would you please ask Joe Average to install windows onto a blank hard drive ?

Oh, ok, thought not !

Your a bit clueless and not really that nice a person either.

 

[Darth Garth]

Would you please ask Joe Average to install windows onto a blank hard drive ?

So the millions of Windows 98SE home users sent in their PC's to Microsoft to be upgraded to 2000 or XP ???.

Only a Linux zealot would come up with such a moronic argument.

 

[bb_matt]

tibby, would you please stop insulting people and debate like an adult ?
Your debating powers seem to resort to childish attacks.

I'm not a zealot of any kind - I like windows, I like linux and I like MacOSx.
In my world, there's room for choice. I like it that way.

Back to windows and installing it.
An upgrade is not a fresh install.

I don't know why I have to point this out, it's so blindingly obvious, but your average person would find it immensely difficult to install either Linux or Windows from scratch.

Almost all people who use windows, got their computer with windows pre-installed on it. That is fact, there is no denying it.

The blindingly obvious conclusion here is that it doesn't matter about the installation of the OS, but the use after install.

 

[Clipse]

As compared to Linux ... recompiling a kernel to make you LAN card work ???.
How very amusing bb_matt.

There is a reason why Ubuntu is doing so well allready, all of this and more has been made just as good as windows. Do yourself a favour and check it out, Mr. No ****all. Its only the 31337 distros that you would require to do that and only if you recompiled it from the start to have minimal driver support. Refer a bit to the linux 2.6 kernel and show me just why you would need to recompile for your lancard? ****ing retard.

Funny enough, Im a bsd user and I have to say this, when it comes to linux and ease of use for home users, debian based(very secure) Ubuntu linux is really a excellent home/office workstation solution. Yet again, if you dont know what the **** your talking about, please dont waste time posting brain dead comments.

If ubuntu of all distros is to difficult to use for you, Well then I rest my case, stay with windows and waste your money.

edit: haha this is hilarious, just after making this post a lady phoned me, asking to reinstall her Windows XP since its causing havoc. wahaha, I predict its some worm. I should give tibby.dude's phone number to her, to convince her its straight forward, just click.

 

[pookfuzz]

The Mac has a big cd eject key on the keyboard. Can’t get much easier than that and on windows most people just press the button on the front of the drive.

On kde how would this work? Press button on front of drive a mysteriously nothing happens, not exactly what I would call intuitive. You have to go unmount the disk first.

How about copy and paste? Copy from KDE app but want to paste into an Xlib app. Oh dear, again nothing happens.

There are so many things that people take for granted on windows, and the Linux advocates try not to think about.

Perhaps if you are so confident in KDE/Gnome being suitable replacements you should reload your entire office with them, then one month later ask the users if they would like to go back to Windows. You suggest others do the same, so why not include yourself?

My guess is somewhere in the back of your mind is a little voice that tells you this would be a bad idea....

 

[bb_matt]

My guess is somewhere in the back of your mind is a little voice that tells you this would be a bad idea....

Your guess would be wrong.

If you follow my line of discussion in this forum, I indicated that any OS is a learning experience. Yes, KDE and Gnome have a lot of little nigglies that you have to work around and I'll agree that they have more than windows, but that doesn't mean they are worthless.

I fail to understand the logic of dismissing something that shows promise.

I also fail to understand this "us vs. them" concept about operating systems - surely there's space for them all ?

Don't you like a multi-flavoured, multi-faceted world ?
I certainly do.

 

[-toady-]

*Let me tell how user friendly windows is for the average person - NOT AT ALL.

If one little thing happens out of the ordinary, such as a system crash, or a pop-up box asking the user to do something more advanced than pressing "Yes" or "No", people freeze - they don't know what to do.

They call the geek "Help, my computer won't print !"
"Help, my computer just popped up a box saying 'invalid wotzit on 000xDDDEAA'"
"Help, my Word just lost it's tools" *

mea culpa

WretchedToad

 

[pookfuzz]

I do not dismiss it has having no value, simply as having little value to the end and user at this point in time. This will of course change as product improvements are made.

What I am trying to say is do not burden your users with your own agendas. I am always interested in trying out new OS's but that is because if find them intrinsically interesting, this is not so for the average user, they do not care how elegant the TCP stack is or how efficient the file system is. All they care about is if they can do what they need to.

I agree, there is space for many operating systems, however they all perform a certain function and are suited to different kinds of users.

 

[bb_matt]

*Let me tell how user friendly windows is for the average person - NOT AT ALL.

If one little thing happens out of the ordinary, such as a system crash, or a pop-up box asking the user to do something more advanced than pressing "Yes" or "No", people freeze - they don't know what to do.

They call the geek "Help, my computer won't print !"
"Help, my computer just popped up a box saying 'invalid wotzit on 000xDDDEAA'"
"Help, my Word just lost it's tools" *

mea culpa

WretchedToad

Thankyou WretchedToad !

You have succinctly proven my point that windows is not User Friendly unless your a Geek. It's a learning experience and when something goes wrong, people panic.

When my car conked out the other day, I was lost.
I can handle a flat tire or battery, but something went wrong with "the jets", which I presumed were fuel jets and I was stumped.

I'm not a car geek. I couldn't fix it, I didn't even know where to begin.

 

[bb_matt]

What I am trying to say is do not burden your users with your own agendas. I am always interested in trying out new OS's but that is because if find them intrinsically interesting, this is not so for the average user, they do not care how elegant the TCP stack is or how efficient the file system is. All they care about is if they can do what they need to.

Your saying exactly what I'm saying in effect, but your misunderstanding my key point, that a correctly installed Linux system handed to a user does not require them to mess around under the hood.

 

[Clipse]

re: ejecting a cd, ROFL.. ubuntu and many other more user friendly linux distros has automouting/unmounting. I swear everyone making these post has no clue what their refering too or just generalising all distros.