Military force can and does defeat terror.

[BBSA]

Military force can and does defeat terror. Today's WSJ points to Sri Lanka, where the government has quietly recorded an impressive string of victories over the Tamil Tigers. The WSJ concludes with this thought:

But a political settlement is something to discuss after the Tigers have been subdued.

We recount this history at length to make a simple point: Colombo's military strategy against Tamil terrorists has worked. Negotiations haven't. That's an important reminder as Israel faces its own terrorism problem .....

 

[Slaine73]

Sometimes that is all that is understood....

 

[noxibox]

There was something approaching a settlement years ago, but both sides breached the ceasefire. If the issues that resulted in their fight have not been addressed the problem will not go away. And that is a lesson the Israeli government has yet to learn. Hamas have power because Israel is still involved in oppressing the people in Gaza. Hamas would be perfectly justified in carrying out attacks on Israel, but not randomly firing rockets into the country.

Also important as Palestinians face their terrorism problem, namely Israel. They should work smarter, get better weapons and attack Israel harder. Can't negotiate with terrorists.

 

[nivek]

http://www.dailystar.com.lb/article.asp?edition_id=1&categ_id=5&article_id=98992

 

[LazyLion]

Between the US and Israel and other peace-loving democratic nations of the West, I hope they put an end to the scourge that is radical terrorism in the name of Islam. And if it is by military force, then so be it. I want the terrorists to pay for their murderous activities.

 

[nivek]

They did address the problem, the problem is Hamas..

 

[LazyLion]

They did attempt to address the problem, the problem is Hamas..

+1 ... and other crazy murdering bazztards.

 

[Xarog]

+1 ... and other crazy murdering bazztards.

Like Israel, the US, and every other nation state out there, which is apparently justified in abusing human rights.

 

[noxibox]

"There was something approaching a settlement years ago, but both sides breached the ceasefire" was referring to Sri Lanka.

They did address the problem, the problem is Hamas..

An equal part of the problem is the lying Israeli government, Israel's expansionism and their decades of violent oppression of Arab people in the area. Guiltless they are not. Of course some people will support them no matter what.

Israel have not even begun to address the problem. Hamas is a symptom.

Hamas on the other hand are idiots. Their time would have been much better spent working on longer range, more accurate rockets. Something they could fire at areas where the members of the Israeli government hide. Those cowards apparently hide amongst civilians.

 

[Alan]

Israel have not even begun to address the problem. Hamas is a symptom.

*sigh*

Criminal is a victim mentality.

Some people never learn

 

[Slaine73]

"There was something approaching a settlement years ago, but both sides breached the ceasefire" was referring to Sri Lanka.


An equal part of the problem is the lying Israeli government, Israel's expansionism and their decades of violent oppression of Arab people in the area. Guiltless they are not. Of course some people will support them no matter what.

Israel have not even begun to address the problem. Hamas is a symptom.

Hamas on the other hand are idiots. Their time would have been much better spent working on longer range, more accurate rockets. Something they could fire at areas where the members of the Israeli government hide. Those cowards apparently hide amongst civilians.

Hey shame... At least everybody can have their own opinions, no matter how idiotic some of them are.

 

[Xarog]

Hey shame... At least everybody can have their own opinions, no matter how idiotic some of them are.

I still remember when it was "idiotic" to even entertain the idea of talking to the ANC.

 

[Slaine73]

I still remember when it was "idiotic" to even entertain the idea of talking to the ANC.

Yep and it still is, now just for other reasons.....

 

[Xarog]

Yep and it still is, now just for other reasons.....

So in other words, it turned out that negotiating with a terrorist organisation, and offering them most of the things that they wanted (democracy, the right to vote, etc.) actually resulted in a peaceful settlement and a mostly stable country.

Now I'll be the first to claim that they are wholly unfit to actually govern the country, but the point remains that we had a mostly peaceful transition of power. There was no ethnic cleaning, there was no genocide. There was no End Of The World(tm).

 

[Slaine73]

So in other words, it turned out that negotiating with a terrorist organisation, and offering them most of the things that they wanted (democracy, the right to vote, etc.) actually resulted in a peaceful settlement and a mostly stable country.

Now I'll be the first to claim that they are wholly unfit to actually govern the country, but the point remains that we had a mostly peaceful transition of power. There was no ethnic cleaning, there was no genocide. There was no End Of The World(tm).

Yep it is true. But in other places in the world we have seen that some organizations just won't listen to anything else than brute force, sometimes that doesn't even work and so in the end they have to be eliminated. It is not the solution anybody would want, but it does happen.

 

[Alan]

So in other words, it turned out that negotiating with a terrorist organisation, and offering them most of the things that they wanted (democracy, the right to vote, etc.) actually resulted in a peaceful settlement and a mostly stable country.

Now I'll be the first to claim that they are wholly unfit to actually govern the country, but the point remains that we had a mostly peaceful transition of power. There was no ethnic cleaning, there was no genocide. There was no End Of The World(tm).

Peaceful ROFL

100 000s dead is your idea of peaceful. Odd then that you get your knickers in a knot of Gaza . Zimbabwe had a comparatively peaceful transition as well then and look how that turned out

 

[Xarog]

Peaceful ROFL

100 000s dead is your idea of peaceful. Odd then that you get your knickers in a knot of Gaza . Zimbabwe had a comparatively peaceful transition as well then and look how that turned out

OK, Alan, here's your chance to show me that the ANC killed that many people. Go on, I'll be waiting.

Yep it is true. But in other places in the world we have seen that some organizations just won't listen to anything else than brute force, sometimes that doesn't even work and so in the end they have to be eliminated. It is not the solution anybody would want, but it does happen.

That didn't stop the Apartheid regime from claiming that it was a "total onslaught" and that they were facing an "existential crisis". It didn't stop the Apartheid regime from trying to sell all their brutal activities to the white minority as a struggle for "survival".

 

[Alan]

OK, Alan, here's your chance to show me that the ANC killed that many people. Go on, I'll be waiting.

ROFL you blame Bush for the 100 000s(supposed) of deaths in Iraq carried out by insurgents but not the ANC for the deaths caused by criminals here. Interesting logic there

Here I thought it was the states responsibility to safeguard it's citizens. Silly me

 

[Slaine73]

OK, Alan, here's your chance to show me that the ANC killed that many people. Go on, I'll be waiting.


That didn't stop the Apartheid regime from claiming that it was a "total onslaught" and that they were facing an "existential crisis". It didn't stop the Apartheid regime from trying to sell all their brutal activities to the white minority as a struggle for "survival".

True yes, but we are not talking about what happened here. Strangely enough there are other places in the world where worse things have happened. And yes people can claim it is a total "onslaught" and then it is not, but for them it may seem like it. That still does not change the fact that there are people that you can't negotiate with, most of the time because they don't want to or just want it their way. Now what do you do if both parties feel like that?

 

[Xarog]

ROFL you blame Bush for the 100 000s(supposed) of deaths in Iraq carried out by insurgents but not the ANC for the deaths caused by criminals here. Interesting logic there.

More reading problems :

Now I'll be the first to claim that they are wholly unfit to actually govern the country, but the point remains that we had a mostly peaceful transition of power.

Here I thought it was the states responsibility to safeguard it's citizens. Silly me

Yeah, silly you. But not because you're wrong about the responsibility, but because you can't read when I say that the ANC are unfit to be rulers.

True yes, but we are not talking about what happened here. Strangely enough there are other places in the world where worse things have happened. And yes people can claim it is a total "onslaught" and then it is not, but for them it may seem like it. That still does not change the fact that there are people that you can't negotiate with, most of the time because they don't want to or just want it their way. Now what do you do if both parties feel like that?

Go back to the source : you criticised Noxibox for raising certain points about negotiation. The Nats claimed that the terrorists could not be negotiated with, that they faced an existential crisis and that they were compelled to act as they did in order to protect the nation.

It turns out, though, that despite claims to the contrary, that the ANC was indeed willing to negotiate, and once the Nats made the right overtures, negotiations did indeed begin. In the conflict that noxibox brought up, it is again the terrorists who are willing to negotiate, and who've said as much, but it is the occupying power which claims they "have no partner for peace", that "we do not negotiate with terrorists", etc. etc.

Another fine example where violence did not work but where negotiation did was where the UK and the IRA sat down at the negotiation table and ironed out there differences.

But to be fair, it may be that there are times when negotiation won't work, but it is certainly not reasonable to claim that it doesn't work when no one has in good faith tried to make it work. And regarding the Israel/Palestine conflict, no such good faith attempt has yet been made.