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MWEB Gaming Feedback
- Thread starter Will@MWEB
- Start date
Okay so an update with mixed feelings: Here goes.
Changed the MTU settings back to default, after like 9pm the latency was awesome, 220-240ms. This is all good and well, very happy to be able to log on and see the green bar, here is the problem thou.
Being a dick like I am, I tested the account in a bunch of situations. I basically came to the conclusion that whenever the account was pushed above 20kb/s the latency jumped up as well as my latency in the cmd. How did i test it? In a 10man raid with vent. Another test I used a mod called zeroauctions to batch post glyphs, when i started posting the lag jumped up high, the mod uses about 30kb/s.
This led me to test other stuff, P2P downloads were going at 16kb/s. (which is fine i dont dl from that) News server downloads also didnt go above 20kb/s. So it does seem as if the account got throttled to 20kb/s...Is this some form of end of the month throttling or just upgrades thats still happening? I have seen other ISP's not mweb throttle accounts when users download allot (which i dont do) so i know its a pretty common practice by ISP's.
So to sum up, leveling up i have 220ms, batch posting on the AH my latency goes up. Raids my latency goes up. AV battleground only my latency goes up. Basically every time the account gets pushed to half my line speed, which is about 19-20kb/s.
Just to make this clear, a friend of mine living in PE has the exact same issue, we have talked this over. This has nothing to do with my pc/router/telkom line/exchange. Purely based on the facts that I have reinstalled my PC. Tested it on WinXP, Win7 and Vista. Had a telkom tech come out on Monday and they found nothing wrong. My exchange is fine and not overused. When i log onto the free 15gig from matrixonline, the free 1gig from afrihost, axxess prepaid or telkom account the game / downloads operates at 38.5 kb/s. Wow does not lag with any of these accounts, but they will run out eventually. Uncapped 384 should give you 38 kb/s in applications right? (im not talking P2P or massive downloads, im talking games or something like virus scan updates) Any one of them gives me max line speed.
So, question is, is it being throttled down now? Is it just because of the route changes?
Changed the MTU settings back to default, after like 9pm the latency was awesome, 220-240ms. This is all good and well, very happy to be able to log on and see the green bar, here is the problem thou.
Being a dick like I am, I tested the account in a bunch of situations. I basically came to the conclusion that whenever the account was pushed above 20kb/s the latency jumped up as well as my latency in the cmd. How did i test it? In a 10man raid with vent. Another test I used a mod called zeroauctions to batch post glyphs, when i started posting the lag jumped up high, the mod uses about 30kb/s.
This led me to test other stuff, P2P downloads were going at 16kb/s. (which is fine i dont dl from that) News server downloads also didnt go above 20kb/s. So it does seem as if the account got throttled to 20kb/s...Is this some form of end of the month throttling or just upgrades thats still happening? I have seen other ISP's not mweb throttle accounts when users download allot (which i dont do) so i know its a pretty common practice by ISP's.
So to sum up, leveling up i have 220ms, batch posting on the AH my latency goes up. Raids my latency goes up. AV battleground only my latency goes up. Basically every time the account gets pushed to half my line speed, which is about 19-20kb/s.
Just to make this clear, a friend of mine living in PE has the exact same issue, we have talked this over. This has nothing to do with my pc/router/telkom line/exchange. Purely based on the facts that I have reinstalled my PC. Tested it on WinXP, Win7 and Vista. Had a telkom tech come out on Monday and they found nothing wrong. My exchange is fine and not overused. When i log onto the free 15gig from matrixonline, the free 1gig from afrihost, axxess prepaid or telkom account the game / downloads operates at 38.5 kb/s. Wow does not lag with any of these accounts, but they will run out eventually. Uncapped 384 should give you 38 kb/s in applications right? (im not talking P2P or massive downloads, im talking games or something like virus scan updates) Any one of them gives me max line speed.
So, question is, is it being throttled down now? Is it just because of the route changes?
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This might explain why my latency varies so much on MWeb. I seem to use half line speed pretty often though 
Still have to use my unshaped capped account, which makes me a sad a panda, because mweb definitely has not fixed this issue, imo.
Still have to use my unshaped capped account, which makes me a sad a panda, because mweb definitely has not fixed this issue, imo.
Kosmik
Honorary Master
Anyone having issues loggin into BC2 this morning? I know EA have had server problems but I dunno if it's a traffic thing? Have tried with just the game running ie: shutting down all other connections but that one.
Just to clarify a few points here:
You are running mods which sometimes push up to 30KB/s through the line, while you are in game, on a 384kbps account and your expectation is that this should not affect your in-game latency at all?
Your expectation is also that while raiding with Ventrilo running, which is known to use a fair amount of bandwidth, that your latency should not be affected?
When you say the latency jumps up in these scenarios, please could you substantiate this with numbers and a proper comparative experience carrying out the same activities on the capped accounts that you mentioned.
This is a normal shaped experience for P2P traffic and should not be compared with traffic such as gaming, which is given a high level of assurance. We do not throttle based on usage and we do not apply any changes to shaping policies at certain times of the month.
Again you will have to substantiate this with numbers and a comparative experience on the other accounts you have mentioned if you would like me to consider taking this further and I will only do so if what you can demonstrate is something which can clearly be defined as an unplayable experience.
At this point the majority of the feedback I have from players on various line speeds and my own testing indicates that we no longer have a problem on our network which is affecting the WoW experience. I will continue to monitor the situation and raise any areas of concern with our networks team, but at this point without clear data from anyone still experiencing a problem I will not be pursuing the matter further.
Kind Regards
Will
I had a look at my tracert's to the US Stormrage server and they looked fine (400 ish before hitting Blizzards networks), but logging in still takes forever and I have to wait a good 5 minutes before I can actually attempt to play. I have a similar problem on an unshaped axxess account, but not on an Imaginet (SAIX based) account.
Once I'm in and playing it's a constant 500, but it feels like I'm falling foul of shaping, which would be bizarre since I'm on an unshaped account. I don't have any addons or Vent running.
Once I'm in and playing it's a constant 500, but it feels like I'm falling foul of shaping, which would be bizarre since I'm on an unshaped account. I don't have any addons or Vent running.
Hi Icarium
Unfortunately I think that considering the route to the US via Seacom that 500ms might be the best that you can expect from this. I do have a suggestion which might assist though - check your PM.
Unfortunately I think that considering the route to the US via Seacom that 500ms might be the best that you can expect from this. I do have a suggestion which might assist though - check your PM.
vinnigepiet
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just remember that you have a 384 kb line, and what is the upload...like 128kb?(dont remember
) if you use a addon in game the data does not get sent via the "game content" although its "one" packet and that is also the reason why Blizzard recommend you don't use addons because it CAN complicate issues with the game, now obviously you will say "well when i use another ISP it works fine" answer: disable all addons and see if you brows the AH if your ping goes up...also I play with MINIMAL addons and my ping is fine(for now /hold thumbs), try use something less recourse intense like Auctioneer. i am almost sure that it is the addon that is messing with your game latency
remember with addons you put more load on your line as well with the "upload" of data....
Valid Piet. I have actually been testing with a fair amount of addons loaded as I wanted to make sure I was testing a real world experience and not lab conditions and there is a noticeable difference in measured latency and throughput when they are running (I use the resource meter on Titanpanel to see how much data is being pushed around).
Wow, really, wow. Okay Will, explain to me why when using the capped accounts my latency does not take a jump and stays at about 250-300 (depending on which account i use).
You asked this : Your expectation is also that while raiding with Ventrilo running, which is known to use a fair amount of bandwidth, that your latency should not be affected?
Well my answer is **** YES. I have always played like that, when i first went over to mweb we were doing icc 10 hardmodes. Using vent then and I had 0 issues. Latency was not effected. So yes actually, I do expect it not being affected. Telkom, axxess and afrihost is not affected by this. Why should I expect Mweb to be.
You asked this : Your expectation is also that while raiding with Ventrilo running, which is known to use a fair amount of bandwidth, that your latency should not be affected?
Well my answer is **** YES. I have always played like that, when i first went over to mweb we were doing icc 10 hardmodes. Using vent then and I had 0 issues. Latency was not effected. So yes actually, I do expect it not being affected. Telkom, axxess and afrihost is not affected by this. Why should I expect Mweb to be.
just remember that you have a 384 kb line, and what is the upload...like 128kb?(dont remember
also I play with MINIMAL addons and my ping is fine(for now /hold thumbs), try use something less recourse intense like Auctioneer. i am almost sure that it is the addon that is messing with your game latency
remember with addons you put more load on your line as well with the "upload" of data....
Dont you think i should be able to use the same addons on Mweb then i use on telkom or a free account ? Well, I do.
I did however disable everything, down the the bare blizzard UI. In raids the ping still goes up when the game uses more than 20ish kb/s. This can happen even without vent in a 25man raid.
@Sillicur
Rather than become frustrated, let’s attempt to break this down logically. First I want to establish a factual basis that we can troubleshoot from I apologise for this extremely lengthy, however I feel necessary post, on Xmas eve :
General Considerations
The MWEB WoW Issue
Sillicur’s experience
I have suggested on more than one occasion that your experience might have a different cause to everyone else’s despite similar symptoms, let’s explores some of the logic behind this:
In summary:
You are reporting a gaming experience on the capped accounts of other ISPS, which by your accounts is superior to that on your MWEB one.
I can’t debate the matter with you, ADSL is a complex product and the architecture on an IPC network is different from run of the mill ADSL wholesale products. There are several factors that come into play before you reach our network that could be affecting this.
However what I would ask you to do is this: Carefully review the facts that I have outlined above and without allowing your frustration to cloud your reasoning, tell me what else I can do as your service provider to assist you with this matter?
Rather than become frustrated, let’s attempt to break this down logically. First I want to establish a factual basis that we can troubleshoot from I apologise for this extremely lengthy, however I feel necessary post, on Xmas eve :
General Considerations
- Our network routes through two central IP Connect (IPC) nodes connected to the Telkom ADSL network, One in Cape Town, with international bandwidth provided via SAT-3 and one in JHB with international provided via Seacom.
- If we talk about a problem on MWEB's network, then we are talking about anything which occurs from the entry point onto those IPC nodes onwards.
- It also stands to reason that because of this centralised architecture that a problem affecting one customer will generally affect all of them in the same manner, as was clearly illustrated by the WoW problems we've been investigating. There were clear symptoms which could be replicated and affected everyone more or less equally.
- It therefore also stands to reason that if a single customer has a different experience to everyone else on the same IPC node then it can only come down to three possible factors:
- The configuration of that customers account on our systems, which other than basic administrative issues like the wrong speed being set has never proven to be an issue.
- The infrastructure on the Telkom ADSL network between the customer and the IPC node they are connecting to.
- Another unknown client side factor, such as router or, pc configuration, or faulty equipment.
The MWEB WoW Issue
- After a lengthy period of troubleshooting we concluded to the general satisfaction of all respondents that the specific symptoms being investigated were isolated to users on our Cape Town network.
- The issue was not caused by our traffic managers (or shapers as some of you like to call them) The last bout of testing which I assisted with in the run up to the SAT-3 link being provisioned proved conclusively that bypassing them has no positive effect and we are now confident that the traffic manager configuration is giving WoW traffic the best treatment possible. In fact we ran the configuration with the traffic bypassing the managers for several weeks with no reports of any positive change by anyone present on this forum.
- Since the network changes which took place in Cape Town last Friday, provisioning SAT-3 and carrying out various other optimizations I think it's safe to say that there is no longer any element on the MWEB network, which is causing a widespread World of Warcraft latency issue.
This is borne out by my own testing , that of several other staff members who play the game regularly using various linespeeds and the feedback of several customers here, who previously all experienced exactly the same symptoms.
Sillicur’s experience
I have suggested on more than one occasion that your experience might have a different cause to everyone else’s despite similar symptoms, let’s explores some of the logic behind this:
- Largely speaking you seem to be the only customer who was routing via JHB who consistently reported a problem.
- You experienced mixed results using various MTU changes, which proved to work well for a number of other customers.
- At various times you reported problems even while using a proxy service.
- Changing the Eastern Cape routing to Cape Town, which is for all intents and purposes has moved you onto an entirely different network has still not fully resolved your issues.
- Other customers routing through this portion of our network are now reporting experiences rivalling that of expensive unshaped accounts.
In summary:
You are reporting a gaming experience on the capped accounts of other ISPS, which by your accounts is superior to that on your MWEB one.
I can’t debate the matter with you, ADSL is a complex product and the architecture on an IPC network is different from run of the mill ADSL wholesale products. There are several factors that come into play before you reach our network that could be affecting this.
However what I would ask you to do is this: Carefully review the facts that I have outlined above and without allowing your frustration to cloud your reasoning, tell me what else I can do as your service provider to assist you with this matter?
Thank you for the long and informative post. This is exactly what I needed to see, everything explained in detail. (i dont really know much about these things)
As of today when i logged on at 5:55pm the latency while posting/using mods is 100% fine, 220ms.
I will have to continue to monitor this to see if it fluctuates during different times to be 100% certain cause it should be like this all the time.
In regards to my experience with MTU changes, the changes did make it work fine like it did for the other customers, the problem was it affected other games like Bad Company 2 in a negative manner.
Just want to sum up what I did from my side:
1. Phoned telkom, got a tech to come out and tested everything on monday. The results were that my line is fine. Callout fee
2. Reinstalled my pc, used multiple operating systems and configurations.
3. Tested my router at a friends house, no issues.
4. Brought my PC to a friends house, when logging onto the mweb account at his house (he also plays wow without any issues using telkom) I still had the same issues while he was playing wow on his telkom account at the same time using router bridge mode (used my router and his)
5. Tried telkom shaped, axxess lite, axxess prepaid, afrihost 1gig unshaped, matrixonlines free 15gig with good results through all these months. (not counting the seacom outages)
6. Took off all my mods, reinstalled all the mods, used the default blizzard UI and even uninstalled / reinstalled wow.
A few things i want to point out:
1. After the big changes there have been 1-2 posts reporting bad latency in this thread. See Burn's, incu's etc's post.
2. This points to inconsistency rather than actual bad widespread latency.
3. I play wow more than most people I would guess, that means im on a much different times than you guys and I have a much higher chance to experience these bad patches of latency. Being a tank and playing ALLOT I would also be much more likely to notice these spikes than say someone standing in ogrimar looking at the latency meter.
4. Just remember that not everyone who has Mweb and plays wow also logs onto these forums and looks at this post. I do believe the bulk of people are now fine thou. I do have a friend with Mweb uncapped 384 with the same issues.
5. Today so far the latency has been wonderful. I have not changed anything in my configs that I had last night.
Conclusion:
It has been a good day latency wise, I will continue to monitor everything. As to what else you can do Will, I honestly have no clue. Yes you did a great job and the bulk of your customers now seem to be happy. The only thing i can think of to ask you to do check my account again just to make 100% sure if its on the correct speed (384) and everything is fine admin wise. Only after the holidays not even Mweb techs should work over xmas !
Well, guess thats it, thanks for your informative post, thats what i have been looking for.
As of today when i logged on at 5:55pm the latency while posting/using mods is 100% fine, 220ms.
I will have to continue to monitor this to see if it fluctuates during different times to be 100% certain cause it should be like this all the time.
In regards to my experience with MTU changes, the changes did make it work fine like it did for the other customers, the problem was it affected other games like Bad Company 2 in a negative manner.
Just want to sum up what I did from my side:
1. Phoned telkom, got a tech to come out and tested everything on monday. The results were that my line is fine. Callout fee
2. Reinstalled my pc, used multiple operating systems and configurations.
3. Tested my router at a friends house, no issues.
4. Brought my PC to a friends house, when logging onto the mweb account at his house (he also plays wow without any issues using telkom) I still had the same issues while he was playing wow on his telkom account at the same time using router bridge mode (used my router and his)
5. Tried telkom shaped, axxess lite, axxess prepaid, afrihost 1gig unshaped, matrixonlines free 15gig with good results through all these months. (not counting the seacom outages)
6. Took off all my mods, reinstalled all the mods, used the default blizzard UI and even uninstalled / reinstalled wow.
A few things i want to point out:
1. After the big changes there have been 1-2 posts reporting bad latency in this thread. See Burn's, incu's etc's post.
2. This points to inconsistency rather than actual bad widespread latency.
3. I play wow more than most people I would guess, that means im on a much different times than you guys and I have a much higher chance to experience these bad patches of latency. Being a tank and playing ALLOT I would also be much more likely to notice these spikes than say someone standing in ogrimar looking at the latency meter.
4. Just remember that not everyone who has Mweb and plays wow also logs onto these forums and looks at this post. I do believe the bulk of people are now fine thou. I do have a friend with Mweb uncapped 384 with the same issues.
5. Today so far the latency has been wonderful. I have not changed anything in my configs that I had last night.
Conclusion:
It has been a good day latency wise, I will continue to monitor everything. As to what else you can do Will, I honestly have no clue. Yes you did a great job and the bulk of your customers now seem to be happy. The only thing i can think of to ask you to do check my account again just to make 100% sure if its on the correct speed (384) and everything is fine admin wise. Only after the holidays not even Mweb techs should work over xmas !
Well, guess thats it, thanks for your informative post, thats what i have been looking for.
not too sure if this is right place....but seeing as the thread is 119 pages long please forgive me if answer is already here....
i cant update my wii and have read that it is due to mweb blocking it? what can i do to update my wii?? it keeps on reading error code 32007...
i cant update my wii and have read that it is due to mweb blocking it? what can i do to update my wii?? it keeps on reading error code 32007...
Hi Jason
There shouldn't be any particular reason why this doesn't work, we ran some tests with this a while back and were unable to replicate a problem. I would suggest that you make sure the wireless signal on the wii is good and that you don't have any local firewall blocking it. You can also try going to your myaccount settings on the mweb site and disabling protected access. If I can give you some advice in my personal capacity though, there is no good reason to update the firmware on your wii. Rather do some research and see what some of the other cool things are that you can do to enhance your experience as a wii user.
There shouldn't be any particular reason why this doesn't work, we ran some tests with this a while back and were unable to replicate a problem. I would suggest that you make sure the wireless signal on the wii is good and that you don't have any local firewall blocking it. You can also try going to your myaccount settings on the mweb site and disabling protected access. If I can give you some advice in my personal capacity though, there is no good reason to update the firmware on your wii. Rather do some research and see what some of the other cool things are that you can do to enhance your experience as a wii user.
I am using an xbox now with issues so I'll bitch here.
Ever heard of a router dropping a wired connection? I got a new xbox and was busy setting it up downloads kept on cutting it out, fsck Mweb came out of my mouth a few times, then I setup the media extender and saw that failing as well.
My router disconnects ALL connections and reconnects then. 1 month old from incredible corruption
Ever heard of a router dropping a wired connection? I got a new xbox and was busy setting it up downloads kept on cutting it out, fsck Mweb came out of my mouth a few times, then I setup the media extender and saw that failing as well.
My router disconnects ALL connections and reconnects then. 1 month old from incredible corruption
arg browsing and gaming tonight is horrible
just signed up with mweb.. ready to get cancel my sub.
I'll put my voice saying that MWEB really is doing a good job, I get great speeds(bar my router) and I get a helluva lot of downloading done while gaming(no joke) so post your specs and let's see what is wrong
Kosmik
Honorary Master
If I may, I;m a wii owner as well. 32007 error is normally a issue specific to the protocol with the wifi connection ie: bad protocol/mismatch. If you are using WES2/WPA2 you might have to drop it to version 1 as if I recall the older firmware versions did not support the newer encryption standards. Otherwise, double check your firewall on your router, your encryption key, mac locking etc.
Gtx Gaming
Gtx Gaming
mike what about posting pingtest.net result?