Not buying an e-tag?

Are you going to buy an e-tag?

  • Yes

    Votes: 7 3.9%
  • No

    Votes: 173 96.1%

  • Total voters
    180
Are you on Twitter?

You should go and add the Justice Project to your feed....
@JPSAorg

There is a lot of info there about the entire system and its shortcomings.

No I'm not on Twitter. I despise the hashtag :p

Anyway, there may well be all these shortcomings, but I cannot see that this will fall flat. They've 'invested' too much into this already. Remember, they want your money, and they will do all they can to get it.
 
Government backed initiatives can fail.

Look at the Pebble Bed Modular Reactor:

About R9,2-billion has been poured into the Pebble Bed Modular Reactor project, with 80% of the money provided by the government.

&

Employees Est. 900, reduction to 9

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pebble_bed_modular_reactor

http://mg.co.za/article/2010-09-17-sa-mothballs-pebble-bed-modular-reactor-project

I don't know what the eToll thing has cost to date, but when the funds dry up due to non-compliance it'll hopefully collapse.

I'm sure there are other such Govt 'Initiatives' that have failed- let's have some more examples to bolster confidence that this eToll thing will fail!

-Cape Town Stadium?
-Coega Bay?
 
I'm sure there are other such Govt 'Initiatives' that have failed- let's have some more examples to bolster confidence that this eToll thing will fail!

Sentech & Broadband Infraco
Gauteng Online
The previous Home Affairs ID Card system
Thousands of Shoddy RDP Houses
Golaganang eGovernment project
Outcomes Based Education
NHI National Health System (still in the process of failure)
 
Still a resounding NO from me

I like to walk into the Sanral stores and laugh at them, I've bet my brother that i will give him R1000 if we walk into a SANRAL store and there is a customer there, In all the time [Irene Village and Centurion Mall] i've been to the malls, i haven't had to pay once.
 
What about the SANRAL private police, if they stop you and check you don't have an etag you are gonna receive some personal attention that you can do without, being made an example of so to speak. Make 1000 examples people will get scared and buy etags. Will OUTA bail me out?

SCAMRAL do not have a private police force, I presume you're talking about these guys

Johannesburg - The National Traffic Intervention Unit does not have vehicles equipped to target speedsters, drunk drivers and traffic offenders - after the SA National Roads Agency (Sanral) took them away.

Sanral dropped a bombshell last week, withdrawing all its cars used by the Road Traffic Management Corporation (RTMC) officers, who fall under the intervention unit.

More than 200 traffic officers will struggle to carry out their duties because they do not have the required equipment.

The unit was supposed to target speedsters, drunk drivers and other traffic offenders.

Sanral’s massive 4x4s were fitted with a number plate-recognition system.

With this they can scan your number plate as they drive in front of you, pick up all your outstanding traffic fines and road offences, then stop you on the spot.

Sanral had provided the unit with close to 20 vehicles, but the maintenance costs have clearly become too high.

Sources have told The Star that the cars from Sanral were taken away around 6pm on Friday. They also said that in the meantime, the RTMC was going to continue using 20 cars rented from Avis.

“RTMC has extended the contract with Avis. They are also planning to buy their own vehicles. That was discussed today in a meeting,” a source said yesterday.

This comes a week after the unit’s chief, David Tembe, resigned, stating that a lack of resources to effectively discharge normal day-to-day duties, and continuous interference with operations by the chief executive, Collins Letsoalo.

He added there was a lack of support for the unit and no budget allocated to it.

When Letsoalo was contacted for comment, he said: “I can’t comment on leaked information. You guys think I report to you, but I report to Parliament.”

Asked about the withdrawal of cars by Sanral, he also refused to comment.

The traffic officers were using rented cars fitted only with blue lights and no other equipment to enable the officers to carry out their duties.

Letsoalo would not be drawn into explaining how the officers would work with only rented cars, saying: “They are supplementary vehicles.”

Howard Dembovsky, from Justice Project South Africa, said: “To me, this unit is slowly becoming defunct. It’s a crying shame. It never was an intervention unit.”

The unit lacks resources such as cars, two-way radios, handcuffs, and number plate-recognition devices to verify licences.

In a special operations report seen by The Star, the traffic officers said they needed breathalysers, more cars, torches to make them visible at night when pulling over vehicles, two-way radios to communicate and for training, pepper spray and handcuffs.

The report also said that in one of the operations, only 14 officers had three breathalysers that they had to take turns using to test motorists for alcohol levels.

The unit was formed by the RTMC to crack down on drunk driving and to reduce deaths on national roads.

Dembovsky said paying salaries of traffic officers who were unable to perform their duties was “a huge waste of taxpayers’ money”.

A huge waste of money

* On average, traffic officers earn up to R10 800 a month. The RTMC is spending more than R2.16 million a month on salaries at an intervention unit that is unable to perform its duties.

* The unit has more than 200 traffic officers.

* The unit does not have enough handcuffs and torches, there are not enough breathalysers, and no two-way radios for the officers to communicate.

* The officers also need continuous firearm and defensive-driving training.

source
 
Not sure if this has been posted here, but Justice Project South Africa (NPC) have submitted their response to the corrupt system, called e-tolling – 3 pdf’s and a very good read indeed!


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We have today submitted our comments to the Department of Transport with respect to the eToll matters published in Government Gazette 36479 of 24 May 2013. If you are interested, you may read our comments by clicking on the links below.
http://www.jp-sa.org/Docs&Media/36479_GFIP_E-Road_Regulations_JPSA_Comments.pdf
http://www.jp-sa.org/Docs&Media/36479_GFIP_Exemptions_JPSA_Comments.pdf
http://www.jp-sa.org/Docs&Media/36479_GFIP_Tariffs_JPSA_Comments.pdf
If you still wish to submit your own comments, you may do so by visiting www.outa.co.za/site/comment-to-government-on-the-etoll-tarriffs-and-regulations/, so long as you do so before midnight tonight.
Best Regards,
Howard Dembovsky
National Chairman - Justice Project South Africa (NPC)
 
At the moment there's nothing for me to give up on. I live in the Western Cape ;)
And I never used the route but will make damn sure we miss it just in case.

No I'm not on Twitter. I despise the hashtag :p

Anyway, there may well be all these shortcomings, but I cannot see that this will fall flat. They've 'invested' too much into this already. Remember, they want your money, and they will do all they can to get it.
Expecting you to pay without an invoice - check
Expecting you to pay without prove you used it - check
Expecting you to pay when someone else has your number plate - check
All things that are unconstitutional. Yes they want your money and will do what they can to get it, hence the tag. Their system simply can't cope with thousands of unidentified cars going through gantries. Giving a discount is not in their best interest but getting everyone tagged is so it's better than the alternative. In the end they want to get as many people as possible to use tags so they can deal with the few that don't. They are investing more bad money to ensure this happens but at some point they'd have to accept reality. The problem with us is this "I will do it if everyone else does it" attitude and then nobody does it because we know everyone won't where the rest of the world it's "I will do it even if nobody does it" and then most end up standing together. It's this attitude that will determine failure or success.
 
Fek, all they needed to do to raise money was increase the fuel levy. Instead, they built actual monuments to their stupidity - still can't figure out how this got past the national treasury and minister of finance (contrary to belief, those okes are not stupid)

Sincerely hope this etoll venture is colossal failure
 
Fek, all they needed to do to raise money was increase the fuel levy. Instead, they built actual monuments to their stupidity - still can't figure out how this got past the national treasury and minister of finance (contrary to belief, those okes are not stupid)

Sincerely hope this etoll venture is colossal failure
Well an international company will be profiting billions so you can bet a few thou' privately changed hands. I also don't see why Gautengers should carry all the burden. Raise the fuel levy by a cent for the entire country because everyone benefits from the infrastructure.
 
Not sure if this has been posted here, but Justice Project South Africa (NPC) have submitted their response to the corrupt system, called e-tolling – 3 pdf’s and a very good read indeed!


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We have today submitted our comments to the Department of Transport with respect to the eToll matters published in Government Gazette 36479 of 24 May 2013. If you are interested, you may read our comments by clicking on the links below.
http://www.jp-sa.org/Docs&Media/36479_GFIP_E-Road_Regulations_JPSA_Comments.pdf
http://www.jp-sa.org/Docs&Media/36479_GFIP_Exemptions_JPSA_Comments.pdf
http://www.jp-sa.org/Docs&Media/36479_GFIP_Tariffs_JPSA_Comments.pdf
If you still wish to submit your own comments, you may do so by visiting www.outa.co.za/site/comment-to-government-on-the-etoll-tarriffs-and-regulations/, so long as you do so before midnight tonight.
Best Regards,
Howard Dembovsky
National Chairman - Justice Project South Africa (NPC)

These guys are doing good work!
 
Well an international company will be profiting billions so you can bet a few thou' privately changed hands. I also don't see why Gautengers should carry all the burden. Raise the fuel levy by a cent for the entire country because everyone benefits from the infrastructure.

You'll just hear the usual refrain of why should non-Gautengers pay for Gautengers' roads. They don't seem to grasp that Gauteng is the economy's engine room and contributes about 5 times more tax than it gets allotted.
 
The long and is short is very easy to understand. If you are not going to buy an e-Tag, simply avoid all highways and do not drive underneath a gantry. If you do, you will be charged the fees and whether you pay it now or later, you will pay it. It will simply depend on whether you pay the initial fee or the initial fee along with penalties.

Sanral has asked government to bring into the act the matter of civil fees and convictions, which are aimed at people who make use of toll roads and do not pay the fee. This civil fee is likely to be implemented at the end of the year when you attempt to renew your car license. You will need to pay the toll fee, the late payment penalty as well as Sanral's civil fee.

If you still refuse, you are likely to be charged criminally and you may end up in court paying all above fees, the criminal fine and probably sit in jail for 6 months as well, as the act make provision for both a fine and imprisonment.

Coupled with this, you are also opening yourself to the Asset Forfeiture Unit of the NPA, who will not doubt to seize your assets in order to ensure that all fines are paid - if you are charged criminally. They will probably make up some BS story about you profiting from making use of toll roads and not paying the fees.

So, at the end of the day simply avoid the highways and take the longer back roads, start leaving for work earlier and come home later. That is the only option we will have if we do not buy e-Tags and pay the discounted fees.

The same thing was said about fines and that has not happened yet. The government and its parasites usually fail at implementation. The proposed laws IMO is unconstitutional. SANRAL will have legal battles for years to come.
 
I'm sure there are other such Govt 'Initiatives' that have failed- let's have some more examples to bolster confidence that this eToll thing will fail!

Sentech & Broadband Infraco
Gauteng Online
The previous Home Affairs ID Card system
Thousands of Shoddy RDP Houses
Golaganang eGovernment project
Outcomes Based Education
NHI National Health System (still in the process of failure)

LOL- there we have it.

This will hopefully be another of those.

Sterkte to you Gautengalengs- stop this rot before it spreads to the rest of the country.
 
If you must use the highways and end up paying for it (or just running up a bill you don't intend to pay), make sure to enjoy your road... take your time... 40km/h may be a bit fast for the fast lane when you're paying to enjoy the ride.
 
7 traitors so far. 4% is a little better than the last poll though so maybe there's hope. Unless... the people who already bought tags are voting no.
 
As said before, I have two e-tags, but they have been totally disassembled.
There will always be traitors/scaredy pants people, the sort that has no balls whatsoever
 
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