Our old flag

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Pitbull said:
No use in trying to convince someone they are wrong after they have been brain washed into believing the White man is bad. Africa can't and will never change .... That is just the sad fact. SA will follow ZIM till someone takes a stand and say. enough is enough. Stop crying and looking back. Retain your heritage and pull forward as a unity... Which of course will never happen
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I have been unable to understand much of the new SA - nothing seems to make sense anymore, the only thing I could take from the last 13 years is that for sure NEVER say NEVER - the future can change so quickly and in a way that you were convinced is an impossibility...people might unexpectitly unite building together at a better life with acceptance of all or they might call enough is enough ...
 
This is how I see it:

Old Flag, original country, with song:

Me, We, Us, Them,
Build, Build, Build!
Protect! Protect! Protect!
Invest, Innovate, Create, Enrich,
Charity, Charity, Charity.

The new flag, new country, new song:

Me! Me! Me!
Mine! Mine! Mine!
Gimme! Gimme! Gimme!
Possess, Rename, Take, Blame,
Destroy! Destroy! Destroy!

That is how history, if it is honest, will see this 100 years from now.
 
BandwidthAddict said:
Old Flag, original country, with song:

Me, We, Us, Them,
Build, Build, Build!
Protect! Protect! Protect!
Invest, Innovate, Create, Enrich,
Charity, Charity, Charity.
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I am not at all sure how you can claim that about a regime that suppressed and exploited the black majority, limited their education, took away all their property and movement rights, instituted job reservation and sheltered employment for their electorate, enriched themselves, lied incessantly to the population, initiated pointless military conflicts, imposed their unwanted language on everyone else.. and on... and on. Phhhtttt!!!
 
rwenzori,

The entire country was not the government.

There were plenty of private clinics and camps that helped the black ppl for free. I remember all the little tins, and raffles etc that was used to pay for some of them. The farmers also provided quite a bit of service to farm workers for free, not all were out for exploitation. Don't forget the Durban Lottery, one of the most efficient lotteries where only 5% of take went to administration and the vast majority went to charity, most of it black charities. When the black government came into power and shut down the Durban Lottery, alot of care homes and hospices had to shut down too.

The government also did provide basic care for free. Blacks did not pay income tax but they did get benefits. Most of the problems came from the black leaders that took the money granted the area and bought nice houses, cars, and sent their kids to Oxford.

The Indians took their basic package and built schools, roads, hospitals, universities etc.

(Small info about Natal Lotto changeover to national lottery: http://carteblanche.co.za/Display/Display.asp?Id=1467)
 
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Tibby:

Please reference :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bantustan and look up source for income. Blacks outside the "homelands" were "guest" workers that, although legally would have to pay income tax, were generally paid in cash and thus were insignificant compared to "white" income tax.

Even though my statement, as written, is not 100% correct, the concept is still valid.
 
Claymore said:
You may have been able to. Many others not only were not safe enough to, they were not even in a position to own bicycles.
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Not that it would help today to own one. I don't see enough kids on bicycles to warrant that there is an improvement from before. It is like being able to read, and not reading a book, you might as well be illiterate.
 
Trafeye said:
Yeah, maybe we did. What is it with people ... they make war and then become so generous after the event that they give it all away ... weird world we live in ...
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Only weird to non-westerners. As westerners, we value liberty and equality. This country was handed to the blacks on a silver platter because we had our heads up our asses with the wonderful image of mandelatopia but the reality, as usual, is a lot south of the dream.

After the second world war, the US rebuilt Japan. This was, and remains, a perfect picture of the virtues of selfishness. The US did not rebuild Japan because it felt sorry for them, it did so to build it's own economy; the fact that Japan benefited was a bonus. Now Japan is the US's best trading partner and we, the entire world, have benefited from this.

When we opened the bantustan borders, it was supposed to be a new renaissance; but it was done stupidly, without first addressing the problems inherent in primitive black culture and we have the result. Nothing more than a wet dream with cleanup on aisle three.
 
rwenzori said:
I am not at all sure how you can claim that about a regime that suppressed and exploited the black majority, limited their education, took away all their property and movement rights, instituted job reservation and sheltered employment for their electorate, enriched themselves, lied incessantly to the population, initiated pointless military conflicts, imposed their unwanted language on everyone else.. and on... and on. Phhhtttt!!!
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If you would have preferred to go to another African country, where the people ruled themselves, why did you not? Did the diseases and famines stop you? In 1990, were South-Africa a better place to live, than the following extremes Ethiopia, Rwanda?

In 1990, were South-Africa a better place to live, than Zambia, which has had independence since 1964?

Obviously, being a black South-African now and then, meant you had a better life, than the other African leaders provided for their own people. I do not deny that Aparthied was terrible, but give credit where it is due, you had food and health, compared to the rest of Africa.
 
BandwidthAddict said:
This country was handed to the blacks on a silver platter because we had our heads up our asses with the wonderful image of mandelatopia but the reality, as usual, is a lot south of the dream.
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So sanctions and State of Emergency and a worthless international currency had nothing to do with it ... the words saving your own skin comes to mind rather than benevolence.
 
BandwidthAddict said:
This is how I see it:

Old Flag, original country, with song:

Me, We, Us, Them,
Build, Build, Build!
Protect! Protect! Protect!
Invest, Innovate, Create, Enrich,
Charity, Charity, Charity.

The new flag, new country, new song:

Me! Me! Me!
Mine! Mine! Mine!
Gimme! Gimme! Gimme!
Possess, Rename, Take, Blame,
Destroy! Destroy! Destroy!

That is how history, if it is honest, will see this 100 years from now.
Click to expand...

Exactly.
 
This is a case where everyone should respect each other's personal preference. Isnt this what democracy and "freedom" is all about?
 
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