Portable Power Stations

[Mirai]

Lol. How did I defend them? I have criticised them before because of the overload issue on this very thread.

You ran the unit down to 30%? And the extra battery did not run down?

I think part of the problem could be that the battery percentage indicator is just an estimate. It is very hard to accurately gauge the percentage via a voltage reading with Lifepo4.

As an example: on a 12v lifepo4: 13.6v = 100%, 13.4v = 99% and 13v = 30%.

The battery is charged and discharged via the main unit. So the main unit would know much or long it charged and discharged it, would it not? Assuming a different unit was not used to charge it?

(The EB are not independent devices. They have to be charged and discharged via the D2).

So how does the battery inside the unit which is made up of cells know to balance the charge among all the cells? The "smart" extra battery is supposed to work as though it was additional capacity in the plastic box of the D2.

 

[Park@82]

The battery is charged and discharged via the main unit. So the main unit would know much or long it charged and discharged it, would it not?

I'm not expert but this is how I understand it: As batteries get fuller they absorb slower and there are additional losses. The temperature of cells also has an effect. The cells inside are not all 100% uniform. Cells will degrade over time. They will also lose some power when stored over time...

Additionally, how fast you discharge the cells also has an effect on the capacity that you'll get out of it.

What I'm trying to say is that I think it is more complicated than that. There are many variables. And it wouldn't be as simple as saying, we added 1kw of power and now the battery is full, we can now proceed to draw 1kw form it...

SOC calibration is an attempt to get the screen/computer in sync with the battery capacity but it is still not 100% accurate.

 

[leon.davibe]

About Ecoflow.

The South African support email is worth sh-t. I suppose either our people are asleep here or maybe they don't care so much about SA, funny Ecoflow is a Chinese company, so much for the BRICS (let it be a lesson in realpolitik and China will always choose America over South Africa.)

Anyway, here is the response from [email protected] so likely Ecoflow US support (likely also Chinese staffed)

The charging logic for the power station+ EB is that the one with the lowest voltage level will charge first then when both the power station+ EB are at the same voltage level they will continue to charge together. As for discharging the one with the highest voltage level will discharge first and till both the power station+ EB are at the same voltage level they will continue to discharge together.
Please keep in mind that the voltage level isn't displayed anywhere, so in normal cases there will be a difference between the main unit and the extra battery (about 10% or so).

If you think this is troublesome, please upgrade the firmware to the latest version.

Please also do three times SOC calibrations to check if the situation has improved. Once SOC calibration refers to setting the charging level to 100% and the discharging level to 0% on the APP, charging the unit until there is no input (200W load is recommended), and then discharging until it shuts down automatically.

So it seems that Ecoflow devices don't talk to each other. The cable has a data link in it, but it seems that the thing is not well designed or programmed and you may wear out your main unit while your spare battery idles.

No amount of firmware is gonna make different batteries with different distances from the charger ie the cable lentgh causes voltage drop so the power flows the easiest route first

Especially with lifepo4 with its flat curve in the middle

The balancers does stop charging if one hits the full stage first the other then absorbs the bulk of the charge

The same happens on diacharge too

Or that is my experience on parralel batteries

Hence why they always say make the battery cables to parralel batteries equal

 

[leon.davibe]

I'm not expert but this is how I understand it: As batteries get fuller they absorb slower and there are additional losses. The temperature of cells also has an effect. The cells inside are not all 100% uniform. Cells will degrade over time. They will also lose some power when stored over time...

Additionally, how fast you discharge the cells also has an effect on the capacity that you'll get out of it.

What I'm trying to say is that I think it is more complicated than that. There are many variables. And it wouldn't be as simple as saying, we added 1kw of power and now the battery is full, we can now proceed to draw 1kw form it...

SOC calibration is an attempt to get the screen/computer in sync with the battery capacity but it is still not 100% accurate.

Sure the capacity degrades over time of lithium too

On a charge/discharge cycle there will be almost no difference from the battery

Sure there will be losses often these devices has similar efficiency going in vs coming out

How hard you draw does not affect lithium as it does lead acid

 

[leon.davibe]

Also litium soaks up charge emoty vs full equaly fast

What can affect it is the voltage

ie they tend to charge at CC till almost 97-8% ie whatever current it is set too

It does taper off the moment it hits voltage , if that voltage is set closer to the 3.65v on lifepo4 the cv phase is actually short

ie my 5kw will charge CV for like under 5min

Sure if the charge voltage is set closer to 3.45v per cell then the cv phase gets dragged out way longer and you will see this slow charge at the end for a long period

 

[leon.davibe]

Each battery has a blancer ie so the cells in that pack will balance

And the packs will eventually balance as the bms stops one pack from charging

And the moment you start discharging they will go out of balance again since the lead length from inverter to each battery isn't the same

Anybody saying that firmware is gonna fix that is talking **** imo or has the brand religion hard

 

[leon.davibe]

Sure if the device is designed with the max external battery count in mind they would be closely balanced

Naturally first charge not

ie if the cable lentgh of the last battery is used as the norm

And each battery has a lentgh of cable to make it match, ie lets say the total distance from inverter/charger connection on furthest battery is 500mm

The mid battery is 300mm plus a 200mm cable stretch to match 500mm

And the internal battery has a distance of 100mm and spare cable squeezed in of 400mm
Making total 500mm

then yes the first time the 3batteries are used together they will charge at the same rate but the ine closest to full would stop first thanks to bms

and then the remaining batteries would charge until they are all full

then on discharge the potential would be the same as same cable length and then would run down the same rate and then be in balance until they are used without all present one charging session to full and they would be in sync again

Just my 2c

I strongly doubt these devices are built like this especially with the compact size

And yes if there was a way to limit the current each can deliver then they could be in sync too, i have no idea if this current limiting can be done on variable load ie if it is indeed possible to do this

 

[Mirai]

No amount of firmware is gonna make different batteries with different distances from the charger ie the cable lentgh causes voltage drop so the power flows the easiest route first

Especially with lifepo4 with its flat curve in the middle

The balancers does stop charging if one hits the full stage first the other then absorbs the bulk of the charge

The same happens on diacharge too

Or that is my experience on parralel batteries

Hence why they always say make the battery cables to parralel batteries equal

And you can't compensate for that by adding variable resistance say?

 

[leon.davibe]

And you can't compensate for that by adding variable resistance say?

You could but voiding guarantee to do so?

 

[Mirai]

Sure if the device is designed with the max external battery count in mind they would be closely balanced

Naturally first charge not

ie if the cable lentgh of the last battery is used as the norm

And each battery has a lentgh of cable to make it match, ie lets say the total distance from inverter/charger connection on furthest battery is 500mm

The mid battery is 300mm plus a 200mm cable stretch to match 500mm

And the internal battery has a distance of 100mm and spare cable squeezed in of 400mm
Making total 500mm

then yes the first time the 3batteries are used together they will charge at the same rate but the ine closest to full would stop first thanks to bms

and then the remaining batteries would charge until they are all full

then on discharge the potential would be the same as same cable length and then would run down the same rate and then be in balance until they are used without all present one charging session to full and they would be in sync again

Just my 2c

I strongly doubt these devices are built like this especially with the compact size

And yes if there was a way to limit the current each can deliver then they could be in sync too, i have no idea if this current limiting can be done on variable load ie if it is indeed possible to do this

That cable is very thick ergo low resistance. I don't know how much of a potential difference drop it has. But then maybe the EF2 is not suitable to have a "smart" battery. I suppose it's all just BS. They should not be selling them and instead say buy a bigger unit or buy two. I suppose as the main unit ages and the battery there goes pap, the extra battery will have higher voltage and will feed it more.

 

[Mirai]

You could but voiding guarantee to do so?

Not me. Ecoflow. The "smart" extra battery was designed to work with their product, and charge/discharge in unison, their words.

Anyway just how it is. At least their support finally responded.

 

[leon.davibe]

Not me. Ecoflow. The "smart" extra battery was designed to work with their product, and charge/discharge in unison, their words.

Yea we seldom get what we are promised

If we look at the cheaper mecers
The trolleys with lead acid has an external battery connection

The lithium models not

Maybe because lead acid has a steeper curve thus less likely to suffer from this and the same may have applied to these models

The NMC cells also has a bit steeper curve than the LFP

So maybe the design worked fine with the NMC cells but plays less nice since they switched to LFP

Just speculating

 

[airborne]

Amazing price for someone - Unboxed deal for R 8,441 - normally R14k

EcoFlow RIVER Pro 720Wh Portable Power Station - SA Plug Points​

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[Park@82]

Amazing price for someone - Unboxed deal for R 8,441 - normally R14k

​

Gone.

 

[brucebru]

I saw this power station from Enertec on special on Loot:

Enertec Megatank GP 600W Portable Power Station - SA Socket

<ul> <li>Pure Sine Wave</li> <li>Multi Safety Protection Features</li> <li>AC Charging, DC charging & Solar Charging</li> <li>Built-In LED Lamp</li> </ul> undefined

www.loot.co.za

Has anyone heard of it before? Seems a really good deal, but can't find any reviews online...

 

[Park@82]

I saw this power station from Enertec on special on Loot:

Enertec Megatank GP 600W Portable Power Station - SA Socket

<ul> <li>Pure Sine Wave</li> <li>Multi Safety Protection Features</li> <li>AC Charging, DC charging & Solar Charging</li> <li>Built-In LED Lamp</li> </ul> undefined

www.loot.co.za

Has anyone heard of it before? Seems a really good deal, but can't find any reviews online...

South African company. Looks good for the price.

https://enertec.co.za/couch/uploads...ries-portable-power-station-spec-gp448-sa.pdf

It is half the price of a River 2 Max.
It will charge a bit slow, I'm guessing it may take around 5 hours to charge it.
I see no solar input.
I see no UPS function.
Display is probably crappy.

 

[Pineapple Smurf]

I just swopped my PSDR board out under warranty
That was fun opening it up and taking it all apart
Like LEGO
Time to get shitfaced now
Cheers

 

[Park@82]

I just swopped my PSDR board out under warranty
That was fun opening it up and taking it all apart
Like LEGO
Time to get shitfaced now
Cheers

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Did you get the overload error?

Did they send you a board to swop it yourself? How so?

 

[Pineapple Smurf]

Did you get the overload error?

Did they send you a board to swop it yourself? How so?

No I was getting weird messages on the screen
For instance it told me the incoming watts was 2500 watts when i used my 1400 watt airfryer which is impossible because the charge limit on the Delta Mini is 900 Watts
Another pain in the butt error was during loadshedding the percentage would drop to 1% quicker than normal.
And then sit at 1% for over an housr until the battery was dead and then switch off.

 

[brucebru]

South African company. Looks good for the price.

https://enertec.co.za/couch/uploads...ries-portable-power-station-spec-gp448-sa.pdf

It is half the price of a River 2 Max.
It will charge a bit slow, I'm guessing it may take around 5 hours to charge it.
I see no solar input.
I see no UPS function.
Display is probably crappy.

It does mention "fast charging"... not exactly sure how that's classified though? What does PD100W mean?



Then I also see they do mention solar under charging options in the specs:



I see it's back up to R7k... but still probably a good deal.