SMS resignation can be final

[blunomore]

http://www.fin24.com/Money/Money-Clinic/SMS-resignation-can-be-final-20110412

Johannesburg - Labour law consultants warn that making loaded suggestions in an SMS such as wishing to resign could hold up in court, Business Day reported on Tuesday.

"Employees often resign, change their minds, want to withdraw the resignation, but the employer simply wants to move on," Global Business Solutions chief executive officer Jonathan Goldberg told the newspaper.

Last year, various disputes between employers and employees centred on whether employment agreements had come to an end due to resignations or dismissals issued through cellphone messages.

The consultants found that a number of cases had arisen over the past few years in which people had argued that they did not mean what they said in SMSes.

The idea that people can resign by SMS should not come as a surprise as text messaging was just another form of communication, labour analyst Tony Healy told the newspaper.

Both Healy and Goldberg agreed that poorly controlled use of technology was affecting relationships between employers and employees.

Courts were already finding that comments by staff about their places of work on social media websites, such as Facebook and Twitter, can have legal repercussions.

 

[Creag]

Interesting. I tend to agree that this is an acceptable form of communication albeit a somewhat cowardice way to tender your resignation.

the employer simply wants to move on

The employer needs to replace the employee and this can be an urgent need depending on the size of the business and critical nature of the position. If I get a message to say that my employee is resigning, then I am entitled to make necessary arrangements to move on and replace the person as soon as conveniently possible.

 

[TJ99]

This is getting ridiculous.. Seems like the courts everywhere are in a rush to appear to be "with the times" all of a sudden. But only when it suits them of course.

Resigning by Facebook, SMS'es etc is complete nonsense and should definitely not be admissable in legal situations, especially given how easy it is to steal account details (or set up fake profiles) or steal a cellphone.

If all this nonsense is acceptable as legal agreements, I should then be able to do all the tedious crap the guavamint or companies force us to, electronically as well, why do I need to go and sign all sorts of documents/agreements if I can just send a bloody SMS?

 

[Venomous]

I decided I don't like you. where do you work so I can come & steal your cellphone & help you resign?
:twisted:
(joking)

This is getting ridiculous.. Seems like the courts everywhere are in a rush to appear to be "with the times" all of a sudden. But only when it suits them of course.

Resigning by Facebook, SMS'es etc is complete nonsense and should definitely not be admissable in legal situations, especially given how easy it is to steal account details (or set up fake profiles) or steal a cellphone.

If all this nonsense is acceptable as legal agreements, I should then be able to do all the tedious crap the guavamint or companies force us to, electronically as well, why do I need to go and sign all sorts of documents/agreements if I can just send a bloody SMS?

 

[Mineer]

This is getting ridiculous.. Seems like the courts everywhere are in a rush to appear to be "with the times" all of a sudden. But only when it suits them of course.

Resigning by Facebook, SMS'es etc is complete nonsense and should definitely not be admissable in legal situations, especially given how easy it is to steal account details (or set up fake profiles) or steal a cellphone.

If all this nonsense is acceptable as legal agreements, I should then be able to do all the tedious crap the guavamint or companies force us to, electronically as well, why do I need to go and sign all sorts of documents/agreements if I can just send a bloody SMS?

agree 200%
So what if I dont like this person I work with , just need to get a hold of his cellphone sms before he knows its gone, and then before he knows it he too is gone haha.

 

[TJ99]

agree 200%
So what if I dont like this person I work with , just need to get a hold of his cellphone sms before he knows its gone, and then before he knows it he too is gone haha.

Exactly. You could go to the loo and forget your phone on the table, or your facebook profile logged in (stupid yes but it does happen), come back and don't have job anymore? WTF?

 

[blunomore]

This is getting ridiculous.. Seems like the courts everywhere are in a rush to appear to be "with the times" all of a sudden. But only when it suits them of course.

Resigning by Facebook, SMS'es etc is complete nonsense and should definitely not be admissable in legal situations, especially given how easy it is to steal account details (or set up fake profiles) or steal a cellphone.

If all this nonsense is acceptable as legal agreements, I should then be able to do all the tedious crap the guavamint or companies force us to, electronically as well, why do I need to go and sign all sorts of documents/agreements if I can just send a bloody SMS?

I disagree.

SMSes and emails can hardly be considered as something new. How long have this technology been around - in SA? Approx. 15 years?

The law constantnly evolves to keep up with developments. Why? Because otherwise these developments lead to uncertainty as far as people's legal positions are concerned.

I am totally in favour of emails and SMSes being regarded as legal forms of communication. People need to learn to think twice before putting pen to paper / thumbs to cellphone / fingers to keyboard

 

[TJ99]

I disagree.

SMSes and emails can hardly be considered as something new. How long have this technology been around - in SA? Approx. 15 years?

The law constantnly evolves to keep up with developments. Why? Because otherwise these developments lead to uncertainty as far as people's legal positions are concerned.

I am totally in favour of emails and SMSes being regarded as legal forms of communication. People need to learn to think twice before putting pen to paper / thumbs to cellphone / fingers to keyboard

Well cellphones have been around since at least 1992 (That's when my dad got his first one), so 19 years. Email, well before that.

My problem hasn't got anything to do with how new or old the technology is, it's about how formal and how accountable (i.e. did it really come from the source you think it did) it is. A letter or written contract, signed by you is quite hard to forge, whereas an SMS, or a web post, is very, very easy, as other posters have pointed out.

Yes, the law needs to evolve of course, but like I said, why can't I then buy a house by sending an SMS? For the reason I said above, among others.

 

[blunomore]

Well cellphones have been around since at least 1992 (That's when my dad got his first one), so 19 years. Email, well before that.

My problem hasn't got anything to do with how new or old the technology is, it's about how formal and how accountable (i.e. did it really come from the source you think it did) it is. A letter or written contract, signed by you is quite hard to forge, whereas an SMS, or a web post, is very, very easy, as other posters have pointed out.

Yes, the law needs to evolve of course, but like I said, why can't I then buy a house by sending an SMS? For the reason I said above, among others.

Written documents have been forged for centuries. Letters, wills, contracts, you name it. It happens VERY regularly. Why do you think the handwriting analysts are making such a killing?

Every person has to take responsibility for the unlawful use of their PCs/email accounts/cellphones. Why do you think people are encouraged to have passwords on these devices?

I find it a weak excuse if people cannot take responsibility and control of the equipment they use.

 

[noxibox]

I tend to agree that this is an acceptable form of communication albeit a somewhat cowardice way to tender your resignation.

How is it that much different to handing over a piece of paper?

 

[TJ99]

Written documents have been forged for centuries. Letters, wills, contracts, you name it. It happens VERY regularly. Why do you think the handwriting analysts are making such a killing?

Every person has to take responsibility for the unlawful use of their PCs/email accounts/cellphones. Why do you think people are encouraged to have passwords on these devices?

I find it a weak excuse if people cannot take responsibility and control of the equipment they use.

I'll be sure to remind you of that the next time someone sticks a gun in your face and takes your cellphone, or your laptop. :erm:

Of course written documents can be forged, it's just a bit more complicated (as I said). Appearing in person to hand it in, not so much, cloning technology isn't that far advanced yet.

Also, you do know how Facebook (and other similar services) work right? Anyone can create an account from anywhere pretending to be you, they don't need access to your password, any of your devices, or anything. Just your name. Even a kid can do it. Just as email addresses are easily spoofed as is done by spamming companies. Without ever having your password.

 

[Park@82]

http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/showthread.php/326127-Beware-what-you-text-SMS-resignations-can-be-final

 

[czc]

Who the hell resigns over cell phone or faqqbook

 

[diabolus]

So i can resign from my job [or get fired] via SMS, but i can't cancel my Vodacom/MTN contract via SMS ?

 

[Quest10n]

I'll be sure to remind you of that the next time someone sticks a gun in your face and takes your cellphone, or your laptop. :erm:

Of course written documents can be forged, it's just a bit more complicated (as I said). Appearing in person to hand it in, not so much, cloning technology isn't that far advanced yet.

Also, you do know how Facebook (and other similar services) work right? Anyone can create an account from anywhere pretending to be you, they don't need access to your password, any of your devices, or anything. Just your name. Even a kid can do it. Just as email addresses are easily spoofed as is done by spamming companies. Without ever having your password.

+1 I agree with you. It's just way to easy.

 

[LazyLion]

I agree that resignation should be in writing signed by the person making the resignation.
That alone should be acceptable.

 

[Quest10n]

So i can resign from my job [or get fired] via SMS, but i can't cancel my Vodacom/MTN contract via SMS ?

farkedup world we live in these days.

 

[blunomore]

I'll be sure to remind you of that the next time someone sticks a gun in your face and takes your cellphone, or your laptop. :erm:

Of course written documents can be forged, it's just a bit more complicated (as I said). Appearing in person to hand it in, not so much, cloning technology isn't that far advanced yet.

Also, you do know how Facebook (and other similar services) work right? Anyone can create an account from anywhere pretending to be you, they don't need access to your password, any of your devices, or anything. Just your name. Even a kid can do it. Just as email addresses are easily spoofed as is done by spamming companies. Without ever having your password.

You are being silly now. Let's live in reality here for a moment:

1. Do you understand the nature of crime in SA? The vast majority of it is economically motivated. In plain language, your cellphone gets stolen in order for it to be sold. The thief wants to make money from it. The thief, in 99% of the cases, does not know you from a bar of soap and could not give a rat's ass about your employment. He wants the phone/laptop because it has a monetary value. He is not gonna send an SMS from your phone to your boss.

2. Have you not paid attention to the messages SAPS has sent out a million times now? PLEASE REPORT ALL CRIMES. Once a theft of a piece of electronic equipment has been reported, and someone uses it to impersonate you, you have a valid defence. The courts are not idiots and they will take this into account on the off chance the thief resigns on your behalf

 

[Quest10n]

I agree that resignation should be in writing signed by the person making the resignation.
That alone should be acceptable.

+1
See even the people or person from District 9 agrees

 

[blunomore]

I agree that resignation should be in writing signed by the person making the resignation.
That alone should be acceptable.

You guys unfortunately have no choice but to abide by the court's decision that an email constitutes legal communication

It seems the SMS issue must still be tested in court.