The Bodybuilders Thread: Circuit II

I am not sure why you keep raising the First Law of Thermodynamics. No one is stating that energy is made up of nothing. If you look at the studies holistically, it seems reasonable that eating a whole food diet according to target macros is actually better than taking man made supplements. Whey can be insulinogenic and can mess up gut bacteria (which arguably is probably one of the most important factors of overall health). That's concerning to me. Enough to make me rather make an effort to eat better instead of picking up a protein bar or mixing a shake. The fact that my kidneys are ok is great, but that's not the issue of concern here.

My argument is about Calories in/Calories Out.

Whey Protein is just food, that's all. And it obeys the same laws as any other food.

It's not easy to eat 200g of protein; shakes help with that. And if you're trying to get an adequate amount of protein while keeping your total caloric intake low, they're affordable and low in calories.
 
Half the reason people aren't making gains is because they fixate and waste so much time overthinking things.

Lift heavy
Eat your oats
Get some sleep
Grow

It really doesn't need to be complicated. BBing isn't rocket science. Go lift people :wtf:

Yeah, that's what I believe as well. Been looking at ways to boost my recovery. My present routine is to eat fruit with anti-inflammatories (like oranges, blueberries or strawberries) and eat a protein rich meal within 90 minutes. Or if that's not possible I will snack on something like eggs, nuts or biltong. I am not a BB, but a triathlete, so my primary focus is endurance and not strength or growth.

My quest seemed simple. Then I started thinking maybe more protein is better. Then there are suggestions to get BCAAs with the shake as well and on and on and on. Then I need an electrolyte mix to replace what my body lost on long sessions. So it felt like I was trying to substitute everything my body needs with processed supplements, when I could just eat proper food instead.
 
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And this, literally the NEXT PARAGRAPH in the same article you quoted:



So my return advice to you. READ first, speak second. ;)

EDIT: Also, I did not realise that a fitness magazine theorised the first law of thermodynamics. Thanks for letting me know that bit of information.

You brought thermodynamics into it. I said that protein shakes are a waste of money.
You also lol'd at the basics of the endocrine system. What you spend your money on is your business, it's not going to stop me offering advice to people who ask.
 
You brought thermodynamics into it. I said that protein shakes are a waste of money.
You also lol'd at the basics of the endocrine system. What you spend your money on is your business, it's not going to stop me offering advice to people who ask.

Protein shakes are a waste of money if you're hitting your desired protein macros. I will happily concede this point and many other points raised. I just find that getting those macros can be a pain without the shakes.

However, that specific "study" was a load of hogwash.
 
Whoop.. hit some new PBs after what feels like ages off after an injury and some flu.

Squat: 71.5
BPress: 56.5
Row: 56.6
OH Press: 46.5
DLift: 81.5

Not bad for a 70kg 40 year old toppie :D. I'm starting to fail the OHP... I guess I should just carry on failing until I pass?

PS. I'm 6 months into the stronglift program.
 
Protein shakes are a waste of money if you're hitting your desired protein macros. I will happily concede this point and many other points raised. I just find that getting those macros can be a pain without the shakes.

However, that specific "study" was a load of hogwash.

No need to concede to anything, this isn't a personal p**ing contest lol. There's nothing to be won. And there's more than that one study regardless. My opinion isn't going to change, and yours shouldn't based on what I say either. That's the beauty of the net, everyone throws their opinion in the hat, you take what works for you and mostly do your own research. ;)
Just don't p*** all over other's opinions as if you're the last authority on something you're not, that's all.
 
Great. Keep pushing. Your OHP number in relation to bench and row is really good. (Compared to mine)
 
Whoop.. hit some new PBs after what feels like ages off after an injury and some flu.

Squat: 71.5
BPress: 56.5
Row: 56.6
OH Press: 46.5
DLift: 81.5

Not bad for a 70kg 40 year old toppie :D. I'm starting to fail the OHP... I guess I should just carry on failing until I pass?

PS. I'm 6 months into the stronglift program.

Failing is good - your body doesn't know about numbers mostly, what you want is to train to failure as often as you can. You can switch down a couple kgs until you're ready to switch up again.
 
Failing is good - your body doesn't know about numbers mostly, what you want is to train to failure as often as you can. You can switch down a couple kgs until you're ready to switch up again.

Cool.. will fail a few more times then.
 
Cool.. will fail a few more times then.

:D
There are routines that literally don't care about the numbers - just aim for x and train until failure. Then incorporate dropsets until you're picking up the pink aerobics dumbells :crylaugh:
Running the rack for shoulders will do that!
 
No whey man!
http://nutritionstudies.org/no-whey-man-ill-pass-on-protein-powder/
img-no-whey-man.jpg

For the past fifteen years, I have been closely involved with the bodybuilding industry. I have an intimate understanding of how the industry operates. In a nutshell, it is sustained by the supplement companies that sponsor the athletes who represent them. This in turn inspires fans who admire the athletes to purchase the products they represent, thus creating a cycle that drives record sales and profits, all the while potentially harming the health of many involved in the industry later on down the line.

Two of my favorite professional bodybuilders, Nasser El Sonbaty and Mike Matarazzo, recently died in their forties, likely from diet-related health issues. In all probability, their deaths were a result of too much protein consumption, coupled with the use of performance enhancing substances day after day until their organs failed. Now they’re gone. This is not a rare occurrence in bodybuilding. Though bodybuilders exercise more than the average person, the rate of bodybuilders suffering from diet-related health problems is often more common than the general American public falling ill to diet-related diseases. Clearly, there is a problem that needs to be addressed.

If there is one thing in the sport of bodybuilding that is as common as weight training, it is the use of supplements. No supplement is more widely consumed than protein powder. The powders of choice among mainstream bodybuilders are whey and casein, which are proteins derived from cow’s milk. In fact, these are the substances of choice for most protein powder consumers worldwide.
Athletes from all walks of life embrace the consumption of excess protein under the assumption that more is better. Many companies (and entire industries) have gone to great lengths to convince the public that they need to seek out high protein foods and consume as much protein as possible, without any consideration of the health consequences that accompany excess consumption. The focus on consuming large amounts of protein is so engrained in our culture, there are often warnings given out by friends and relatives of those following a plant-based diet that protein will be hard to come by without consuming animal products. That is another way protein supplements squeeze their way into the diets of citizens everywhere, through the unwarranted fear that we won’t get enough of this specific nutrient, suggesting whey and casein as plausible aids in this quest.

Years ago, I learned from Dr. T. Colin Campbell’s book, written with his son, Dr. Thomas Campbell, The China Study, that casein has the ability to turn on and turn off cancer growth simply by adjusting the level of intake of that protein. This was determined through years of clinical trials, experiments, and tests, which yielded these results, and are outlined in detail in Dr. Campbell’s research. His findings show that when casein is consumed in large quantities, cancer cells increase in size, and when there is a cessation in consumption of casein, cancer tumor cells recede.[1] I later learned that elevated levels of protein can also cause kidney damage, liver problems, kidney stones, excess fat gain, contribute to the damaging of the lining of artery walls, lead to plaque build up in arteries, result in lethargy, diminish bone density, and cause a host of other health problems. If this is truly the case, as it has been revealed by Dr. Campbell and numerous other world renowned experts who came to the same conclusions through experimentation, observation, and scientific research, why are these products consumed at such high levels? With their direct correlations to increased risk of disease, why is casein, which has been linked to illnesses such as prostate cancer, more than any other protein, allowed to be sold in stores? Why are these products even produced? After all, who needs them, besides calves?

If we have special protein powders created from cow’s milk for human consumption, it would only make sense that it must be because our society sees a very high rate of protein deficiency. But, that isn’t the case at all. In fact, a protein deficiency is almost unheard of in America and only exists in someone who does not consume adequate calories. The reason this is so, is because of the macronutrient make-up of food. Food is only made up of proteins, fats, carbohydrates, and water (and sometimes alcohol). Some level of protein is present in all foods, and in significant quantities in specific types of foods such as beans and other legumes, nuts, seeds, leafy green vegetables, other vegetables and grains. The amount of protein required by the human body (5-10% of total calories per day) is relatively low in comparison to the other macronutrients. It is therefore impossible to be protein deficient when sufficient calories are consumed. This is how nature works. In reality, most people in developed countries, including those following a plant-based diet, eat too much protein, not the other way around.[2] We clearly don’t have a health or nutritional need for whey or casein protein powders, so why are they here, why are they so popular, so common, and why is their use so infrequently questioned?

Part of the answer lies in the world of bodybuilding and the magazines, books, websites, athletes, and other individuals that feed the industry. The community that I have been part of for so long is a key factor in keeping these antiquated ideas about protein alive. It is therefore my (and others’) mission to effectively dispel these myths by showing a healthier way to support fitness goals without the use of any substances that came from a cow’s udder. As a semi-retired bodybuilder and current health and wellness advocate and multi-sport athlete, I endorse a whole-food, plant-based diet for optimal results, even when bodybuilding. I aim to put the desire for elevated levels of protein to rest by showing how a relatively low protein, whole-food, plant-based diet can support all athletic endeavors effectively and efficiently. I have achieved great results as a plant-based athlete for the past two decades, and have sought to lead by example.

If health is your goal, clearly, your answer to cow-based protein powders should be, “No whey, man.” Let’s put this into perspective. If you had to buy a clearly labeled animal-derived fat powder and carbohydrate powder at the same time of purchase as a whey or casein protein powder, would you proceed with the purchase? Or would it seem so silly to get your required macronutrients from canisters of animal by-products, the cashier at the store would raise an eyebrow and question your sanity? Consider these questions the next time you think about buying powders made from cow secretions for proper nutrition. How about eating something from a garden instead? Not only is it a much healthier choice, but fresh produce is a lot more appetizing, too.
profile_robert_14.jpg

Robert is the best-selling author of Vegan Bodybuilding & Fitness - The Complete Guide to Building Your Body on a Plant-Based Diet, and his latest book, Shred It!, available on www.veganbodybuilding.com. As A Two-Time Natural Bodybuilding Champion, Robert Is Considered One Of VegNews Magazine's Most Influential Vegan Athletes and is a Plant-Based Nutrition Certificate graduate.
 
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Whoop.. hit some new PBs after what feels like ages off after an injury and some flu.

Squat: 71.5
BPress: 56.5
Row: 56.6
OH Press: 46.5
DLift: 81.5

Not bad for a 70kg 40 year old toppie :D. I'm starting to fail the OHP... I guess I should just carry on failing until I pass?

PS. I'm 6 months into the stronglift program.

Your OHP is very good compared to the other lifts. Ohp is usually the hardest lift to progress on.
 
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