InternetSwag
Expert Member
It does! Good info ty sloot !
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The Bodybuilders Thread!
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Kloofvreter
Honorary Master
The problem is that the results are awesome, but not permanent. Some make such awesome gains, they fall into a depression when they crash (lose strength/gains) a month or two after the cycle.
RogueTr00per
Honorary Master
I'm just curious, not considering it, what does this stuff generally cost for a cycle and how long is a cycle?
And how does one get good advice on this type of thing? I would imagine you never really know if the person advising you knows what he's talking about?
Kloofvreter
Honorary Master
I can't remember prices anymore. About 10 years ago it as around R650 for 10 ampules of Sustanon, R300 or R400 for 12 ampules of Depotrone. I have no clue as to what they cost these days. Rule of thumb is with Depotrone, a shot a week for six weeks, but start off the first week with two shots. Sustanon is basically one shot every 10 days.
Deca last time was in the region of R900 for 10ml, Sus I thing was between R400-500 for 10ml. Was never a big fan of Sus, there is much better stuff out there but you will pay, depatrone is cheap and nasty but can get the job done. With sus you need to inject more frequently than 10 days for it to be effective as I think the shortest half life in sus is 3 days so you have to use that and the longest is 14 if I remember correctly.
Depending on how much you use, generally 20ml of sus and 10ml of deca should be great for 10 weeks, then you need to make sure your post cycle is in great shape.
The problem with roids is abuse, a buddy of my goes on a course once a year, when he was younger then twice. He is in fantastic shape, has two kids and medically in great condition. But then someone else who abused the stuff like I have never seen and went on stupid long courses is now in biggggg kark.
Roids dont make you big, hard work, big eating and lotsa sleep are the key factors, roids just help you recover much quicker and up your strength allowing you to work harder and longer.
most of the stuff I see floating around for a while is nomad labs, not the old single vial paki stuff.
With regards to getting supplements imported, we also ordered a whole bunch of stuff and when it got here we got told the stuff would be destroyed unless we had a permit, then we where told it was illegal. After a lot of fighting with Dr Khumalo (i think that was his name) at customes we got a letter from a friend who is a doctor and then it was released. It was just pre-workout that is sold at dischem so nothing illegal but it was a huge mission.
We get ripped a new one on supplements here in SA, I got a fright when I went to go grab some whey and saw the price of SSN, when did they get so expensive?
Depending on how much you use, generally 20ml of sus and 10ml of deca should be great for 10 weeks, then you need to make sure your post cycle is in great shape.
The problem with roids is abuse, a buddy of my goes on a course once a year, when he was younger then twice. He is in fantastic shape, has two kids and medically in great condition. But then someone else who abused the stuff like I have never seen and went on stupid long courses is now in biggggg kark.
Roids dont make you big, hard work, big eating and lotsa sleep are the key factors, roids just help you recover much quicker and up your strength allowing you to work harder and longer.
most of the stuff I see floating around for a while is nomad labs, not the old single vial paki stuff.
With regards to getting supplements imported, we also ordered a whole bunch of stuff and when it got here we got told the stuff would be destroyed unless we had a permit, then we where told it was illegal. After a lot of fighting with Dr Khumalo (i think that was his name) at customes we got a letter from a friend who is a doctor and then it was released. It was just pre-workout that is sold at dischem so nothing illegal but it was a huge mission.
We get ripped a new one on supplements here in SA, I got a fright when I went to go grab some whey and saw the price of SSN, when did they get so expensive?
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Tinuva
The Magician
Yeah a cycle is expensive, and the right way to do it, is with a doctor that knows his ****, monitoring you through-out the cycle and post-cycle. This includes taking blood samples before, during and after.
Now the posts above list cycle prices, but no post-cycle prices, and the doctor sessions you can probably take of your medical-aid.
You also need to add, that you probably going to eat like a beast while on cycle, you will be hungrier than usual, and probably eat more than usual to sustain the muscle growth that goes with the cycle, remember, because the muscles grow faster, so does the speed at which you increase your food intake. And to keep as much as possible of the gains, you need to keep that food intake high, if not higher than during the cycle, and do a proper post cycle. Post cycle can cost almost twice the price of the cycle itself.
Now the posts above list cycle prices, but no post-cycle prices, and the doctor sessions you can probably take of your medical-aid.
You also need to add, that you probably going to eat like a beast while on cycle, you will be hungrier than usual, and probably eat more than usual to sustain the muscle growth that goes with the cycle, remember, because the muscles grow faster, so does the speed at which you increase your food intake. And to keep as much as possible of the gains, you need to keep that food intake high, if not higher than during the cycle, and do a proper post cycle. Post cycle can cost almost twice the price of the cycle itself.
+1000 Post cycle, especially a decent one will start to cost, anywhere from R700 - R1500. Pregnyl, etc etc.
We used to buy chicken breast in huge quantities and got massive discount, then just packed it and stored in a freezer. Chicken, Brocoli and Rice, four times a day, oh the joys.
If done right and you maintain properly, you will keep most of your gains. I have seen first hand what can be achieved if done right and what happens if you screw around.
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RogueTr00per
Honorary Master
Yeah, so do the above consistently and for a while before even thinking about touching any roids
InternetSwag
Expert Member
Wow some really good info here, actually cheaper than I thought it was to cycle, but still out of my budget for a good couple of years.
I heard a cycle costs like R11k for 8 weeks.
I heard a cycle costs like R11k for 8 weeks.
Sensorei
Executive Member
If you're considering using steroids and are clueless at least get advice from the right place like the anabolicsteroids.co.za forum. I ended up deciding against it after seeing how the guys I trained with a few years ago were when they came off. It is a fact that even guys who use the right post cycle drugs can damage their endocrine system and fertility. It doesn't happen to most people, but it's a stupid risk to take when you're young with decent testosterone levels. You can build a great physique if your diet is right. Guys are often just too lazy to eat right so they do steroids.
InternetSwag
Expert Member
Thanks for the URL, more advice/info can never hurt.
Though personally I feel that I've got a long ways to go before I could cycle (not just financially) I mean there's a lot I want to still do with my body before I take that leap.
Want to at least learn how to cut properly (since I never have before), want to get really good at Squats and Deadlifts and I want to be able to Bench Press 120 kg's naturally! Should turn some heads.
But that's all just mah opinions.
I'm surprised I found so much quality posters about aas on a broadband forum.
Like the guys have said, there is normally no need for roids, you can achieve fantastic results naturally by eating right, resting and working hard, there is no substitute for those three things.
If you are not seeing gains, you are doing something wrong, juicing is not giong to fix that, yes it will help you grow, yes you will see strength gains but at the end whatever you are doing wrong will show when you finish your cycle.
I missed a couple weeks of gym and one of the guys I see there rather often that got big really quickly has shrunk just as quickly, very noticeable. You dont want to be that guy
That is a good attitude InternetSwag. The problem with roids is it boost your power so much that you might end up pushing 70% heavier than before- but the white and soft tissues and ligaments around your muscles are not used to the heavier weight, and something must give in or collapse- and that is where injury comes in. In Afrikaans: Iets moet meegee.
You should be a regular attendee to the gym for at least a year, with body fat around 12 - 15% to experience the most out of a cycle.
All steroids are medicine and most were designed to treat people first(like people experiencing weight-loss from aids, burned victims that experiencing muscle loss etc) and it is the high dosages that bbuilders use that gave it a bad name. That is where the abuse comes in.
I believe there is a place for it if you do your homework and depending on your goals, but I don't agree with the high dosages on all the forums. And it is definitely not a quick fix.
The part after the cycle is called PCT, or Post Cycle Therapy. This is more important than most guys recognize as this needs to kick start your nut factory again and ease you out of your all high Test boost, gradually. Your Test factory slows down a bit while on cycle as there are too many free flowing Testosterone, so they take a bit of a break. That is the only thing that might shrink while on cycle - your nutsack. Because they don't need to work.
The PCT flips the switch back on again and will boost your natural Test levels to maximize again. But guys who abused the dosages on cycle sometimes have problems switching back on again, and they might need to do a 2nd PCT. But that is only because of the abuse. This will lead to Erectile dysfunction.
Safe dosages are key. Lee Priest was in SA about two to three years ago and he said in the Muscle Evolution that some of the SA okes asked him what he uses and at what dosages. He said he is using Deca and Testosterone Cypionate, and the dosages he mentioned (cant remember exactly) was only half or less of what is suggested on some forums. They guys said he is full of "sh*t" and he explicitly stated that he doesn't have anything to gain by lying to them. I believe him. Schwarzenegger and them all used very moderate dosages.
Electric
Honorary Master
Like the guys have said, there is normally no need for roids, you can achieve fantastic results naturally by eating right, resting and working hard, there is no substitute for those three things.
If you are not seeing gains, you are doing something wrong, juicing is not giong to fix that, yes it will help you grow, yes you will see strength gains but at the end whatever you are doing wrong will show when you finish your cycle.
I missed a couple weeks of gym and one of the guys I see there rather often that got big really quickly has shrunk just as quickly, very noticeable. You dont want to be that guy
Why are you looking at his genitals?
Has anyone ever experience joint pain on Creatine? I've done a quick google search, and there are quite a few results, but the immediate response on forums is its not possible.
I was suffering terribly from joint pain in 2012 and 2011 (while using creatine) - this year I haven't touched it, and on Monday I started loading - yesterday and today (especially today) - I have serious elbow pain, today it almost brought me to tears. So I'm wondering if it might actually be Creatine.
Yesterday, and today was chest.
Its definitely not a hydration.
I was suffering terribly from joint pain in 2012 and 2011 (while using creatine) - this year I haven't touched it, and on Monday I started loading - yesterday and today (especially today) - I have serious elbow pain, today it almost brought me to tears. So I'm wondering if it might actually be Creatine.
Yesterday, and today was chest.
Its definitely not a hydration.
Hey bud
I have experienced joint pains with high levels of Creatine and Protein in my knees and feet. Almost like a gout pain.
What dosage are you taking for your loading phase?
Tinuva
The Magician
I personally never had joint pain with creatine...but then again I stopped using it as it never seemed to help me much. Protein shakes or just eating enough protein always helped me more, for recovery and gains imho.
Are you having problems with acid or re-flux bud? I started using an anti Acid (Alka Plus) and my joint pains are gone. I have not done the research yet to see if Creatine can cause more acid in the body, but that is my 5 cents at this stage.
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