The Madeleine McCann Missing Thread

Do you think Madeleine McCann died in the family's holiday apartment?

  • Yes

    Votes: 116 60.7%

  • No

    Votes: 75 39.3%
  • Total voters
    191
This Amaral fellow is a real piece of work -

http://abcnews.go.com/TheLaw/story?id=3646987&page=3

If the beating charges turn out to be true it will hurt the McCann investigation, according to Roy Ramm, former commander of special investigations at Scotland Yard. Ramm told ABC News: "This is not something you would expect to find in the U.K. When someone has allegations of falsifying evidence and beating a witness and these are very serious allegations -- it does not bode well for the case."
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http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-st...rst-at-kate-and-gerry-mccann-115875-21965534/

Disgraced detective Goncalo Amaral yesterday let rip at Kate and Gerry McCann with a foul-mouthed outburst.

The former policeman was asked if his book about their daughter Madeleine was hurting the couple when he barked: “No, f*** the McCanns.”

Amaral then laughed as he walked off.
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And we are expected to accept his impartial investigation results ? Pffft.
 
blunomore said:
I am not disputing your theory entirely, but what I found interesting in missing persons cases, is that in a fair amount of the cases where the missing person turned out to be killed by a family member or someone they knew, that person (the killer) launches a campaign to seek assistance in finding the "missing person" or the killer. I am immediately thinking of the US cases of Susan Smith and Scott Petersen.
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Indeed and a fair point. But evidence to the contrary usually nips their stories in the bud which is not the case here.

3 disappearances of under tens in a 7 mile radius, bodies never found ? Coincidence maybe, but enough reason to consider a link.
 
MidnightWizard said:
Well no wonder the Wests Intelligence agencies are a bunch of useless morons.

It is all those "chancy" lie detector tests they have to undergo all the time.

Beats me , if it is all a load of old ****e , WHY they continue with it , and why it is absolutely essential in keeping your job.

( Refusal to undergo the test are grounds for termination of service )


MW
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Let's look at Israel:-

The High Court of Israel, in Civil Appeal 551/89 (Menora Insurance Vs. Jacob Sdovnik), ruled that as the polygraph has not been recognized as a reliable device, polygraph results are inadmissible as evidence in a civil trial. In other decisions, polygraph results were ruled inadmissible in criminal trials.
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Has anyone ever challenged termination of service for refusing to take a polygraph test ?
 
marine1 said:
I still think the parents are hiding something.
How can a child disappear like that even after the whole planet is looking for her?
Sounds to suspicious to me.
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If they were responsible then the question to ask is

'how did they make her disappear without trace even after the whole planet looked for her ? '.
 
I am seriously undecided. I really do not know what happened to her.

Good points made from both sides.

What bothers me is. Did the Portuguese police just decide they will shift all focus to the McCanns and what was their reason to do so? Surely they had a very good reason.

"Waar daar 'n rokie trek, is 'n vuurtjie" but like Daveza keeps mentioning. Surely there should have been even the smallest piece of evidence that will be able to stick and without any doubt link them to the disappearance.

I just hope the truth will prevail one day.
 
who remembers the story of a little girl who was abducted out of her room in a block of flats whilst a family member went to the cafe? this was in Kuilsriver many years ago and there was no trace of the girl.

now tell me how its possible for someone to do that without anyone seeing? the timing of the event could not have been random thing because unless you knew the layout of the flat and the amount of time it would take a person to go to the shop and buy something and then come back there would have been a strong chance of getting caught.
 
The only thought I have in the McCann case and the Kuilsriver case is that the child woke up, found the door locked and used the window to exit in order to find the parent - as opposed to someone entering through the open window.

Except.... in the McCann case apparently the front door was not locked but perhaps difficult enough for a small child to open.
 
PeterCH said:
Yep, it would be great if that poor kid emerged alive and well one day.
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I think in this case(all the publicity etc) it would be a miracle.

But I have read a few stories about children being found up to 20 years later and being reunited. Either locked up in the house and being raped/abused or living a complete life but under the illusion that it is with their real parents that love them.
 
daveza said:
The dogs were used 3 months after Madelaine went missing.

The 'strike rate' is not 100%

They detected ' a cadavour odour '. Whose cadaver ? Is it not possible to ' place ' cadaver odour ? We are all aware of ' planted ' evidence.

I'm not surprised this hasn't ended up in court. A first year law student would put more holes in their case than a Brakpan stop sign.
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These are the two top dogs in the world. They are not the normal run of the mill cadaver dogs.

Cadaver dogs - Some dogs are trained in detecting the odor of decomposing bodies. Dogs' noses are so sensitive that they are even capable of detecting bodies that are under running water[11] Pioneering work was done by Dr. Debra Komar (University of Alberta) in Association with the RCMP Civilian Search Dog Association in this area. The result was the development of training techniques that resulted in near 100% accuracy rates.[12] Her research has been published in the Journal of Forensic Anthropology.
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And
http://www.pawsoflife.org/pdf/Library articles/carpet squares.pdf
The most comprehensive study published to date.

The results of this study indicate that the well-trained cadaver dog is an outstanding tool for crime scene investigation displaying excellent sensitivity (75–100), specificity (91–100), and having a positive predictive value (90–100), negative predictive value (90–100) as well as accuracy (92–100).





Food for thought.
 
Food for thought yes, but still around a 10% failure rate.

I would presume that this figure is on a fresh scent, not 3 months old, and they are not able to detect whose cadaver they are detecting.

An ' odour ' was detected in the hire car, which by it's description has hundreds of users. Nowhere can I find a window of opportunity between the time the family left for dinner and the arrival of the investigators wherein the McCanns could have stuffed a body in the boot, driven it away and disposed of it so well that it was never found.
 
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the kuilsriver case was over 10 yrs ago and from the reports that were given at the time the whole saga sounded fishy.
 
daveza said:
This Amaral fellow is a real piece of work -

http://abcnews.go.com/TheLaw/story?id=3646987&page=3



http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-st...rst-at-kate-and-gerry-mccann-115875-21965534/



And we are expected to accept his impartial investigation results ? Pffft.
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No You got that wrong. He was misquoted.;)


In fact, he said: ’Não, força aos McCanns’, which translates as ‘No. Good luck to the McCanns’.
We have been in touch today with BBC East Midlands, the BBC, the Mirror and the Sun and other newspapers in an effort to ensure that they apologise for ths serious slur on Goncalo Amaral.

We are getting hints that there may be an apology; we shall soon see.

Our letter which has of course been copied to OFCOM and the Press Complaints Commision is below.

Tony Bennett
Secretary
The Madeleine Foundation
— On Thu, 14/1/10, ANTHONY BENNETT wrote:

From: ANTHONY BENNETT
Subject: LISBON: Amaral said LISBON: Amaral said ‘Não, força aos McCanns’, Not ‘F___ the McCanns’, Not ‘F___ the McCanns’
To: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
Cc: [email protected]
Date: Thursday, 14 January, 2010, 17:43

Dear Emma Agnew – Editor BBC TV East Midlands
Dear Editor – The Sun
Dear Editor – The Daily Mirror
COPIES TO:
OFCOM
Press Complaints Commission

From Tony Bennett, Secretary. The Madeleine Foundation

LISBON:
Amaral said ‘Não, força aos McCanns’, Not ‘F___ the McCanns’

I refer you to conversations with Fiona at BBC East Midlands this afternoon and also with James in the ‘Daily Mirror’ news room.

I am attempting to contact other media and TV and press who have published this disgraceful allegation against Goncalo Amaral.

This complaint is copied to OFCOM and to the Press Complaints Commission as a formal complaint to those bodies about the serious defamation of Mr Amaral by many media and newspapers..

Our friends in Portugal have told us that Goncalo Amaral, who does not speak English, did not say ‘F___ the McCanns’ as incorrectly reported first by BBC East Midlands TV, then by the BBC nationally, then by the Daily Mirror and The Sun,the Daily Mail and several other British newspapers.

His actual words, in Portuguese, were .”Não, força aos McCanns”, which our Portuguese friends tell us means: “No. Good luck to the McCanns”.

We would expect the most wholehearted and fulsome apology from all those who have libelled Mr Amaral in this way. We believe that OFCOM and the Press Complaints Commission should take a proactive role in ensuring that all the media who have printed this disgraceful lie are made to publish an apology of equal prominence.

We would add that the continued portrayal of Mr Amaral as a ‘disgraced cop’ is wholly inaccurate. It was he and his detective colleagues who exposed the lies of the mother and uncle of 8-year-old Joana Cipriano,who claimed she had been abducted. Thanks to Mr Amaral, those two are now behind bars for 16 and 20 years respectively for the murder of Joana.

Mr Amaral and some of his detective colleagues have tried to bring us the truth about what really happened to Madeleine McCann. It is time the British media and press took an objective view of this man’s achievements.

Would all those who receive this e-mail please tell me how and when Mr Amaral is going to receive the public apology he deserves over this issue,

Yours sincerely

Tony Bennett
Secretary
The Madeleine Foundation
01279 635789 01279 635789 01279 635789 01279 635789
Mobile 07835 716537 07835 716537 07835 716537 07835 716537
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MOSSAD

daveza said:
Let's look at Israel:-
Has anyone ever challenged termination of service for refusing to take a polygraph test ?
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I wonder -- do Mossad insist on "Lie-Detector" tests

and

I wonder how you take THEM to court.

But to get back to the case at hand......


Anyone remember our OWN SA missing girls and the whole Joey Haarhof story ???

IF these young girls are to be used in Satanic rituals then they pretty much have very little time before their demise.

For the type of person invloved in this type of ritual the dispossing of a body is -- childs play ( sorry for the horrible pun )

Many of those missing SA girls have NEVER been found.

( and strangely enough -- in this case perhaps BOTH parties are guilty )


MW
 
i read earlier about the agreement between the parents where they agreed to check on the children whilst they were out eating but i cannot find that info.

where can i find it?
 
Her parents reported to the police that they had taken Madeleine to their holiday apartment at 18:00 Western European Summer Time, to prepare Madeleine and her two-year-old twin siblings for bed.[14] Then they left at 20:30, leaving the apartment unlocked, to dine with friends approximately 130 yards (120 metres) away at a tapas bar within the Mark Warner Ocean Summer Club.[1][15] The McCanns said that they were taking turns checking on their children.
 
thanks daveza, did the parents check their OWN kids at different intervals or did other parents check on EACH OTHERS kids too?
 
daveza said:
Food for thought yes, but still around a 10% failure rate.

I would presume that this figure is on a fresh scent, not 3 months old, and they are not able to detect whose cadaver they are detecting.

An ' odour ' was detected in the hire car, which by it's description has hundreds of users. Nowhere can I find a window of opportunity between the time the family left for dinner and the arrival of the investigators wherein the McCanns could have stuffed a body in the boot, driven it away and disposed of it so well that it was never found.
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There is no consensus in the Forensic community on the length of time Cadaver dogs can detect. Some have detected up to 20-30 years. Did you read my earlier post those particular dogs in the Maddie case correctly picking up a scent in the storage facility which once held the body of a murder victim-evidence not admitted to court by the Judge on the behest of his defense team (later hired by the Mcanns!) but the murderer has since confessed to what the dogs already knew and signalled!

You should look at some of the more plausible theories on why the car was not utilised immediately;) There are plenty
 
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