WhatsApp vs Telegram - Features and security

sajunky said:
Onus to prove is on you or Whatsapp, as I don't trust them. They are lying scumbags, so unless they publish client source code to prove (as Telegram does), there is no discussion.

As for Telegram, all messages are encrypted, including normal chats. Secret chats have end to end encryption and client source code is provided for verification.
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see above I have proven from independent sources that All whatsapp chats are end to end encrypted and only Secret chats on Telegram are ENd to end

Onus is on you to back up your claims - you not trusting them is not valid - especially since you already mentioned it's racially motivated biased.

In the same way I beleive what Whatsapp say (as well as few independent sites) - you have not posted one ounce of evidence to prove that Their encryption on all chats are end to end and cannot be viewed (by tem) yes they are adamant they wil lnot and im sure they are trustworthy - but only so much as whatsapp is.

sajunky said:
TG had it long time. WA claim to have it now, but my WA client is not doing it...

BTW, there is a claim in the post #20913362 that Zuckerberg (meaning "a hill of sugar") is not a Jew. I tried to object it as a false statement, but posts had been deleted.
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Sigh never said he was or wasn't - just pointed out he covered a few
MickeyD said:
Yes, I don't care.
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Oy vey
 
isie said:
Their encryption on all chats are end to end and cannot be viewed (by tem) yes they are adamant they wil lnot and im sure they are trustworthy - but only so much as whatsapp is.
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If it were end to end encrypted people would not complain that Facebook can read it. Then you say, Facebook can read only 'metadata'. Then you corrected yourself saying they also can't read 'metadata'. A mess, and no source code.
 
isie said:
Soo get Signal they the most trustworthy :whistling:
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I tried Signal for awhile (aside: WhatsApp ended up using the same guys for its encryption), but the Signal Android app suddenly got very buggy. Had to uninstall it.

sajunky said:
Onus to prove is on you or Whatsapp, as I don't trust them. They are lying scumbags, so unless they publish client source code to prove (as Telegram does), there is no discussion.

As for Telegram, all messages are encrypted, including normal chats. Secret chats have end to end encryption and client source code is provided for verification.
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WhatsApp uses the Signal Protocol, developed by Open Whisper Systems.

Here's the source -- https://github.com/WhisperSystems

Here are the docs/specs -- https://signal.org/docs/

Moxie said:
WhatsApp has finished integrating the Signal Protocol into their app. End to end encryption for everyone by default: https://whispersystems.org/blog/whatsapp-complete/

-- Sauce: https://twitter.com/moxie/status/717375035946577922
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Of course, there is no guarantee that the source used for the protocol in WhatsApp will be exactly the same, but I trust Moxie Marlinspike, and by extension WhatsApp's encryption, more than I do Telegram's pseudo-openness.

While Telegram's open client is commendable (in theory anyone can write their own Telegram client), last I checked the server code and actual implementation of MTProto remains hidden.
 
Jan said:
Of course, there is no guarantee that the source used for the protocol in WhatsApp will be exactly the same, but I trust Moxie Marlinspike, and by extension WhatsApp's encryption, more than I do Telegram's pseudo-openness.

While Telegram's open client is commendable (in theory anyone can write their own Telegram client), last I checked the server code and actual implementation of MTProto remains hidden.
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Whatsapp say they use Signal encryption, but what is inside the app is completely unproven. Complains about Facebook lurking inside messages should give you a warning.

How you can call Telegram policy as "pseudo-openness" when full client source code is available?
 
sajunky said:
If it were end to end encrypted people would not complain that Facebook can read it. Then you say, Facebook can read only 'metadata'. Then you corrected yourself saying they also can't read 'metadata'. A mess, and no source code.
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Again you stand to be corrected - I never changed my stance on them viewing Metadata - you confusing me with another Forumite - and for once its no Izzy
 
The best reason to use Telegram is the fact that it's API is open source, which means that you are not obliged to use whatever Whatsapp wants you to use.

IMO the likes of MTN, Vodacom and CellC are missing out on a massive opportunity with Telegram. They have the resources to get a stripped down version of Telegram running on a feature phone. Telegram on something like a Nokia 3310 would be a competition killer.
 
isie said:
So far Telegram is only good for Groups Larger then 256 and when Whatsapp is down you get Telegram messages asking is whatsapp down for you as well :p
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I don't even like 10 people. The hell am I gonna do in a group of hundreds?
 
silkenphoenixx said:
This complaint about WhatsApp being linked to Facebook is really amazing to me, because the donkeys that hee-haw about Telegram haven't looked past their noses. They don't realise that Telegram was founded by this guy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pavel_Durov
whose other big thing is VKontakte, which is basically the Russian version of Facebook.

Personally? I trust Zuckerberg *slightly* more than I trust Durov. Granted that's not much.
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LOL.

Why don't you read what Durov has been through verses Cuckerberg. You could have bothered to read your own damn link

In 2011 he was involved in a standoff with a police team outside his home in St. Petersburg after the government demanded the removal of opposition politicians' pages after controversial parliamentary elections.[15][16] They left after about an hour.

In December 2013, Durov was pressured[vague] into selling his 12% of VK stock to Ivan Tavrin, the owner of the major Russian internet company Mail.ru,[5] who subsequently sold it to Mail.ru, giving it 52% majority ownership of VK. In 2014, Mail.ru bought all remaining shares became the sole owner of VK.[17][18]


On April 1, 2014, Durov submitted his resignation to the board; at first, due to the fact the company confirmed he had resigned, it was believed to be related to the Ukrainian crisis which started in February. However, Durov himself claimed it was an April Fool's Joke on April 3, 2014.[20]

On April 16, 2014, Durov publicly refused to hand over data of Ukrainian protesters to Russia's security agencies and block Alexei Navalny's page on VK.[3] Instead he posted the relevant orders on his own VK page claiming that the requests were unlawful.

On April 21, 2014, Durov was dismissed as CEO of VK. The company claimed it was acting on his letter of resignation a month earlier that he failed to recall.[3][23] Durov then claimed the company had been effectively taken over by Vladimir Putin's allies, suggesting his ouster was the result of both his refusal to hand over personal details of users to federal law enforcement and his refusal to hand over the personal details of people who were members of a VKontakte group dedicated to the Euromaidan protest movement.[23][24] Durov then left Russia and stated that he had "no plans to go back" and that "the country is incompatible with Internet business at the moment".[3]
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pavel_Durov

Let me know when Cuckerberg will get fired from Facebook for preventing the CIA from harvesting user data.
 
Ninja'd said:
I don't even like 10 people. The hell am I gonna do in a group of hundreds?
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Local Community group - In our case we have decent Admins that delete crap message forwards so keeps the clutter to a minimum.

konfab said:
LOL.

Why don't you read what Durov has been through verses Cuckerberg. You could have bothered to read your own damn link


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pavel_Durov

Let me know when Cuckerberg will get fired from Facebook for preventing the CIA from harvesting user data.
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I was reading up on Durov and I commend him for his stance on not releasing the data.
Except him leaving never really stop them from getting the information - so if the same happens to telegram and as i mentioned before the data on their servers may not be encrypted as they claim - he will get kicked of or leave in protest and wont realy make a difference to your data
 
sajunky said:
Whatsapp say they use Signal encryption, but what is inside the app is completely unproven. Complains about Facebook lurking inside messages should give you a warning.

How you can call Telegram policy as "pseudo-openness" when full client source code is available?
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Do you think WhatsApp also secretly (but legally, same like Windows 10) mines cryptocurrency?
 
Bryn said:
Nice to see MyBB giving Telegram some publicity. It's a real shame more people don't use it considering how much better it is than WhatsApp.



WhatsApp is a perfect comparison for Telegram. Exact same type of app and very similar design. Telegram is basically what WhatsApp could be if the developers gave a damn about innovating.



When I first installed Telegram I had 3 other contacts who used it. Now almost all my important friends and family are using Telegram and WhatsApp constitutes maybe 10% or less of my instant messaging. Telegram is a vastly superior platform and getting people to check it out is pretty easy.

Some of the features aren't so minor btw. Just the fact that it's cloud-based, can access a single account across all your devices (even on tablets without a sim card) and can automatically delete local copies of older media taking up space on your devices is a big deal. It's also extremely data efficient - the compression it uses is borderline magic.
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You must be good at marketing. Whenever I tell people about Telegram, they're like "Oh, cool" and then continue on Whatsapp.

I presume it's the same for most people.
 
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