Widow, son tortured, robbed on farm

[marine1]

i can say the same for you then - where is your paper degree on genocide?

read this:



now read this definition of Genocide:



now what is "systematic" about leaving loose ends and not killing people, demanding money, attacking black farm workers along with the white farmers? if anythign these are just racists and derranged people attacking weak targets. now prove to me why it is genocide, prove to me the motivation to kill of white people without conspiracies and i'll pay more attention.

Are you freaking kidding me? I am not arguing with legal experts you are !!
I do not have any qualifications on this matter so I cannot and will not argue with Genocide Watch, the question should be, where are your so called qualifications? Right didnt think you had any
Again, are you freaking kidding me? Systematic? Have you been living in a cave for the last few years?
All these attacks are very similar, hate based attacks at WHITE farmers. Not killing people? If you dont want to face the facts, then that is your problem. How many brutal murders of farmers in the last 20 years?

Maybe go and do some research about farm attacks, ok?

 

[STS]

Are you freaking kidding me? I am not arguing with legal experts you are !!
I do not have any qualifications on this matter so I cannot and will not argue with Genocide Watch, the question should be, where are your so called qualifications? Right didnt think you had any
Again, are you freaking kidding me? Systematic? Have you been living in a cave for the last few years?
All these attacks are very similar, hate based attacks at WHITE farmers. Not killing people? If you dont want to face the facts, then that is your problem. How many brutal murders of farmers in the last 20 years?

Maybe go and do some research about farm attacks, ok?

i know all about farm attacks. i dropped by my local police station one day and say all the unidentified bodies they had on the wall and you know what? all brutal, heads bashed in, heads sawed off, and you know what else? not one white person. more than 20 dead black people all brutally murdered, and that opened up my eyes.

similar as in WHITE and ATTACKED? wow, those IS a clue! hey, i think there is a secret conspiracy against black people too, because they're BLACK and ATTACKED. it might not fall under genocide sadly, apparently it's only worth mentioning the deaths of people if they're a different race group, so let's pretend all these black people aren't being murdered then.

the next thing you're going to tell me it's war when a few people from a country sneak across the border to kill people there in their free time. you'll slurp up what genocide watch has to say yet you have a house, you have internet, you have a job, you have a car(which is already more than 70% of south africa) and now you're a victim!?! wow, this must be the worst genocide ever!

i think we better run for our lives

 

[Fudzy]

What is GenocideWatch's report based on wrt the South African farm murders? I hope they're not using censorbugbear.

 

[S7wede]

Black on Black crime is a type of genocide. Only in Africa it would never be classified as such. Here we call them tribal wars. Zulu - Xhosa, Hutu - Tutsi etc etc. It's no less barbaric and is something this continent needs to work out of its system. In South Africa however, we have a joined Black right wing element (If criminals that target white people aren't right wing I don't know who is anymore) that targets white farmers and not only kills the bread makers (see white males), but tortures the children and rape that woman. It's a campaign of fear that will only destroy what is left of our dilapidated agricultural sector.

What is GenocideWatch's report based on wrt the South African farm murders? I hope they're not using censorbugbear.

As far as I can tell, they use only credible news reports from major publications. This would be an accurate number because most if not all farm attacks reported in the media is verified.

 

[STS]

Black on Black crime is a type of genocide. Only in Africa it would never be classified as such. Here we call them tribal wars. Zulu - Xhosa, Hutu - Tutsi etc etc. It's no less barbaric and is something this continent needs to work out of its system. In South Africa however, we have a joined Black right wing element (If criminals that target white people aren't right wing I don't know who is anymore) that targets white farmers and not only kills the bread makers (see white males), but tortures the children and rape that woman. It's a campaign of fear that will only destroy what is left of our dilapidated agricultural sector.

i narrow this down to savagery though than any real system - in some instances the people that attack these farmers are linked to other crimes too like rape, breaking and entering, hijackings, etc. i'd understand if they do this out of the blue, but these are already bad people who are doing this. i also feel liek the government doesn't make this a priority, but at the same time i hang my head in shame at how far many people take it

 

[R13...]

R13 while I admit that some people do take this "genocide" a tad too far, you cannot for the life of you condemn the fear that the ANC and specifically the likes of the ANCYL inspires in a white minority group. You either have to have such white guilt that you are blind to the systematic attacks and unnecessary violence that goes hand in hand with farm attacks and land invasion.

I have said in the past that I believe farmers have a right not to have an idiot sing 'kill the farmer' whether he means it metaphorically or not. It is just not right to have someone sing that 'you ought to be killed'. I took a principled stance against the idea that a court might ban it and therefore set the wrong precedent on our history.

However, the racists have misconstrued all my stances on these issues to mean I am a card carrying member of the ANC or that I condone the likes of Malema.Quite the contrary as I said to marine1, him & his merry men & women would do well to join the Malema camp to take turns spouting racist nonsense and singing kum ba ya.

 

[Fudzy]

Black on Black crime is a type of genocide. Only in Africa it would never be classified as such. Here we call them tribal wars. Zulu - Xhosa, Hutu - Tutsi etc etc. It's no less barbaric and is something this continent needs to work out of its system. In South Africa however, we have a joined Black right wing element (If criminals that target white people aren't right wing I don't know who is anymore) that targets white farmers and not only kills the bread makers (see white males), but tortures the children and rape that woman. It's a campaign of fear that will only destroy what is left of our dilapidated agricultural sector.

You have to be pretty angry whether it through indoctrination or experience to do these types of crimes. It seems quite a few of them are committed by employees, you have to wonder what drives these guys to do it. Don't say Malema singing Shoot the boer because it's been happening a long time before that debacle.

 

[S7wede]

Of course it's savagery, but isn't savagery itself a system of hate and intolerance? "I don't like those people because they have more than me, hence I will kill them and take what they have." Now when you have major unemployment, service delivery issues and whatnot and continue to blame it on Apartheid (White People), can you not see how the government fuels the far right wing of black society to act on there base emotions and even sanction this action with certain "struggle songs".

You have to be pretty angry whether it through indoctrination or experience to do these types of crimes. It seems quite a few of them are committed by employees, you have to wonder what drives these guys to do it. Don't say Malema singing Shoot the boer because it's been happening a long time before that debacle.

Show me one farm attack where it was done by a long standing employee. Not a gardener who has been there for under 5 years or so. Most of these farms have been going for the better part of 56 - 60 years and only now, are they being attacked. Surely you can put 2 and 2 together.

 

[Fudzy]

Of course it's savagery, but isn't savagery itself a system of hate and intolerance? "I don't like those people because they have more than me, hence I will kill them and take what they have." Now when you have major unemployment, service delivery issues and whatnot and continue to blame it on Apartheid (White People), can you not see how the government fuels the far right wing of black society to act on there base emotions and even sanction this action with certain "struggle songs".

Well there haven't been any cases of farms being hijacked, the lot seem to be more interested in guns (which farmers have plenty of unforunately, the more right, the bigger the arms cache it seems) and electronics. It's not like building hijacking that takes place in the cities.

 

[STS]

Of course it's savagery, but isn't savagery itself a system of hate and intolerance? "I don't like those people because they have more than me, hence I will kill them and take what they have." Now when you have major unemployment, service delivery issues and whatnot and continue to blame it on Apartheid (White People), can you not see how the government fuels the far right wing of black society to act on there base emotions and even sanction this action with certain "struggle songs".

of course they do, but i've seen black groups who feel that the ANC is too liberal for them and they are butt-buddies with white people. it's all about perspective. i've seen black groups on facebook hellbent on running white people out of the country, i've seen white groups hellbent on running black people out of the country, but it's all perspective

there is a sense of unity in sharing a hatred and distrust, i saw it growing up in my little town how nobody would trust a "k*****" and how the little kids said horrible things to my gardener and ran away, things like that eat at you

 

[S7wede]

Well there haven't been any cases of farms being hijacked, the lot seem to be more interested in guns (which farmers have plenty of unforunately, the more right, the bigger the arms cache it seems) and electronics. It's not like building hijacking that takes place in the cities.

That is because the majority of people have no interest in maintaining a farm because it's too much hard work with real profits only showing after the long term dedication. What they do see however is a populous that has worked hard and is easy pickings for large groups of thugs with major entitlement complexes. And of course the farmers are going to start and continue to have small arsenals in their homes. They are being attacked left right and center. Are you seriously telling me that you expect the number of farm attacks to go down if they didn't have some way to defend themselves?

of course they do, but i've seen black groups who feel that the ANC is too liberal for them and they are butt-buddies with white people. it's all about perspective. i've seen black groups on facebook hellbent on running white people out of the country, i've seen white groups hellbent on running black people out of the country, but it's all perspective

there is a sense of unity in sharing a hatred and distrust, i saw it growing up in my little town how nobody would trust a "k*****" and how the little kids said horrible things to my gardener and ran away, things like that eat at you

Of course growing up in that kind of environment will make you more sensitive to the issue, but so will growing up in an environment where everything is blamed on the white man. Lack of service delivery, it's whities fault. I know we have a black ward candidate, but he says it, so it must be true. It's this continued blame of Apartheid that fuels the youth to commit such atrocities.

 

[Fudzy]

And of course the farmers are going to start and continue to have small arsenals in their homes. They are being attacked left right and center. Are you seriously telling me that you expect the number of farm attacks to go down if they didn't have some way to defend themselves?

Well having enough guns to defend yourself and family are mandatory, it's just arms caches like they found at that AWB guys farm that has me wondering how many is too many?

 

[S7wede]

Right and you think that similar arms caches won't be found in a right wing Black organization? You cannot base your opinion on this matter if you keep referring to far right White individuals. Boer =/= Right wing Member. Our government should be doing everything in it's power to protect this minority group, but so far what have they done. Oh I know, they disbanded the private security force that had protected them for many years. They cut down on the number of firearms they had to protect themselves and they continue to use racist rhetoric when they gather on masse.

As for the subject on a armed populace, I shall leave you this quaint little quote from Terry Pratchetts Night Watch

There had been that Weapons Law, for a start. Weapons were
involved in so many crimes that, Swing (THE ANC) reasoned, reducing the number of weapons had to reduce the crime rate. Vimes wondered if he'd sat up in bed in the middle of the night and hugged himself when he'd dreamed that one up. Confiscate all weapons, and crime would go down. It made sense. It would have worked, too, if only there had been enough coppers - say, three per citizen. Amazingly, quite a few weapons were handed in. The flaw, though, was one that had somehow managed to escape Swing, and it was this: criminals don't obey the law. It's more or less a requirement for the job. They had no particular interest in making the streets safer for anyone except themselves. And they couldn't believe what was happening. It was like Hogswatch (Christmas) every day.

 

[Fudzy]

Right and you think that similar arms caches won't be found in a right wing Black organization? You cannot base your opinion on this matter if you keep referring to far right White individuals. Boer =/= Right wing Member. Our government should be doing everything in it's power to protect this minority group, but so far what have they done. Oh I know, they disbanded the private security force that had protected them for many years. They cut down on the number of firearms they had to protect themselves and they continue to use racist rhetoric when they gather on masse.

As for the subject on a armed populace, I shall leave you this quaint little quote from Terry Pratchetts Night Watch

Okay no need to get on a bandwagon trying to change the focus of this discussion , I'm just saying that in the majority of farm attacks, guns are stolen. And yes I know that Boer =/= Right wing. From an outsiders view though you could understand the confusion when looking at Terrblanche murder/trial/funeral

 

[S7wede]

What does Terrblanche have to do with this now? He was a right wing racist. He was killed brutally, and I'm not saying he of all people didn't deserve his fate. But most of these attacks are against normal white South African farmers who only want to be left alone and get on with the job of providing cheap and high quality agricultural products to all South Africans regardless of race.

 

[Fudzy]

What does Terrblanche have to do with this now?

Check this part:

From an outsiders view though you could understand the confusion when looking at Terrblanche murder/trial/funeral

 

[(@) (@) twister]

Right and you think that similar arms caches won't be found in a right wing Black organization? You cannot base your opinion on this matter if you keep referring to far right White individuals. Boer =/= Right wing Member. Our government should be doing everything in it's power to protect this minority group, but so far what have they done. Oh I know, they disbanded the private security force that had protected them for many years. They cut down on the number of firearms they had to protect themselves and they continue to use racist rhetoric when they gather on masse.

As for the subject on a armed populace, I shall leave you this quaint little quote from Terry Pratchetts Night Watch

Why you think it needs to be right wing blacks doing the killings?? Aren't left wing nuts cappable of doing the same. Stalin was left wing right :wtf:.
This perception that the right wing is worse than the left wing is stupid

 

[MegasXLR]

Why are they so brutal?

Ever heard of evolution?

 

[warchylde]

these are hate crimes, but people are seldom rational about this. all of a sudden it's genocide and the government is sponsoring these murders and teaching them how to kill, and when Mandela dies they're going to do it in full force - and these people haev to come back to reality. posting a news article where farmers are being tortured and murdered and saying "see?! see?!? black people/ANC are evil" is a pathetic argument, and in that way i fully support Cloudster and R13.

this is a hate crime, but we're isolating this to one incident now, how do we know thet haven't done this to black couples? how do we know they haven't raped black women and left their bodies lying in fields? but black people attack white people brutally, so they must be racist.

i'm equally disappointed at black people who think a white man shooting black people is racist, as peopel look at the scenario than the whole picture

Dude seriously - where have you heard of a black woman being burned with boiling water, continously beaten then raped? It's the severity and brutality of the attacks that are causing the people to classify it the way they have been. All South Africans are suffering under crimes (white, black and coloured alike) but the way these are acted out on the farming community sends a very clear message.

 

[Fudzy]

Dude seriously - where have you heard of a black woman being burned with boiling water, continously beaten then raped? It's the severity and brutality of the attacks that are causing the people to classify it the way they have been. All South Africans are suffering under crimes (white, black and coloured alike) but the way these are acted out on the farming community sends a very clear message.

Well if police statistics are to be even vaguely believed our reporting on crime in the press is extremely mininal and very biased given the demographics of the country. Have you ever read a Daily Sun newspaper? Or a community newspaper? Compare that to a major newspaper and see the difference in what stories get highlighted.