"Are we intoxicated by the whine"

[killadoob]

So we shouldn't bath or shower because we're just going to get dirty again - that's the argument you're using? Really!?

So because there are too many people who need help, you feel helping one would be worthless. Ridiculous...

Very poor analogy. Now if you bath/shower and as soon as you are done you are dirty then yes it would be a pointless exercise and you may as well not bother. Helping people is fine but i dunno i have become very bad and i look at beggers or someone who needs something and think you voted for the ANC? Maybe dj just maybe people need to help themselves sometimes. Hand outs are just adding to the problems. Not so sure why we must always pay because the people of this country cannot see the anc are corrupt. Yet we must feel sorry when the ANC is doing F all for them?

You know all these people who burns schools, trains etc are the very same people voting ANC. All these zims who have taken SA jobs have done so because the government allowed it, these unemployed people still vote anc.

 

[LancelotSA]

Very poor analogy. Now if you bath/shower and as soon as you are done you are dirty then yes it would be a pointless exercise and you may as well not bother. Helping people is fine but i dunno i have become very bad and i look at beggers or someone who needs something and think you voted for the ANC? Maybe dj just maybe people need to help themselves sometimes. Hand outs are just adding to the problems. Not so sure why we must always pay because the people of this country are cannot see the anc are corrupt. Yet we must feel sorry when the ANC is doing F all for them?

You know all these people who burns schools, trains etc are the very same people voting ANC. All these zims who have taken SA have done so because the government allowed, these unemployed people still vote anc.

I'm failing to see where anyone said anything about giving money to beggars at robots! We are not talking short cuts and false assistance here Killa.

I also find it extremely interesting that you are able to tell who someone voted for by their actions! This is the crap we hear on this forum all the time. Are you certain they did not vote IFP? Are you sure those unemployed people did not vote for the Congress of the People? Can you be sure they even voted? After all only 17mill odd people did!

These are the sort of statements that get up my nose and I am not even an ANC supporter.

 

[Nom Chompsky]

Just a quick point: I wonder how many White Zimbabweans said the exact same thing that Lance and DJ are saying. Positivity won't save the country. Good government (which no-one in SA will get in our lifetime due to the really stupid electorate we have in this country). It's like putting off the inevitable. Alan has two words to describe this kind of person: "useful idiot". Then again one must remember that Lance thinks there is a big distinction between "Shoot the boer" and "Kill the boer".

Put it this way: While will South Africa not become like Zimbabwe?

Our government is engaged in the art of kleptomania and there have been multiple murmurs about land reform...

 

[Jola]

So because there are too many people who need help, you feel helping one would be worthless. Ridiculous...

Well, I have a bilateral contract with a certain Mr Pravin Gordhan to assist needy people on my behalf - and I pay him serious cash to do this.

But he is in breach of contract, as the money and services do not get to the needy people, it seems to disappear somewhere along the way.

He also does not use the money efficiently for education, welfare, security or medical services, etc.

What do you suggest that I do, sue him for breach of contract ???

DJ, IMHO you are being a bit sanctimonius here !

 

[Jola]

I also find it extremely interesting that you are able to tell who someone voted for by their actions! This is the crap we hear on this forum all the time. Are you certain they did not vote IFP? Are you sure those unemployed people did not vote for the Congress of the People? Can you be sure they even voted? After all only 17mill odd people did!

These are the sort of statements that get up my nose and I am not even an ANC supporter.

What are you smoking, Lance, a huge majority voted for the ANC !!! Or can't you see through the smoke ?

 

[killadoob]

So we shouldn't bath or shower because we're just going to get dirty again - that's the argument you're using? Really!?

So because there are too many people who need help, you feel helping one would be worthless. Ridiculous...

Wait i recall you saying donating to charity is not good enough, now you are saying helping one person is enough? So dude i am lost. I donate to charity every month am i not doing enough or am i helping?

You need to make up your mind. I do not contribute a huge amount but it comes off my account every month and MAY be helping someone or someone may be helping themselves to a nice car and house from all the donations but you need to make up your mind if helping people is good or bad. people giving donations has to be considered helping, i mean surely?

Lance never looked at how many voted anc i suspect, he only looks at how many did not for some reason. Must be the positive side of him coming through again

 

[LancelotSA]

What are you smoking, Lance, a huge majority voted for the ANC !!! Or can't you see through the smoke ?

11,650,748 of the 17,680,729 voters to be precise or 65.90%. 23 million were registered to vote. Another 12 million people were eligible to vote but did not register or did not bother voting. That means that more people did not bother than the number that voted ANC!

Even without these figures, it still leads one to question how killa knows that all the beggars, people burning down schools (on this one we know he is wrong as you have to be 18 to vote and it is usually the students doing the burning. Although I no doubt realise the retort will be that "they" are usually 30 in matric!) and trains are all the ones who voted for the ANC. What does he assume when he sees a well spoken, educated black man who is a successful business man? Does he obviously assume he must have voted DA?

He obviously has no idea as to their allegiance, it just suits his argument to say they obviously voted ANC!

 

[Jola]

He obviously has no idea as to their allegiance, it just suits his argument to say they obviously voted ANC!

Stop playing silly buggers !!!

 

[LancelotSA]

Stop playing silly buggers !!!

Where am I playing silly buggers? Do the maths! The numbers are there for you to use. Just use them! More people voted for other parties or did not vote at all than voted for the ANC! Not the majority that you would like to assume!! Don't sit there confronted with the facts and then come back with this pathetic retort!

I'm was looking for the word to label Killa. I will refrain from saying racist but much the same way a racist would say "stupid **&*!s" when he hears about a crime that was committed before even knowing the race, he is accusing every perpetrator of vandalism and homeless person of being an ANC supporter. That is just plain dumb!

 

[Jola]

Where am I playing silly buggers? Do the maths! The numbers are there for you to use. Just use them! More people voted for other parties or did not vote at all than voted for the ANC! Not the majority that you would like to assume!! Don't sit there confronted with the facts and then come back with this pathetic retort!

I repeat, you do the math and stop playing silly buggers !

 

[LancelotSA]

Lance never looked at how many voted anc i suspect, he only looks at how many did not for some reason. Must be the positive side of him coming through again

Refer to post #107 and try again...

 

[LancelotSA]

I repeat, you do the math and stop playing silly buggers !

Ok, you are incapable so let me do it for you.

A population of over 49,000,000 in 2009.
23 million registered voters.
12 million more eligible to vote but did not register of vote.
11.6 million votes for the ANC.
6 million votes for other parties

So now the fun part, let's do the maths....

So 35 million people were eligible to vote and 11.6 million voted for the ANC. So in fact only 33% of those eligible to vote voted for the ANC. Not the majority in the slightest. Add to this the fact that not all those burning schools and begging are of voting age or eligible to vote (they could be foreigners!) and all of a sudden his assumption based on the majority voting for the ANC seems rather feeble!

But I don't doubt that you already realised this (well I sure as hell hope so!) but were just being argumentative. Again I think those arguing do not focus on the actual words being said. We were not discussing whether the ANC got a majority in the election, we are all aware they did, we were discussing whether it was accurate to assume someone committing vandalism or begging was an ANC supporter based on the majority. We can't!

 

[killadoob]

Lance you can label me racist, i am not racist at all. I could not less what colour or race a person is just that they are decent. I have become more and more angry with the blacks i will not lie. I get angry because i love this country and i am watching it melt down while the black population refuse to see the light . If that makes me racist so be it. Yes i am separating colours here because it valid to my argument.

Yes not all blacks voted anc but a whole F load did so that tells me the general population is not getting the message so if they do not care enough about each other to change why should i care about their problems? I care more about all the whites who are struggling because i know they are not supporting the party sucking the life out of this country. Again maybe that may seem racist but so be it.

Maybe this is the wrong way to look at things but black people can help themselves, they do not need the whites to sort out their problems they voted in a government for a reason didn't they?

Lance the simple fact of the matter is the majority of people who could vote, voted for the anc. I would love see of those 6 million non anc votes how many were black votes. A very small % i would imagine.

12 million more eligible to vote but did not register of vote, are you suggesting those 12 million are non anc supporters?

 

[Gawain]

tea can do it ..... fix everything


or maybe MJ - we are the world

 

[Zenbaas]

Lance you can label me racist, i am not racist at all. I could not less what colour or race a person is just that they are decent. I have become more and more angry with the blacks i will not lie. I get angry because i love this country and i am watching it melt down while the black population refuse to see the light . If that makes me racist so be it. Yes i am separating colours here because it valid to my argument.

Yes not all blacks voted anc but a whole F load did so that tells me the general population is not getting the message so if they do not care enough about each other to change why should i care about their problems? I care more about all the whites who are struggling because i know they are not supporting the party sucking the life out of this country. Again maybe that may seem racist but so be it.

Maybe this is the wrong way to look at things but black people can help themselves, they do not need the whites to sort out their problems they voted in a government for a reason didn't they?

Lance the simple fact of the matter is the majority of people who could vote, voted for the anc.

12 million more eligible to vote but did not register of vote, are you suggesting those 12 million are non anc supporters?

Yeah, a lot of the anc supporters unhappy with the anc said that they simply would not vote in the last election. Voting for another party is not even something that crosses their revolving hamster wheels

 

[marine1]

Yes, many of you know my story. My sister was gang-raped and committed suicide because of it. Doesn't mean I hate my country. I hate the fsckers who did it to her though (the individuals, not the race)...

WTF????
So sorry man

 

[undesign]

23 million registered voters.
12 million more eligible to vote but did not register of vote.
11.6 million votes for the ANC.
6 million votes for other parties

I don't think it is a stretch of the imagination to assume that at least 65.9% of the people that could vote, but didn't are in fact ANC supporters. In fact, there is much more incentive to vote if you don't support the ANC (as the by far majority party). So in fact I would hazard a guess that the non-voting % of ANC supporters is more than 65.9%.

EDIT/ and a withheld vote because of dissatisfaction with the ANC is an ANC vote

 

[marine1]

I feel the biggest thing that is worrying me is that I am seeing myself agreeing more and more with Killadoob

 

[killadoob]

I feel the biggest thing that is worrying me is that I am seeing myself agreeing more and more with Killadoob

Hahaha

You must know the situation is bad then

Ya zen dude that was shocking dude, mentality is not something you can teach.

 

[LancelotSA]

Lance you can label me racist

Again we have the issue with being unable to read what is said. I specifically said I will refrain from saying racist as you are not judging based on race but rather the party someone votes for so we need a word for that. In fact you do the reverse. You see someone homeless or committing vandalism and you make the assumption that they are probably ANC supporters. Not sure what word to use for someone like that. That's like saying every white man riding a horse is an AWB supporter! Someone picking their nose must be a DA supporter.

I have become more and more angry with the blacks i will not lie. I get angry because i love this country and i am watching it melt down while the black population refuse to see the light . If that makes me racist so be it. Yes i am separating colours here because it valid to my argument.

Well yes, it does. That is the definition of racism! Are all black people "refusing to see the light"? I think you'll find the answer is no although we need to question what the light is. To them the fact that they have more freedom than they ever had would probably be a light. The fact that they are actually getting promised services and housing, rather than never even being able to dream of this before, would appear to be a light. Being able to get jobs you were excluded from getting before would be a light. I think we need to turn the tables some time and realise that what you regard as a light is not what others do!

Yes not all blacks voted anc but a whole F load did so that tells me the general population is not getting the message so if they do not care enough about each other to change why should i care about their problems? I care more about all the whites who are struggling because i know they are not supporting the party sucking the life out of this country. Again maybe that may seem racist but so be it.

The great thing is that you realise what you are saying is racist yet you make claims that you are not racist As pointed out by myself earlier your argument is shockingly flawed when it comes to breaking it down along racial lines! Only 33% of those eligible to vote voted ANC! Yes, perhaps the others had the intention of doing so but never got around to it but that is all speculation. Perhaps before you judge someone then you need to ask what party they voted for. Perhaps some of those white people you hold in such high esteem voted ANC. Improbably you may well say but I am sure I've seen a few white ANC politicians... are they in your good books then when you see them on the street because they are white and you assume they are anti ANC?

Maybe this is the wrong way to look at things but black people can help themselves, they do not need the whites to sort out their problems they voted in a government for a reason didn't they?

Again, I never, and I can't recall DJ either, mentioned anything about black or white. We merely stated get involved. It might be white people in need of volunteer assistance or it may be black. We did not once say "help some poor needy black people". This is where the racism thing comes into it again....

Lance the simple fact of the matter is the majority of people who could vote, voted for the anc.

NO THEY DID NOT!! Simple maths, Killa, simple maths. Yes, the majority who DID vote voted ANC but not the majority of those eligible to vote!! Geez, how many times do we need to say this before it sinks in!!

12 million more eligible to vote but did not register of vote, are you suggesting those 12 million are non anc supporters?

I am not the one making assumptions here, you are. I know of many white people who said they could not be bothered voting. Were they going to vote ANC? All speculation.