Article: DA apologises for fake ANC pamphlets

wait so you are a recent convert to the cult of bipartyship?

figures where the zeolotry comes from - a true adherent to can't beat it join it mentality.

speaking of the UDM - you do know the amount of money and energy the DA put into ensuring that it couldn't gain traction as a thorn in the "united opposition to the ANC under the DA" dream

this gaffe filled BEE campaign is similarly primarily focused at the FF+

the sooner the electorate realizes the power of a vote with conscience the sooner the elected will be compelled to rule with conscience.
 
Paul Hjul said:
wait so you are a recent convert to the cult of bipartyship?

figures where the zeolotry comes from - a true adherent to can't beat it join it mentality.
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Just wow. Cant believe your views are so extreme. These type of comments sad.

And even though you are being intentionally dishonest about how you represent my character, I dont have absolute brand loyaltly. As I have shown many times in this forum my views change based on the balance of evidence. If the DA ever turned into the ANC, me and many of the DA would leave. But thats not even close to the case. But anyways, lets get back to you misrepresenting and dehumanizing DA supporters.
 
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STS said:
in politics, i think it's always better to pick the lesser evil. other evils will always be around :p
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In making an individual political decision I agree with you - take the least of the evils you find (and this is also based on what information you have at your disposal) provided you do so in good conscience
what I don't support is an organization wanting to bind you into surrendering that choice - something both the ANC and the DA love doing.
 
Paul Hjul said:
it depends on the election as to who I vote for
but yes I am in full favour of spoiling the ballot as a legitimate political expression. Moreover being vocal about not voting is less apathetic than voting for a party that thrives on apathy.
in the last general election I voted for COPE nationally and provincially and in the last Local Government election I voted ANC ward, DA local and district
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Why would you ever vote ANC? And how do you feel about voting COPE after the fact?
 
ghoti said:
Just wow. Cant believe your views are so extreme.
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nope my views are moderate - if you want extreme views speak to DA party horses, its an organization built on cynicism in extremities
another good place to find extreme views is among ANC party horses

and the sad thing is that many of those extreme views are shared - same misanthropic bull**** different rhetoric and banner.

The sad thing is that at least a third of the DA electorate vote DA begrudgingly and another third for reasons that should put the DA to shame; yet we have a culture of painting ANC electorate as stupid or opportunistic - which is really funny if one looks at the DAs recruitment and training systems.
 
Paul Hjul said:
nope my views are moderate
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No, theyre certainly not. Theyre extreme. You intentionally dehumanize and misrepresent people.

and its the point which DA bunnies refuse to understand.
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wait so you are a recent convert to the cult of bipartyship?

figures where the zeolotry comes from - a true adherent to can't beat it join it mentality.
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Are these the words of a mature moderate? Not in my world.
 
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OrbitalDawn said:
Why would you ever vote ANC? And how do you feel about voting COPE after the fact?
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The ANC ward candidate was more competent than the DA ward candidate who was going to win on swart gevaar thinking.
Pretty much the same as I felt when I cast the vote. I have a fair amount of regard for Lekota and am very strongly in favour of a second "Freedom Charter party" (a proper discussion of why this is really important for the long term prospects of the country is best had over a beer) but I fear that the parties ratio of opportunists at inception was too high and that the threat it posed to the ANC made it inevitable that a lot of resources would be diverted towards rendering it moot. COPE had (and has) great potential but its showing in Parliament has been attrocious - probably because only half of the people on the list should be there - but Lekota has actually done as much if not more for SA in Parliament than any individual DA MP in the national assembly. Curiously the DA are rather good in the NCOP - notwithstanding that bodies major limitations.
 
ghoti said:
No, theyre certainly not. Theyre extreme. You intentionally dehumanize and misrepresent people.
Are these the words of a mature moderate? Not in my world.
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No I intentionally show what people are and you are confusing views and expressions - something worth understanding if you want to enter into a bullring on political debate. You are welcome to allege that my chosen means of expression is immoderate and I would disagree it is positively polemical but the views themselves are squarely moderate. This is something that you are also deliberately not addressing - the DA party horses have extreme views which they tone down in expressing the views: newspeak as it were.
 
Paul Hjul said:
No I intentionally show what people are and you are confusing views and expressions - something worth understanding if you want to enter into a bullring on political debate.
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No, you are intentionally misrepresenting my character. :sick: Im well aware that people lie about other peoples characters in politics, but that doesnt mean I dont have to call them out for it. Which I will.

If the first sentence in your argument is an intentional misrepresentation of someone's character (just cause he has a different view to you), why should someone believe what else you are saying? How do we know you are not going to misrepresent that like you do someone's character? :confused:

If you do have valid points, you often kill them yourself.

I have not called you a single name in this thread. Im not saying Im an angel as I also fall into that trap, but compare that to how you have gone after my personality. I normally only come under these type of character assassinations when I discuss religion :/
 
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Paul Hjul said:
The ANC ward candidate was more competent than the DA ward candidate who was going to win on swart gevaar thinking.
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Was the ANC candidate actually competent or is he/she just the lesser evil because the DA candidate is a dingbat?

Paul Hjul said:
Pretty much the same as I felt when I cast the vote. I have a fair amount of regard for Lekota and am very strongly in favour of a second "Freedom Charter party" (a proper discussion of why this is really important for the long term prospects of the country is best had over a beer) but I fear that the parties ratio of opportunists at inception was too high and that the threat it posed to the ANC made it inevitable that a lot of resources would be diverted towards rendering it moot. COPE had (and has) great potential but its showing in Parliament has been attrocious - probably because only half of the people on the list should be there
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Would you vote for them again? I think the party is fundamentally broken, because it launched on the wrong premise - disillusionment with the ANC.

Paul Hjul said:
Lekota has actually done as much if not more for SA in Parliament than any individual DA MP in the national assembly. Curiously the DA are rather good in the NCOP - notwithstanding that bodies major limitations.
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In what way? His actual participation in legislation? Because all we can see is his showboating. Which, while amusing, isn't really 'getting things done'.
 
the ANC candidate was actually competent (not exceptional but competent) the DA candidate a bit of a dingbat and inclusion as a ward councillor (rather than PR) on very faulty premises
I would rather spoil that vote for an incompetent at ward level

his actual participation in legislation is the same as any other MP not in cabinet, his taking the speaker on - and ultimately to court on sound grounds, his speeches have caused more ANC backbenchers to pause and he really really grates Blade and co.

I haven't made up my mind for the next election - leaning towards COPE or UDM provincial, Agang national but I might actually vote for the to be launched Libertarian Party nationally.
 
ghoti said:
No, you are intentionally misrepresenting my character. :sick: Im well aware that people lie about other peoples characters in politics, but that doesnt mean I dont have to call them out for it. Which I will.

If the first sentence in your argument is an intentional misrepresentation of someone's character (just cause he has a different view to you), why should someone believe what else you are saying? How do we know you are not going to misrepresent that like you do someone's character? :confused:

If you do have valid points, you often kill them yourself.

I have not called you a single name in this thread. Im not saying Im an angel as I also fall into that trap, but compare that to how you have gone after my personality. I normally only come under these type of character assassinations when I discuss religion :/
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All that I am showing is your character. Check the post history you commenced a character assassination on me at the slightest criticism of the DA. You've done the same thing to others on this forum.
 
Paul Hjul said:
All that I am showing is your character. Check the post history you commenced a character assassination on me at the slightest criticism of the DA. You've done the same thing to others on this forum.
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As I said, I am no angel. But to call me a fanatic is dishonest. In fact you called me many names in this thread. "DA Bunny", "Zealot", "Adherent". When none of them are true. Your dishonest implication of my character with those words is that I follow the DA blindly. I certainly do not. I often question them and my leaders. If something is wrong I question and do something about it. I base my judgement on the balance of empirical evidence. But yeah, your intentional use of those words was a character assassination to belittle anything I said. You are being intentionally misleading. Im really surprised you cant see or wont admit to that. Even when I get it wrong at least I am honest and fess up.

But I get you. Im guessing some of your libertarian views are rejected by the DA, so you feel personally rejected. I wish you were as critical of the ANC as you were of the DA. Good luck on your libertarian party. I imagine its going to be as successful as herding cats.
 
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Paul Hjul said:
All that I am showing is your character. Check the post history you commenced a character assassination on me at the slightest criticism of the DA. You've done the same thing to others on this forum.
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i've felt i raised a valid point in a previous thread and he blocked me before. it happens
 
They've apologized sure that's great. Now think about this, what would the ANC have done? Deny, blame shift, lie and blame shift then the evidence will suddenly disappear. Well done to DA for come out with it straight.
 
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